While your point is well intentioned, how long have we been saying this? I think most rationale people know that those out there making a fool of themselves are a small faction, but it is also clear these governments are not as committed to thwart this type of behavior as we are in America. The only solution we have not tried is simply ignoring them and severing all ties. It is cold-blooded and we are leaving millions of people to be victimized, but are they doing much to help themselves? As I said, you can't help those who do not want to be helped.

 

 

But if we "leave," who fills the void? A new Russia? China? To simply pull out is a difficult option when you consider what is at stake.

While your point is well intentioned, how long have we been saying this? I think most rationale people know that those out there making a fool of themselves are a small faction, but it is also clear these governments are not as committed to thwart this type of behavior as we are in America. The only solution we have not tried is simply ignoring them and severing all ties. It is cold-blooded and we are leaving millions of people to be victimized, but are they doing much to help themselves? As I said, you can't help those who do not want to be helped.

 

 

Double Post

But if we "leave," who fills the void? A new Russia? China? To simply pull out is a difficult option when you consider what is at stake.

I agree with your position. However, what we are doing now is not working and it is not protecting the citizens of our country... the group we should be most worried about. Until we show we are serious about removing aid and other assistance, by actually doing it and forcing these governments to step up their game, we are just spinning in the mud.

I agree, the extremist won't be interested,. But did you see how young some of these protesters throwning rocks are as well? SAD!

Yes, very sad.

While your point is well intentioned, how long have we been saying this? I think most rationale people know that those out there making a fool of themselves are a small faction, but it is also clear these governments are not as committed to thwart this type of behavior as we are in America. The only solution we have not tried is simply ignoring them and severing all ties. It is cold-blooded and we are leaving millions of people to be victimized, but are they doing much to help themselves? As I said, you can't help those who do not want to be helped.

 

Almost all of these countries we are discussing have undergone revolution and are either in the tentative first steps of governance or transitioning toward it. It's hard to blame "government" in the abstract for failures in that regard when they hardly exist at this point and it's hard to blame the people for doing nothing about it when they've just revolted and are battling themselves for how to run their countries. A democratic government can be a messy thing, especially with societies where its tenets and respect for pluralism has been foreign, and that is something those societies are going to have to sort out themselves (and we are certainly encouraging their movement toward this). But to withdraw our support now is nothing but a boon to the radical Islamists and a blow to the liberals. It's messy and it won't be flawless, but if these countries transition toward democracy and pluralism over time it will be the most effective thing we can do to combat religious extremists and sow alliances with a troubled region. But, it's just not going to happen over night.

But if we "leave," who fills the void? A new Russia? China? To simply pull out is a difficult option when you consider what is at stake.

 

I hope Russia or China steps in and deals with these idiots, I for one am sick of dealing with them. Either eliminate them or ignore them. I vote eliminate but that's not very practical.

Almost all of these countries we are discussing have undergone revolution and are either in the tentative first steps of governance or transitioning toward it. It's hard to blame "government" in the abstract for failures in that regard when they hardly exist at this point and it's hard to blame the people for doing nothing about it when they've just revolted and are battling themselves for how to run their countries. A democratic government can be a messy thing, especially with societies where its tenets and respect for pluralism has been foreign, and that is something those societies are going to have to sort out themselves (and we are certainly encouraging their movement toward this). But to withdraw our support now is nothing but a boon to the radical Islamists and a blow to the liberals. It's messy and it won't be flawless, but if these countries transition toward democracy and pluralism over time it will be the most effective thing we can do to combat religious extremists and sow alliances with a troubled region. But, it's just not going to happen over night.

 

Not going to happen over night? It's been going on since the beginning of time. They are lunatics and that is never going to change. I completely get where you are coming from and I'm sure it's the right thing to do but there will never be peace in that region until the Lord returns. So if were are going to stay over there be prepared for instances like this forever.

German embassy has been set on fire in Sudan.

 

These are getting out of hand across the region.

Getting?

We are dealing with animals

delete.

Almost all of these countries we are discussing have undergone revolution and are either in the tentative first steps of governance or transitioning toward it. It's hard to blame "government" in the abstract for failures in that regard when they hardly exist at this point and it's hard to blame the people for doing nothing about it when they've just revolted and are battling themselves for how to run their countries. A democratic government can be a messy thing, especially with societies where its tenets and respect for pluralism has been foreign, and that is something those societies are going to have to sort out themselves (and we are certainly encouraging their movement toward this). But to withdraw our support now is nothing but a boon to the radical Islamists and a blow to the liberals. It's messy and it won't be flawless, but if these countries transition toward democracy and pluralism over time it will be the most effective thing we can do to combat religious extremists and sow alliances with a troubled region. But, it's just not going to happen over night.

 

You used a lot of big words, but I think I agree with you....so :thumb:

I hope Russia or China steps in and deals with these idiots, I for one am sick of dealing with them. Either eliminate them or ignore them. I vote eliminate but that's not very practical.

 

 

And how do you think that would play in our petroleum based Country?

And how do you think that would play in our petroleum based Country?

 

Not well.

Libya rescue squad ran into fierce, accurate ambush | Reuters

 

It appears there were other deaths in rescue mission.

 

WOW, that's just wild. Would be surprised if there's not a movie about that whole incident at some point. The middle east is certainly a hostile environment at this point, would not want to be there as a US citizen right now.