Andy Dalton

[nkufan23]

I would take Andy over Bradford, Smith, Flacco and before this year Freeman...I also don't think Russel Wilson is much better than Dalton he just adds the running element...Dalton has a case to be top 15 which isn't bad considering he was only a second rounder and this is only his second year...He has also had to deal with no consistent number 2 receiver Simpson, Binns, Sanu, Jones, Tate and Hwakins have all tried to fill the void opposite AJ but injuries and inconsistency have followed...Andy is very smart and with AJ and Gresham along with Jones and Sanu I think the future is really bright...Taking AJ in round one and getting a franchise QB in rounds 2 was one of the best drafts I've ever seen

[Voice of Reason]

I would take Andy over Bradford, Smith, Flacco and before this year Freeman...I also don't think Russel Wilson is much better than Dalton he just adds the running element...Dalton has a case to be top 15 which isn't bad considering he was only a second rounder and this is only his second year...He has also had to deal with no consistent number 2 receiver Simpson, Binns, Sanu, Jones, Tate and Hwakins have all tried to fill the void opposite AJ but injuries and inconsistency have followed...Andy is very smart and with AJ and Gresham along with Jones and Sanu I think the future is really bright...Taking AJ in round one and getting a franchise QB in rounds 2 was one of the best drafts I've ever seen

 

Especially considering everyone knew the Bengals had to draft a QB high in the draft.

[malachicrunch]

I'd take Dalton over Flacco or Bradford in a heartbeat. Probably over Cam or Alex Smith as well.

 

Maybe Stafford as well. 3 picks yesterday in a horrible loss.

[futurecoach]

I would take Alex Smith right now, but I think Dalton will have a better career resume. I would take Bradford and Newton without ever thinking about it and I am not a big fan of Newton at all. Hard to argue with what Flacco has done so I'd take him, but he isn't that good either. He's a dropped ball away from a SB appearance so I'd give him the nod easily over Dalton right now. Flacco, Smith and Dalton are all pretty much in the same grouping if I was ranking them.

 

So you would take Newton over Dalton even though he hasn't been able to win like Dalton? The Panthers have played the AFC West and NFC East this year just like the Bengals have. Their defense is arguably not as good as the AFC North and yet they have a worst record. He has two good runningbacks, a still very good WR in Steve Smith and two TE's. Yet now in two years in the NFL he still has yet to win as much as Dalton. While Dalton apparently plays with a bad Head Coach, and at best average OC in Gruden as you say, and an overrated defense as you talked about last year. So makes no sense how now two years in a row Dalton has won more games, and doing it while playing the same teams...

[futurecoach]

No, I'm saying to be very successful he needs a great head coach and a great defense. He isn't good enough to win games with his arm, he's good enough to be a game manager when he isn't making dumb throws.

 

Now I agree with this right now he is more of a game manager and that is fine in his second year in the NFL. Even while being a game manager he has put up top 10 stats this year and has them basically a win away from making the playoffs if they beat the Steelers this Sunday. So right now he is a winner without even having the things you said he needs according to what you have to say about the HC and defense. One would have to think he will get better with his decision making and accuracy, which would make him eventually more than just a game manager.

[SSC]

So you would take Newton over Dalton even though he hasn't been able to win like Dalton? The Panthers have played the AFC West and NFC East this year just like the Bengals have. Their defense is arguably not as good as the AFC North and yet they have a worst record. He has two good runningbacks, a still very good WR in Steve Smith and two TE's. Yet now in two years in the NFL he still has yet to win as much as Dalton. While Dalton apparently plays with a bad Head Coach, and at best average OC in Gruden as you say, and an overrated defense as you talked about last year. So makes no sense how now two years in a row Dalton has won more games, and doing it while playing the same teams...

 

Yes. One reason and one only is I think his ceiling is way up there and Dalton's is game manager and never a top 10 QB. If I had to win a game tomorrow it would be Dalton. If I had to have a guy for 3 years or more it's Cam in a heartbeat.

[SSC]

Now I agree with this right now he is more of a game manager and that is fine in his second year in the NFL. Even while being a game manager he has put up top 10 stats this year and has them basically a win away from making the playoffs if they beat the Steelers this Sunday. So right now he is a winner without even having the things you said he needs according to what you have to say about the HC and defense. One would have to think he will get better with his decision making and accuracy, which would make him eventually more than just a game manager.

 

You love throwing around top 10 in stats. Top 10 in what? You're stats? One stat that makes him look good? I'll go with 1 stat. Picks. He's top 10 in picks tied with CP who everyone around here hates. Espn has him 19th in their QBR rankings.

[futurecoach]

You love throwing around top 10 in stats. Top 10 in what? You're stats? One stat that makes him look good? I'll go with 1 stat. Picks. He's top 10 in picks tied with CP who everyone around here hates. Espn has him 19th in their QBR rankings.

