If you ask me, SORTA signed a service contract with the City to provide service, and it's their problem if they didn't anticipate and include the costs of any risks to maintain service during events and busy times downtown in that contract.

 

There you go again using logic. I keep telling you that's one thing not associated with this project.

If you ask me, SORTA signed a service contract with the City to provide service, and it's their problem if they didn't anticipate and include the costs of any risks to maintain service during events and busy times downtown in that contract.

 

I stand corrected. Apparently the contract between the city and SORTA establishes that the city will pay extra for added streetcar service due to events like Oktoberfest.

 

More streetcar service to operate for Oktoberfest Cincinnati: Metro Cincinnati

I think you could be right unless someone shows us that while the streetcare fares might not be covering operating costs it is somehow leading to more money being spent downtown.

 

The people that are riding it are already downtown. It's just moving them around more efficiently. They aren't coming because of the street car. Now if you got it to go over to Newport and back then you can make a convincing argument IMO. That's the long term solution that makes sense to me.

I stand corrected. Apparently the contract between the city and SORTA establishes that the city will pay extra for added streetcar service due to events like Oktoberfest.

 

More streetcar service to operate for Oktoberfest Cincinnati: Metro Cincinnati

 

They are already holding the city hostage and it hasn't even been a week. Of course, the city was stupid for not thinking that special events like this would need more than 2 cars running during the weekend. But it's Cincinnati so this really shouldn't surprise me.

Friend ate at Taste of Belgium in OTR on Tuesday night. Rode the streetcar down towards the Reds game. They said it took forever, so on the way back to their car in OTR, they decided to just walk and beat the Streetcar. Said, you're better off just simply jumping on the bus as they fly past the Streetcar with a stop every block.

 

Outside of safety, maybe...I just don't see the benefit.

As if it wasn't bad enough delivering to Findlay Mkt. its a nightmare now.

A Streetcar In NKY? Obstacles Ahead | Cincinnati.com

 

Streetcars aren't vampires. They can cross water.

But for the Cincinnati streetcar to cross the Ohio River into Northern Kentucky, supporters will have to overcome a series of technical and political hurdles far wider than the river.

A growing number of Northern Kentucky residents hope to soon figure out what they will need to do to bring the streetcar line to their neighborhoods.

The United States Department of Transportation last week rejected a grant application from the City of Newport. The $300,000 would have paid for a study to see what was needed to bring the streetcar to Northern Kentucky and what route it would take.

That hasn't discouraged streetcar boosters.

"It's not unusual to be denied the first time around," said Newport City Commissioner Beth Fennell. "We'll be getting back together to determine where we can go from here and whether there are other means to finance the study."

On opening day, 35 people from the Northern Kentucky Streetcar Committee rode the Cincinnati streetcar.

Committee member Steve Burke, from Fort Thomas, rode it on the second day of operation, taking the whole loop. He wants to be able to ride a streetcar back to Northern Kentucky someday soon.

"This isn't just fly-by-night or someone's fancy," Burke said. "People are going to get on board because I think they're going to see the success of the Cincinnati streetcar."

Three years ago, the Northern Kentucky Streetcar Committee was an informal group of people Newport resident Ian Budd helped gather. Now it numbers "a couple hundred" by Budd's estimation.

Budd thinks it could happen in as quickly as five years.

"It all depends on when funding comes available," Budd said. "A lot of the infrastructure is already in place."

Others, like Newport Commissioner Beth Fennell see it as a much longer project, possibly decades.

"This is a long-term, expensive transportation project," Fennell said. "You have to be in it for the long haul."

Here's why it might be difficult for the streetcar to come to Northern Kentucky:

Where's the money coming from?

It's not easy getting people to step forward to pay for an expensive transportation project. Supporters such as Budd estimate it could cost $60 million to extend the rail to Newport.

But without a study, the price tag and route remain speculative.

It cost $148 million to build 3.6 miles of track in downtown Cincinnati and buy streetcars.

But politics in Northern Kentucky can be even more conservative. Most of the money will likely have to come from federal sources, Budd said.

That's a tough sell in Kentucky where tea party-backed Republicans control purse strings. Northern Kentucky's member of Congress, Rep. Thomas Massie, R-Ky., doesn't seem inclined to fight for streetcar money.

In a statement to The Enquirer, he said other infrastructure needs are more important with the federal highway fund running a deficit. The Congressional Budget Office has predicted if nothing changes, the $1 billion deficit in the highway fund could grow to $108 billion by 2025.

"So the question becomes, do I support more deficit spending or would I vote to raise the gas tax for the streetcar?" Massie said in a statement. "And the answer to both of those is no."

Many in Northern Kentucky remain skeptical of any government spending. This is, after all, the region where tea party leaders put on the ballot a referendum to eliminate library funding.

There are better places to spend the money than streetcars, said Covington City Commissioner Steve Frank.

"They say you don't know how much more economic development might come because you've got a streetcar, "

 

Frank said. "Well guess what? Economic development is already happening without it. So I don't think it's a required thing to have growth. Frankly, OTR took off long before the streetcar."

Who's going to step up?

So if Northern Kentuckians want a streetcar, they'll have to find someone in charge to step up.

Based on recent responses, that doesn't seem likely right now.

