1 hour ago, 12th Region Fan said:

Well this isn’t true.. Carson Fraley hasn’t played a summer ball game. He’s sitting on the bench in a knee brace, and people in the crowd say he won’t be released until September. 

Apologies then, I was told a young man was the Fraley kid plus I saw the mom(short blonde lady). I knew he didn't play when I saw them in Georgetown but was told Fraley was at the other 2(plus I saw her again at Collins--I thought that was his mother).  Apologies

I got to watch Wayne's first summer game against Somerset and their last game against Clinton.  In both of those games, they started 4 sophomores and 1 freshman with an 8th grader getting a lot of time off the bench.  Edwards is the lone starter left from last year's team.  Wayne also had a lot of players on the bench with some being brand new and some who have come back to the program. 

Wayne actually led Somerset by 2 about midway through the 2nd half before Somerset went on a nice run to win comfortably. Wayne seemed to be sort of lost most of the game and seemed to still be running to "old" offensive spots while trying to run a different offense than they are used to playing.  It also looked like some players hesitated to try to score...like they were looking for Phillips, Farmer or Dumphord so they could dump it off. The defense was also lost for most of that game as rotations were played with and almost every player (there weren't enough seats on the bench for all the players) played some minutes.

The last game of the summer was against Clinton.  I believe Wayne only played 7 or 8 varsity games this summer and some of the Clinton fans said that Clinton was 17-5 or something.  The big guy for Clinton was tough to handle and it was a pretty physical game but Wayne looked a LOT better than that 1st game at Somerset. They played pretty fast and hit several threes and showed a lot of fight.  I think Wayne ended up winning by 8-10.

Wayne has two players on the bench that are very intriguing. Both are football players and are raw.  One is very raw but he can take one power-step and dunk easily with both hands.  He can't do much else but he's never played basketball. The other kid is said to have a 40" vertical and was trying to rip the goal down during warm-ups but he hasn't played since middle school. He is going to be a junior.

I think Wayne will struggle this year against bigger teams.  All of Wayne's players are built the same, not especially tall but long and lanky.  They are really young.  But, they are playing with chip on their shoulder.  I'm told that a lot of them read the social media posts after Woods was fired saying that people hoped they lose every game this season.  Some of those posts came from locals that attended a lot of games. Also was told Woods was in rare form during the basketball banquet explaining that he was shutting down the Cardinal Club because nobody would be giving anymore.  The CC is a booster club but not like other booster clubs.  Woods said he doesn't like parent involvement because they think they can run the show so the CC was started to circumvent that.  His wife was president and daughter in law was secretary/treasurer.  He waited until after summer ball was over to turn those funds back over to the school.  Woods also kicked all the players off of Hudl and has yet to turn over the admin info to the school. None of the players can access their school games on Hudl.

There is also rumors of phone calls and the like in Wayne County and Pulaski County, but those are just rumors.  The Cardinal Club and Hudl are facts.  The kids, for the most part, feel like they are getting crapped on from both sides in this thing so who knows how this season will go for Wayne. I do think they will win some games they have no business winning this season.



 

46 minutes ago, Boyd_Blue said:

I got to watch Wayne's first summer game against Somerset and their last game against Clinton.  In both of those games, they started 4 sophomores and 1 freshman with an 8th grader getting a lot of time off the bench.  Edwards is the lone starter left from last year's team.  Wayne also had a lot of players on the bench with some being brand new and some who have come back to the program. 

Wayne actually led Somerset by 2 about midway through the 2nd half before Somerset went on a nice run to win comfortably. Wayne seemed to be sort of lost most of the game and seemed to still be running to "old" offensive spots while trying to run a different offense than they are used to playing.  It also looked like some players hesitated to try to score...like they were looking for Phillips, Farmer or Dumphord so they could dump it off. The defense was also lost for most of that game as rotations were played with and almost every player (there weren't enough seats on the bench for all the players) played some minutes.

The last game of the summer was against Clinton.  I believe Wayne only played 7 or 8 varsity games this summer and some of the Clinton fans said that Clinton was 17-5 or something.  The big guy for Clinton was tough to handle and it was a pretty physical game but Wayne looked a LOT better than that 1st game at Somerset. They played pretty fast and hit several threes and showed a lot of fight.  I think Wayne ended up winning by 8-10.