 

My stats? I posted his stats in all the key areas for QB's like Touchdowns, yards, completion percentage, QB Rating and I even mentioned how he has struggled with interceptions. So nice try because unlike you I will even admit to areas a guy struggles in, instead of ignoring the areas a guy does well in like you do.

I even said he has to get better at interceptions, and as he keeps gaining experience the better you should think he will get at it. Even though you hate it, Dalton is better at this point than Brees was after 2 years. No one after 2 years would have thought Brees would end up a top 5 QB in the NFL. Dalton may never be as good as him, but he definitely has the potentional to be a consistent top 10 QB one day.

[futurecoach]

Yes. One reason and one only is I think his ceiling is way up there and Dalton's is game manager and never a top 10 QB. If I had to win a game tomorrow it would be Dalton. If I had to have a guy for 3 years or more it's Cam in a heartbeat.

 

Big Ben never had the looks of a top 10 QB after his first two years, he was just more of a game manager and they even won a Super Bowl basically despite of his play. His biggest play in his first two years was the tackle against the Colts after the fumble in the playoffs. Brees as I mentioned looked no where close to being a top 10 QB after two years, and in fact Brees was close to being done as a starter in the NFL after two years. I can't argue he is more of a game manager at this point in his career. Yet even being a game manager he is able to put up very good stats in key areas to help the team win games. He definitely has the ability to be a top 10 QB if he becomes more consistent. Newton definitely has potential but no clue if that will ever happen, especially since his leadership abilities seem to have shown this year to be flawed. Dalton has already shown to be better, and I know its hard for you to imagine that he can be better than a game manager since you let something people said about him before the draft effect your opinion on him before you even saw him play. However he has shown even those people that his arm is strong enough they have said do very well in the NFL. It just comes down to being more consistent.

[SSC]

Ben has a way better arm. Not even close.

[malachicrunch]

I'm more concerned about Dalton's lack of creativity than his arm strength. If option 1 and 2 are taken away it's either a sack or a throw away. No threat whatsoever to make a play with his legs.

[doubledeuce]

So you would take Newton over Dalton even though he hasn't been able to win like Dalton? The Panthers have played the AFC West and NFC East this year just like the Bengals have. Their defense is arguably not as good as the AFC North and yet they have a worst record. He has two good runningbacks, a still very good WR in Steve Smith and two TE's. Yet now in two years in the NFL he still has yet to win as much as Dalton. While Dalton apparently plays with a bad Head Coach, and at best average OC in Gruden as you say, and an overrated defense as you talked about last year. So makes no sense how now two years in a row Dalton has won more games, and doing it while playing the same teams...

 

Remember Newton was drafted number one for a reason....................the reason is because the Panthers were the worst team in the league.

[futurecoach]

Remember Newton was drafted number one for a reason....................the reason is because the Panthers were the worst team in the league.

 

Very True and even though they were the worst team in the league the year before they got him, they did put pieces around him on offense. Two backs who were two of the best backs in football before he came, two very good TE's and an older but still very good receiver in Steve Smith. So offensively he does have weapons, and that showed with how well he did last year. However you would like to see progress from year to year, and he has not shown that this year. Plus he has also shown that his leadership abilities is a big question mark which is not good for someone who is the QB on the team. Not to mention two rookies this year in Luck and RG3 went to teams who were not suppose to be good, and probably not even as much talent around them as Newton yet they have won. They have the talent and leadership abilities, Newton seems to be missing that so far.

 

It has only been two years though, and he does have all the tools. So he can end up being great if he puts it all together.

[futurecoach]

Ben has a way better arm. Not even close.

 

Never once said Ben's arms wasn't better? So not exactly sure what your getting at there....

 

You talk about how Dalton's arm is not good and he is a game manager and said he will never be a top 10 QB. Which I agreed with you that he is more of a game manager right now. However that does not mean that is all he ever will be. Big Ben didn't seem to be like more of a game manager too during his first few years, and relying on defense and a running game before he really took off. Then as mentioned Brees was doing so bad after this first two years, they drafted someone to take his place before he got it all together. Which he had all the same concerns as you have about Dalton. So its way to early to basically make a judgement of him like you do, basically saying he will always only be a game manager and never that good. So far two years in the NFL and two playoff appearances, and has shown he can make big plays at the end of games. So there is plenty of reason to think he will get better and more consistent as his career goes on.

[SSC]

I'm more concerned about Dalton's lack of creativity than his arm strength. If option 1 and 2 are taken away it's either a sack or a throw away. No threat whatsoever to make a play with his legs.

 

Most of the time guys who make a lot of plays with their legs are far more likely to get hurt. I'm fine with a QB that doesn't take that risk