March 3, 200719 yr No, but you're guilty by association. The at-large world doesn't know the difference between one UK fan and another. You're a big, faceless, evil entity. I can live with that. It's certainly not anything to change who your team is IMO.
March 3, 200719 yr Here is a question, Do people criticize Yankee fans when they claim Joe Torre needs to be fired when he is still going to the playoffs but isn't winning rings? How about when Red Sox fans do the same for not being competitive enough? Were Nebraska football fans criticized when they wanted and got their coach fired after a 10 win season a few years back? Were UNC fans unpatient with Daughtery and his poor record as coach of the Tar Heels? Are Celtic fans being ridiculous to be upset with their program's current situation? Were Notre Dame fans rash to get rid of Ty Willingham? Heck, Real Madrid fans have one of the best soccer team's ever and they are always near the top of their table and international tournaments, but if they are mad because they aren't winning everything should we criticize them? The fact is that when you are fan to an elite program, expectations ARE ridiculous. Im a sane human being. I understand the difference between unreasonable expectations and reasonable expectations. Yet, I still get mad when UK doesn't win every game, every championship, every recruit, heck every loose ball. I know they wont win every time, but am I wrong to expect them to always be near the top, always be competitive, always be king of that hill everyone is trying to climb? If I don't think they are at the level they should be at, should I not at least be frustrated just a bit? Am I insane to question the heart and desire of players if I think they aren't doing their best(cough A-rod? cough)? Should I not at least demand a little more from the coach of the team? He is the leader, the figure head, the Captain, the General, the whatever else. So why are Kentucky fans so much worse then all these other people I've listed? Why do fans of other teams here on BGP think that we somehow are the one's who truely define fanatical? Why can't we want better for our program? Understand, I'm not a Tubby Basher, I ACTUALLY LIKE THE GUY. Heck, there are few men in the world who can get so much out of some players. The team four years ago that was #1 a lot of the season truely was a team that I doubt would have been that good with ANY other coach. Tubby has had his highs. However, being an elite program(YES, Kentucky is an elite) the expectation isn't just to be good some of the time or occupy the title of Top Dawg every now and then. People expect that team to always be in that small group of teams you expect to be at the top. Yes the elite have Hiccups, but you expect that the next year that ship gets righted. So are we fools to expect so much and get mad if we fall short every now and then? Probably, but we aren't alone and crazy in having these insane expectations.
March 3, 200719 yr Oh, and about the race issue. IMHO Its wrong to hate anyone for the simple fact of color of skin. But it does exist and I have heard it said more then once about the Tub. However, with rose tinted glasses, I'd like to think, as most have said, that it is the minority, not the majority of UK fans who dislike Tubby and wanted him fired simply because he is Black.
March 3, 200719 yr "And when you're talking about ranked teams these days, you're usually not talking about Kentucky. The Wildcats have spent most of the past two seasons completely out of the polls. You can criticize UK fans all you want for having unreasonable expectations, but it's not unreasonable for them to expect better than that." 100% Agree THIS IS EXACTLY where all of the "Tbers, Tubby bashers, or UK loyalst stand." You have to maintain a certain level or prestiege. Squeaking in the top 25 here and there, back to back 10 loss seasons, is not UK basketball. It wasn't like that before Tubby was here, why is it like that now?