In February, Budd, Fennell and a few other Northern Kentucky Streetcar Committee members visited Washington, D.C. to gauge support for the streetcar in Northern Kentucky. They met with representatives from the offices of Senators Mitch McConnell and Rand Paul. They met with Massie.

Both Budd and Fennell left feeling like they had support of the local delegation, event though no money was committed to the project.

But the response was less enthusiastic when the federal delegation was asked by The Enquirer.

McConnell's spokesman Robert Steurer replied with a terse e-mail that McConnell "has reached out to the Department of Transportation about the project." He didn't say whether McConnell supported or opposed the project.

Paul's office didn't respond.

Ask transportation leaders in both Ohio and Kentucky what would need to happen to bring the streetcar to Northern Kentucky, and they defer to politicians.

Or the need for future study.

"If there's true political will and interest by the counties, the next step is to do a real transit analysis to answer some big questions – look at alternative routes and evaluate the pros and cons and the cost," said Andrew Aiello, general manager of the Transit Authority.

Cincinnati Streetcar Executive John Deatrick referred all questions to Cincinnati spokesman Rocky Merz, who said in a statement "policy direction would be needed from the elected leadership to perform a study."

What bridge?

Once the political questions are answered, then the question becomes, how does the streetcar get across the river?

There are two bridges that could handle a streetcar, the Taylor Southgate Bridge between Newport and Cincinnati and the Clay Wade Bailey Bridge between Covington and Cincinnati.

Both bridges can handle streetcar traffic, but how much work would need to be done to put in tracks isn't known, said Nancy Wood, spokeswoman for the Kentucky Transportation Cabinet in Northern Kentucky.

These both are used for the Southbank Shuttle buses, which take people across the river between Newport and Covington. That's the second most used route operated by the Transit Authority of Northern Kentucky, with 500,000 riders annually, according to TANK statistics provided to The Enquirer.

The ramp in Cincinnati to the Taylor Southgate Bridge was built in 2000 during the Fort Washington Way construction to accommodate future rail tracks, according to a 2007 feasibility study for the Cincinnati streetcar. The City of Cincinnati's Merz confirmed this, though added that an additional study would be needed for "further modifications."

If built, it would cross the Fourth Street bridge into Covington and go back across the Clay Wade Bailey, according to some preliminary proposals by the Northern Kentucky Streetcar Committee.

Budd and other members of the committee believe Cincinnati did much of the heavy lifting overcoming the political hurdles. They still think it's a matter of time. They just need to get that study done, Budd said.

"I'm totally amazed at the support we're receiving," Budd said. "Opening day in Cincinnati, we had a large group out on the streetcar. They came from all over. There people from far out in rural Kentucky. They were really excited about it."

 

To me this is another waste of money idea to me. How many people will it actually serve versus the expenditure? Wouldn't it be cheaper to hire uber drivers for the people when they want to go across river?

To me this is another waste of money idea to me. How many people will it actually serve versus the expenditure? Wouldn't it be cheaper to hire uber drivers for the people when they want to go across river?

 

Not if it stays $2 for all day.

 

I could see myself using the streetcar if it came to Newport. It's current setup does nothing for me.

 

FWIW, I don't see it happening.

Not if it stays $2 for all day.

 

I could see myself using the streetcar if it came to Newport. It's current setup does nothing for me.

 

FWIW, I don't see it happening.

 

Isn't there already a shuttle that costs a buck to cross the drink. Why would there be a need to install rails and double the cost?

Hope NKY does not embarrass themselves and join in on the steertcar debacle.

Isn't there already a shuttle that costs a buck to cross the drink. Why would there be a need to install rails and double the cost?

Hope NKY does not embarrass themselves and join in on the steertcar debacle.

 

Yeah, not sure it would drop me off at the front steps of Rhinegeist like the street car does though haha!

 

I hope NKY doesn't either because I am not interested in paying extra in taxes for it.

Yeah, not sure it would drop me off at the front steps of Rhinegeist like the street car does though haha!

 

I hope NKY doesn't either because I am not interested in paying extra in taxes for it.

 

Why would you just not drive over from NKY? It is probably about an extra mile? Parking? Option of more bars without driving? Just curious.

Why would you just not drive over from NKY? It is probably about an extra mile? Parking? Option of more bars without driving? Just curious.

 

Parking at Rhinegeist sucks is one reason.

 

I like to grab a beer sometimes after vending a Reds/Bengals game that I work (especially the 4:10 Saturday Reds games). I park in Newport for free and walk the bridge to the stadiums. I could see myself jumping on the streetcar by the stadiums, riding it up to Rhinegeist, have a couple and ride it back to my car in Newport.

Parking at Rhinegeist sucks is one reason.

 

I like to grab a beer sometimes after vending a Reds/Bengals game that I work (especially the 4:10 Saturday Reds games). I park in Newport for free and walk the bridge to the stadiums. I could see myself jumping on the streetcar by the stadiums, riding it up to Rhinegeist, have a couple and ride it back to my car in Newport.

 

Gotcha!

Didn't know you snagged free parking in Newport. All the close stuff is pay to park by the Levy. I'm not a fan of parking that far North in Cincy but normally it costs a few bucks too.

Excluding the first 3 days when it was free the avg is slightly ahead of the 3,000/day projection.