Wayne has two players on the bench that are very intriguing. Both are football players and are raw.  One is very raw but he can take one power-step and dunk easily with both hands.  He can't do much else but he's never played basketball. The other kid is said to have a 40" vertical and was trying to rip the goal down during warm-ups but he hasn't played since middle school. He is going to be a junior.

I think Wayne will struggle this year against bigger teams.  All of Wayne's players are built the same, not especially tall but long and lanky.  They are really young.  But, they are playing with chip on their shoulder.  I'm told that a lot of them read the social media posts after Woods was fired saying that people hoped they lose every game this season.  Some of those posts came from locals that attended a lot of games. Also was told Woods was in rare form during the basketball banquet explaining that he was shutting down the Cardinal Club because nobody would be giving anymore.  The CC is a booster club but not like other booster clubs.  Woods said he doesn't like parent involvement because they think they can run the show so the CC was started to circumvent that.  His wife was president and daughter in law was secretary/treasurer.  He waited until after summer ball was over to turn those funds back over to the school.  Woods also kicked all the players off of Hudl and has yet to turn over the admin info to the school. None of the players can access their school games on Hudl.

There is also rumors of phone calls and the like in Wayne County and Pulaski County, but those are just rumors.  The Cardinal Club and Hudl are facts.  The kids, for the most part, feel like they are getting crapped on from both sides in this thing so who knows how this season will go for Wayne. I do think they will win some games they have no business winning this season.



 

As I stated in my post, I figured there was young talent still in the system from the feeder program there. You aren’t a perineal top team in the region without a good feeder system. 
 

9 hours ago, Waterboy70 said:

I agree I think Mercer and Pulaski are the top at the moment although I have seen Pulaski play 3 times and they have zero quickness and guard play is a concern(yes Fraley played in 2 of those) but Southwest and West are pretty weak from what I saw. DCA and Rock are the next 2 after Merc and Pul. Huge drop off after that in my opinion.

I really think Southwest will surprise to the upside, and I think West will be top 5. I feel fairly confident in West being there, certainly by mid-season.

DCA is going to have to have some other players step up big in order to be top 5. I do agree that Rock may be there.

On 6/25/2024 at 10:32 AM, 24Rocks said:

I've seen the following teams this summer:

DCA            Lincoln             Mercer             Pulaski

Pulaski looks like an excellent team on paper but they were very underwhelming.  They just aren't very quick and even when Fraley comes back they'll still not be quick.  I was expecting a lot more after seeing them in the tournament as well as seeing the 2 new players from Wayne County.

Lincoln definitely benefits from Braden Fugate's addition to the team but they still struggled more than I expected.  They don't have much of an inside presence.

Mercer was also underwhelming.  Ellis is good but I don't think he's the best player in the region by any stretch.  He doesn't look like he's even in shape to play basketball.  

DCA was the biggest puzzle.  At times they looked really good and they were using the big guys to better advantage than they did last year.  They easily handled Taylor County, a team that beat Pulaski by 21.  However, at times they looked completely lost.  Too many turnovers, defensive lapses, poor shot selection.  It may be that once they learn the new coach's system they'll be a lot better or it might be that they'll struggle all year.  Some of the younger players that they'll be forced to depend on have improved.  The overall lack of good three point shooting will be a problem for them.

Ellis averaged a double double last year.  Name another returning 12th region player that put up these types of numbers last season.

5 hours ago, Joe LeDuc said:

Ellis averaged a double double last year.  Name another returning 12th region player that put up these types of numbers last season.

Ateny from DCA averaged one in limited games as well.  I would expect him to be a monster this season with a full off-season getting prepared.  I would speculate Dumford was close to averaging one as well.  

6 hours ago, Joe LeDuc said:

Ellis averaged a double double last year.  Name another returning 12th region player that put up these types of numbers last season.

Leek Ateny from DCA.  I’m not saying that Ellis is not a good player.  He is, but if I was building a team from all the players in the 12th and could pick any players I wanted he wouldn’t be my first choice.  Leek Ateny would.  He’s 6-10+ and mobile.  Plus, I was surprised that Ellis didn’t appear to be in very good shape in the summer games.

7 hours ago, 24Rocks said:

Leek Ateny from DCA.  I’m not saying that Ellis is not a good player.  He is, but if I was building a team from all the players in the 12th and could pick any players I wanted he wouldn’t be my first choice.  Leek Ateny would.  He’s 6-10+ and mobile.  Plus, I was surprised that Ellis didn’t appear to be in very good shape in the summer games.