March 3, 200719 yr THIS IS EXACTLY where all of the "Tbers, Tubby bashers, or UK loyalst stand." You have to maintain a certain level or prestiege. Squeaking in the top 25 here and there, back to back 10 loss seasons, is not UK basketball. It wasn't like that before Tubby was here, why is it like that now? :thumb:
March 3, 200719 yr Here is a question, Do people criticize Yankee fans when they claim Joe Torre needs to be fired when he is still going to the playoffs but isn't winning rings? How about when Red Sox fans do the same for not being competitive enough? Were Nebraska football fans criticized when they wanted and got their coach fired after a 10 win season a few years back? Were UNC fans unpatient with Daughtery and his poor record as coach of the Tar Heels? Are Celtic fans being ridiculous to be upset with their program's current situation? Were Notre Dame fans rash to get rid of Ty Willingham? Heck, Real Madrid fans have one of the best soccer team's ever and they are always near the top of their table and international tournaments, but if they are mad because they aren't winning everything should we criticize them? The fact is that when you are fan to an elite program, expectations ARE ridiculous. Im a sane human being. I understand the difference between unreasonable expectations and reasonable expectations. Yet, I still get mad when UK doesn't win every game, every championship, every recruit, heck every loose ball. I know they wont win every time, but am I wrong to expect them to always be near the top, always be competitive, always be king of that hill everyone is trying to climb? If I don't think they are at the level they should be at, should I not at least be frustrated just a bit? Am I insane to question the heart and desire of players if I think they aren't doing their best(cough A-rod? cough)? Should I not at least demand a little more from the coach of the team? He is the leader, the figure head, the Captain, the General, the whatever else. So why are Kentucky fans so much worse then all these other people I've listed? Why do fans of other teams here on BGP think that we somehow are the one's who truely define fanatical? Why can't we want better for our program? Understand, I'm not a Tubby Basher, I ACTUALLY LIKE THE GUY. Heck, there are few men in the world who can get so much out of some players. The team four years ago that was #1 a lot of the season truely was a team that I doubt would have been that good with ANY other coach. Tubby has had his highs. However, being an elite program(YES, Kentucky is an elite) the expectation isn't just to be good some of the time or occupy the title of Top Dawg every now and then. People expect that team to always be in that small group of teams you expect to be at the top. Yes the elite have Hiccups, but you expect that the next year that ship gets righted. So are we fools to expect so much and get mad if we fall short every now and then? Probably, but we aren't alone and crazy in having these insane expectations. GREAT POST!!!!! The bold is true in my case too. I don't look at myself as a TBer and I do like Tubby. I understand I knitpick things to death in the "down" times, but some of the things, like recruiting, seem to be a major issue that needs addressed. Why wouldn't I question it? I have also said that Tubby signing PP and JL is a huge factor in whether I will support him again because IMO that's a step in getting back to elite. If KY can't sign those guys I don't see the program being a legit contender for some time. Even when I was a Tubby supporter I had issues with things he did. That's my right, my perogative if you will. The fact that the biggest concern (recruiting) seemed to take us down the last 2 years is something that bothers me and when Tubby announced changes and made none, I was not happy.
March 4, 200719 yr Heck, there are few men in the world who can get so much out of some players. Uh.. you really think so?
March 4, 200719 yr Uh.. you really think so? Tubby has had some success with several flying under the radar. He's missed on some, but not all 3 stars turn into Fitch, Daniels, and Hayes. He's had issues with recruiting "stars" outside of Bogans and Prince. A lot of players have played VERY HARD for Tubby over the years.
March 4, 200719 yr Here is a question, Do people criticize Yankee fans when they claim Joe Torre needs to be fired when he is still going to the playoffs but isn't winning rings? How about when Red Sox fans do the same for not being competitive enough? Were Nebraska football fans criticized when they wanted and got their coach fired after a 10 win season a few years back? Were UNC fans unpatient with Daughtery and his poor record as coach of the Tar Heels? Are Celtic fans being ridiculous to be upset with their program's current situation? Were Notre Dame fans rash to get rid of Ty Willingham? Heck, Real Madrid fans have one of the best soccer team's ever and they are always near the top of their table and international tournaments, but if they are mad because they aren't winning everything should we criticize them? The fact is that when you are fan to an elite program, expectations ARE ridiculous. Im a sane human being. I understand the difference