After givinvg up three of their top 10 prospects, it tells me this is the one biggie they were looking to make over the winter. They went all in with Latos.

There are probably only 3 or 4 teams in baseball that would even consider trading a pitcher like Latos. It needed to be a team that doesn't think they can win next year who needs a lot of pieces to rebuild. It was a good match up between team interests.

It also gives the Padres the piece they need (Alonso) to trade another piece (Rizzo) to the Cubs for Garza. If the Cubs whiff on Fielder, I look for them to offer Garza to the Padres for Rizzo which opens the door full time for Alonso.

Not overuse from an innings point of view, the old Dusty argument. And Harang was not a young pitcher being overworked, which is what everyone wants to complain about with Dusty.

 

Not really. I think his management of a pitching staff in general is horrendous.

Not really. I think his management of a pitching staff in general is horrendous.

 

You are letting your pre-conceived notions blind you to his performance with the Reds. I felt the same way about Dusty when the reds hired him. However, he has done a great job with the Reds managing pitchers.

 

Let's focus on everyone's pet peeve ... overuse of young pitchers. How does Dusty do making sure pitchers don't go over their pitch counts?

You are letting your pre-conceived notions blind you to his performance with the Reds. I felt the same way about Dusty when the reds hired him. However, he has done a great job with the Reds managing pitchers.

 

Let's focus on everyone's pet peeve ... overuse of young pitchers. How does Dusty do making sure pitchers don't go over their pitch counts?

In Harang, he took the team's workhorse starting pitcher and put his health in jeopardy with an ill-conceived decision to use him in an extra-inning game in early May. All of that, as AVG pointed out, goes into handling of the pitching staff.

 

Not coincidentally, little or none of that kind of stuff has happened since Jocketty took over. If there has been a legitimate change in philosophy, I suspect it came from the top.

Can I tell you in 2 years?

In Harang, he took the team's workhorse starting pitcher and put his health in jeopardy with an ill-conceived decision to use him in an extra-inning game in early May. All of that, as AVG pointed out, goes into handling of the pitching staff.

 

Not coincidentally, little or none of that kind of stuff has happened since Jocketty took over. If there has been a legitimate change in philosophy, I suspect it came from the top.

 

Regardless of why it has happened, the fact is Dusty has done a good job handling pitchers outside of the odd game with Harang.

I always heard Jockety was known for making "The Move !" Lot of talk about lack of moves. I hope this was a McGwire type move...without the drugs

 

I like it !

Can I tell you in 2 years?

 

No, we need your answer now so we knew where you stood on the trade when July rolls around. Don't want anybody complaining either way on the trade in July if they can't tell us how they feel about it right now.

Regardless of why it has happened, the fact is Dusty has done a good job handling pitchers outside of the odd game with Harang.

It wasn't just an "odd game" ... it had long-lasting repercussions.

 

Cueto has flourished, but some of the other young Reds' pitching has struggled. It's why they didn't challenge for the playoffs last year and why they felt the need to go for Latos now.

Latos was 9-8 last year when he allowed 3 or fewer runs. Reds starts were 44-19.

I've been trying to decide whether I like the trade or not since I first heard about it yesterday. I think I finally decided I like the deal for the reds. Votto will be here for atleast 1.5 more years and alonso didn't have a place to play. Even though I think he would have had a great career at GABP he was tradeable. The reds are high on mesoraco. I haven't seen him much but there's no need for two catching prospects so close together, especially if they are so high on mesoraco. Volquez is just awful to watch pitch. I can't spell the other guy's name and I'm posting thos from a phone so I can't look it up. But he's a reliever so not a huge loss.

 

I think they still have some holes that need to be addressed but I also think more moves are coming. Walt just needed to know exactly who he was going to get and give up before other moves were made.

Let's be honest here. The Reds traded away two positions that are a dime a dozen when it comes to finding replacements. There are always good first basemen and serviceable catchers available to every team when they are needed. While I think Grandal will prove to be the best player of the bunch, it's not like the Reds traded away the next star shortstop or third basemen i.e. a position of need after 2012.

It wasn't just an "odd game" ... it had long-lasting repercussions.

 

Cueto has flourished, but some of the other young Reds' pitching has struggled. It's why they didn't challenge for the playoffs last year and why they felt the need to go for Latos now.

 

I am saying it was an odd game that led to Harang being in there.

 

I think if we look at stats over the time Dusty has been the manager in Cincinnati that the number of games where a starter has thrown more than 120 pitches are very few. If we look at 110+ pitch games, I would guess the Reds starters are on the low end in the league during Dusty's time as manager. The knock on Dusty is over working pitchers and it hasn't happened in Cincinnati.