Intentional Foul

As I previously stated "..an utter waste of my time"

Different thread, same old story. Instead of a puzzle, Scooter, I pose to you a question - Why would anyone want to respond to your inquiries? Talk about a futile proposition. If anyone disagrees with you, you reject their comments as hearsay, smokescreens, veiled shots, bias, prejudice, etc... You have even spoken out against fellow RH supporters for only giving their opinion (ie..”joined the lynch mob”), just because it does not support your own. The only way someone could answer your question is by bashing Coach Euton and explaining why she is not a good coach, or at least not good enough to win the COY. This is something I refuse to do in a public forum. I have too much respect for Coach Euton, her staff, RH fans, and the players to resort to this. And by the way, I never said that Euton wasn't justified in winning this Award. I also never said that Kidwell should win it. I just said that I can see why they, along with some other area coaches could be in the running for it. I could of course write to you in a PM explaining why a number of coaches including Coach A could be justified in winning the COY. But it would, of course, be an utter waste of my time. I would rather spend my time in more constructive matters. If you feel so strongly that your opinion (and it is an opinion no matter how many "facts" you have to back it up) is the correct one, you should be able to sleep very well at night. Who cares what everyone else thinks? Can we now stop beating this horse? It’s been dead for quite a few days now.

As I have stated in other threads I fully support the selection of Kidwell. I do think that this year it has been tough to come up with a clear concensus. I agree that Trimble, Brown (Morgan Cty), and Euton also could have been considered for this award. A coach that might have been overlooked by many was Bill Bradley at Ashland. Bradley may not be as flashy as some of the coaches in the region but the guy can coach. He's steadily improved the Kittens each year from 3 wins, to 8 wins, to 17 wins over the past three years AND with basically the same team...and all the players except one will still be only juniors or younger next season. Bradley's team beat regional contender Raceland this year, a much larger veteran Boyd team in districts, and senior laden West Carter team in regionals. Ashland did not pad their schedule this year to achieve the 17 wins either. Pretty good coaching job if you ask me.

I also believe that Morgan County's coach Jeff Brown did an admirable job this season. His team improved to 16-10. I believe that they have many of their key players back next year (including Eagle), so they will be a team to watch.

With the end of the basketball season comes many COY awards. With these COY awards come a lot of discussion about who should win them. My questions is...What qualities/abilities/talents make up a good coach? Is it just good Xs or Os, or is it something more?

Scooterbob, I usually enjoy the back and forth banter that posters involve themselves with on BGPs, but this has just become tiresome. I have honestly tried to explain my reasonings and what facts I have used to reach them. Obviously I have either done a poor job or expressing myself or you are just not willing to listen. Either way, this has become a futile exercise. You tell me that coach A deserves to win based on postseason success, I tell you that I look at post season success and several other factors (ie..preseason team expectations, player talent, etc...). You might say that I am dancing Scooter, but as they say "it takes two to tango" If so , you are one heck of a dance partner!!!!

Scooterbob, I have tried not to get into the specifics of why I believe certain coaches or players should or should not receive certain awards. Although I feel that my personal opinions are well supported by fact, my reasoning may be hurtful to certain coaches and players. I don’t feel that this is a useful purpose of a public forum. However, I feel I can elaborate on my position without producing hard feelings. Scooter, in selecting a COY, you place a very high weight to how far the coach’s team gets in the postseason. This is a legitimate argument. This fact should be taken into consideration. However, IMO, postseason success is only one factor in a much bigger equation. Now before I incur the wrath of RH fans throughout the tri state, let me say that I think that Coach Euton is a good coach, a very good person and treats the RH girls wonderfully. This is a huge part of coaching successful girls basketball and she should be commended. However, there is also an Xs and Os element that cannot be ignored. Two years ago, RH advanced to the finals of state with Queen, Terry, and K. Faulkner (3 legitimate all state candidates) and B. Faulkner, Spradlin, and Yates (3 very talented role players). IMO, even an average coach (and remember I said that Euton was a good coach) could have achieved this success with this team. This last year, RH had 2 Miss Basketball candidates and a player that many believe should have been an all-area selection. Throw in an excellent Xs and Os assistant coach and you have one heck of a team - a team that was ranked by one publication as being 3rd in the state preseason. My point is, I have seen some teams end with sub 500 records and felt their coaches deserved coach of the year. With little available talent, these teams overachieved, due in large part to a great coaching job. Some people may not agree with me. After I make my decision, I feel that I have personally solved the puzzle. Another person may believe that the puzzle is still largely unsolved. I have never stated that Euton should not receive COY, I have just said that it is not a given that she should receive it. Everyone has their own set of facts they follow in making their final decisions. Depending on a person’s viewpoint, several area coaches could be viable COY candidates, and I would support several of these selections

Scooter, over and over, I read about how your facts justify all your conclusions. You cite reasons why a certain coach or player should be awarded with certain awards. Hey, that's great-support you’re team-nothing wrong with that and it can even be admirable. However, to say that someone else's conclusions are utterly wrong, biased and without any factual backing goes over the line. Given the same set of facts, or more importantly adding facts to a specific scenario, can lead to different conclusions. In some cases, to say that one conclusion is more valid than another is narrow-minded thinking. We are all talking about SUBJECTIVE awards here where there are NO specific guidelines. The facts you present may be correct, but not enough support for some to agree with you. It is a personal choice. In your goodly number of comments, you seem to give credence only to those posters who agree with you. You summarily reject all other viewpoints. This leads me to believe that there may be bias in your own conclusion, thus damaging (in my opinion) the strength of your position. Bottom line – season awards are by their nature subjective. Just because your view of reality differs from another doesn’t mean you are right and they are wrong. In this type of voting, there are no absolutes, regardless of how strongly you feel about a subject.