between unreasonable expectations and reasonable expectations. Yet, I still get mad when UK doesn't win every game, every championship, every recruit, heck every loose ball. I know they wont win every time, but am I wrong to expect them to always be near the top, always be competitive, always be king of that hill everyone is trying to climb? If I don't think they are at the level they should be at, should I not at least be frustrated just a bit? Am I insane to question the heart and desire of players if I think they aren't doing their best(cough A-rod? cough)? Should I not at least demand a little more from the coach of the team? He is the leader, the figure head, the Captain, the General, the whatever else. So why are Kentucky fans so much worse then all these other people I've listed? Why do fans of other teams here on BGP think that we somehow are the one's who truely define fanatical? Why can't we want better for our program? Understand, I'm not a Tubby Basher, I ACTUALLY LIKE THE GUY. Heck, there are few men in the world who can get so much out of some players. The team four years ago that was #1 a lot of the season truely was a team that I doubt would have been that good with ANY other coach. Tubby has had his highs. However, being an elite program(YES, Kentucky is an elite) the expectation isn't just to be good some of the time or occupy the title of Top Dawg every now and then. People expect that team to always be in that small group of teams you expect to be at the top. Yes the elite have Hiccups, but you expect that the next year that ship gets righted. So are we fools to expect so much and get mad if we fall short every now and then? Probably, but we aren't alone and crazy in having these insane expectations. Nebraska fans did not want Solich gone, Nebraska hired a new AD and he wanted to see the football thrown more. They brought in a west coast offense guy and he regularly gets booed at the home games for throwing the ball. Nebraska football fans are alot like UK basketball fans. We refuse to accept average and underachieving teams. For the record Nebraska Football and UK Basketball are one in the same to me. I bleed red during FB season and blue during BB season. IMO firing Solich was a sad day in the storied Cornhusker tradition, I've been an avid Tubby supporter but seeing this program fall like this is heart breaking to me and unless things change, it will be a sad day in UK history to see the program fall any further.
March 4, 200719 yr Nebraska fans did not want Solich gone, Nebraska hired a new AD and he wanted to see the football thrown more. They brought in a west coast offense guy and he regularly gets booed at the home games for throwing the ball. Nebraska football fans are alot like UK basketball fans. We refuse to accept average and underachieving teams. For the record Nebraska Football and UK Basketball are one in the same to me. I bleed red during FB season and blue during BB season. IMO firing Solich was a sad day in the storied Cornhusker tradition, I've been an avid Tubby supporter but seeing this program fall like this is heart breaking to me and unless things change, it will be a sad day in UK history to see the program fall any further. You'd know better then me, I got the situation a bit mixed up. Still, like you said Cornhusker football-UK basketball have lots of similarities. Going to the midwest for college I have a lot of friends who cheer for Nebraska and we've agreed our fan bases are nuts.
March 4, 200719 yr 1989-90 Indiana 18 11 .621 1990-91 Indiana 29 5 .853 1991-92 Indiana 27 7 .794 1992-93 Indiana 31 4 .886 1993-94 Indiana 21 9 .700 1994-95 Indiana 19 12 .613 1995-96 Indiana 19 12 .613 1996-97 Indiana 22 11 .667 1997-98 Indiana 20 12 .625 1998-99 Indiana 23 11 .676 1999-2000 Indiana 20 9 .689 This is Bobby Knights last ten years at IU. I can't remember to many people calling for Knights Job because of his winning record his last ten years. Yeah Tubby and Knight are in the same category of coaching greatness.:thumb:
March 4, 200719 yr The best thing or UK is or Tubby's contact to be extended. Why - They will continue to fall and Race will be a non-issue.
March 5, 200719 yr However, TO BE CRYSTAL CLEAR, I'm neither saying nor implying that all UK fans upset with Tubby's record are racists. Far from it. His record deserves to be questioned...without a doubt. I'm simply saying that a portion of those anti-Tubby UK fans care nothing about his record...or to be more accurate, are only fueled moreso by his record. Mobaar, in case you missed this part of my post earlier. I'm 100% NOT saying everyone who is sick of Tubby coaching UK is a racist. I'm saying either the faction is larger than you (and others) are admitting or I have a knack for running into morons. I was blessed with an "encounter" with another such idiot on Saturday night at KJ's. For the 1,387th time, his record leaves him wide open to much deserved criticism. I'm not denying that for even a second. Many of those sick of the Tubby era have many good reasons to feel that way and are certainly hoping for a change for the "right" reasons. I've never disagreed with their right to hope for a change.
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.