Looks like goherd96 touched a nerve.....

Just to make it clear that I am not taking any shots (thinly veiled or otherwise) at any school, coach, or fans thereof, let me just plainly say that I agree with LRCW. I also feel that several area coaches could have won the COY, but that I do not disagree with the choice of Merle Kidwell. I have also heard that Queen won the POY award. If this is true, I also offer my congratulations to her for such a fine season. She is truly worthy of such an award.

No "personage" here. Just stating the facts. One preseason poll vs. another. Which should be less apt involve collusion? a) A poll of area coaches b) A poll of statewide coaches As they say....You say potato and I say potahto

What if Coach B's team was rated #3 preseason IN THE STATE. Does this change the solution to the puzzle?

Its hard for me to comment on the players selected since I have not seen the list. However, if I were to make my own list, I don't believe I would select Faulkner. Don't get me wrong, she is a very good player, but looking at the Daily Independent year end stats, she does not make the list for any statistical category (ie-scoring avg, assists, fg %, ft %, 3 pt shooting, etc...) I will be curious to see the list when it is put in the paper. Anyone know when this will be?

I've always thought Billman was one of the better refs of the 16th. I'd support him as assigning sec.

Another great comment IMO!!!!

All very good pointsthat I totally agree with. During the regular season, I think that girls teams are playing more aggressive man to man defense than in the past. Teams are not allowing girls to take the outside jumper anymore by just sitting back in a zone.

Here are my picks in rank order (for what its worth): 1) East Carter- good inside game, talented youth, good system 2) Rowan Co.- great pressure defense, 4 returning starters, Thomas returns? 3) Ashland- return 4 starters, good shooters, more inside presence in 2008 4) Morgan Co.- Eagle, team oriented, hungry, inside game is suspect 5) Russell- good tradition, can it continue without Okoro and Fortman? 6) Fleming Co.- very aggressive, will miss Keeley, getting adjusted to 16th region 7) Raceland- depends on Vanderhoof’s recovery 8) West Carter- mass senior exodus, Stevens and Cox must carry load 9) Lewis Co.- nucleus of team returns, very good guards, good home-court advantage. 10) Elliot Co.- must continue improving, majority of scoring returns 11) Boyd Co.- lose 4 seniors from sub .500 team. 12) Menifee Co.- Williams returns and must carry offense 13) Greenup Co.- Keeton faces uphill battle with Sexton and Gibson gone. 14) Fairview- showed improvement at the end of season but has long way to go. 15) Bath Co.- could be in for another rough season. 16) Rose Hill - how will Euton adjust to losing the big 3? I welcome ALL comments, both good and bad!!!!!

I can't believe that we are going around on this again - but I guess this is an open forum and any opinion or thread is valid. I look at it this way - its not a public or private school debate, its a question of what schools do things right and which don't. There are public schools as well as privates that don't follow the letter of the law regarding issues like recruiting. Of course the majority of all Kentucky schools play within the rules. Only the ADs of most schools know the real story of their school. Unfortunately, IMO the KHSAA makes it all too easy for any school to find loopholes, and thus the problem. RickyP, does your comment take into consideration the girls tourney who were well represented by the public school (sorry, couldn't resist playing devils advocate)?

There has been so much discussion about the inequities of the KABC voting for COY and POY, why don’t we just wait until the Daily Independent COY and POY are announced. For the DI awards, ONLY head coaches can vote. Lets face it, for the KABC awards everybody and their brother can vote – not just head coaches from the 16th region. Its almost a joke. In the KABC voting it seems there is some speculation that the head coaches have conspired against RH. If I were a betting man, I would wager that Queen WILL win the DI award and put this whole matter to rest. Some other things to consider regarding the integrity of 16th region coaches: 1)Terry won the Daily Independent POY last year (justified in my opinion due her season and post season stats) 2)Also I believe that Queen was voted by only the 16th region coaches to be the Daily Independent pre-season player of the year for this year. This was voted on in Sept or Oct I believe. If the 16th region coaches have a vendetta against RH (specifically Queen or Terry) why did they receive this past recognition. In response to the above post, didn’t Von Perry win the KABC award for COY a few years ago. I may be totally wrong about this, but I thought she won some kind of COY award a few years back. Can someone verify this for me?

Now that the girls season is over, I guess I'll be the one to ask the question-How will the 16 teams in the region be ranked next year?

I would also consider Marla Gearheart one of the best in the 16th. She tends to let the girls play without letting it get too rough, a very hard thing to manage. I have also never heard anyone accuse her of being biased in her officiating. I know I have never seen it. Gearheart definitely represented the 16th very well.

I believe that Emily Queen's play in the first round of the sate tourney can only help her chances to win Miss Basketball. Great players step up in big games. Emily Queen has proven this time after time throughout her career!

I don't think there is any doubt that Emily Queen should (and will) make the KY/Ind all-star game. She played extremely well in districts, region, and state. Miss Queen does is not negatively affected by pressure situations. I look for her to impress at the tryouts!

Sorry, you're right. The whole public vs. private school debate in general gets under my skin. Even a passing remark about it just seems to start new posts about it. In hindsight, my quick comment probably would have just added fuel to any possible fire.

Congrats to LCA. I was impressed with their athleticism and teamwork. IMO definitely the best team in the tourney.