What’s the obsession with what kind of condition a kid is in in June. I mean several of your posts from before you have talked about DCA fading at the end of the season. Maybe they should rest a little in June and then get back in shape for the season. One post you talked about DCA kids losing weight. Maybe you should be more concerned with that. The games I saw Ellis play in June he still put the ball in the basket at an efficient clip. Hard to argue with his physical conditioning in the region tournament last year as well. Aetny is a great  player and he is big and may end up being better than everyone but I really don’t see the reason to question a kids conditioning in the off-season to try and make a point he is better. 

24 minutes ago, BasketballFan24 said:

What’s the obsession with what kind of condition a kid is in in June. I mean several of your posts from before you have talked about DCA fading at the end of the season. Maybe they should rest a little in June and then get back in shape for the season. One post you talked about DCA kids losing weight. Maybe you should be more concerned with that. The games I saw Ellis play in June he still put the ball in the basket at an efficient clip. Hard to argue with his physical conditioning in the region tournament last year as well. Aetny is a great  player and he is big and may end up being better than everyone but I really don’t see the reason to question a kids conditioning in the off-season to try and make a point he is better. 

Let me clarify something.  I'm not "obsessed" with what kind of condition he's in.  I think he's a good player, which I said, but I don't think he's the best player in the region.  

I could have done a better job putting my thoughts down.  My comment about Ellis being out of shape wasn't trying to make the point that Ateny is better because of that.  I'm just surprised that one of the better players in the region would look like he's gained about 20 pounds since the regional tournament if he's taking his game seriously and is going to be the best player he can be as a senior.  

Finally, it seems like you pay a lot of attention to my comments regarding DCA.  I have to wonder why that is.  There seems to be a lot of hostility toward DCA because of the international kids.  Maybe you're in that boat.  If so, you're entitled to your opinion but if that's the case come out and say it.  

5 minutes ago, 24Rocks said:

Let me clarify something.  I'm not "obsessed" with what kind of condition he's in.  I think he's a good player, which I said, but I don't think he's the best player in the region.  

I could have done a better job putting my thoughts down.  My comment about Ellis being out of shape wasn't trying to make the point that Ateny is better because of that.  I'm just surprised that one of the better players in the region would look like he's gained about 20 pounds since the regional tournament if he's taking his game seriously and is going to be the best player he can be as a senior.  

Finally, it seems like you pay a lot of attention to my comments regarding DCA.  I have to wonder why that is.  There seems to be a lot of hostility toward DCA because of the international kids.  Maybe you're in that boat.  If so, you're entitled to your opinion but if that's the case come out and say it.  

I do read your posts as I do all the posts in the 12th region threads. I’m a fan of the 12th region. Just thought it was strange you made two comments about a kids physical condition while you had also talked about a team needing rest and losing weight. It’s summer time basketball season is 6 months away. The way teams play Ellis though I would think some extra weight would be beneficial to him. I will say this,  being a fan of the 12th and following it  think Ellis’ stats pretty well speak for themself over the last two years as the best player in the region. 
 

And I will add as well as a fan of the 12th region that Walker Craig, Kendal Phillips, Antajuan Dumphord, should all be mentioned as top players in the region. Craig is unreal to be able to shoot at 50% from three. Phillips is always in top 4-5 in scoring. Dumphord is an incredible athlete. I even read an article on Prep Hoops Ky that Steve said he thought Boyd might be the best basketball player on DCA. Ellis’ stats are better than all of them over the long haul. 

19 hours ago, BasketballFan24 said:

And I will add as well as a fan of the 12th region that Walker Craig, Kendal Phillips, Antajuan Dumphord, should all be mentioned as top players in the region. Craig is unreal to be able to shoot at 50% from three. Phillips is always in top 4-5 in scoring. Dumphord is an incredible athlete. I even read an article on Prep Hoops Ky that Steve said he thought Boyd might be the best basketball player on DCA. Ellis’ stats are better than all of them over the long haul. 

We can’t predict next year, but based on last year Ellis is the best returning player. I will say that I didn’t see Ellis this summer. BUT, hands down, he is the best returning player, and that isn’t really up for debate at this point. His offensive efficiency was ridiculous, with his PPG and FG %, along with his RPG. He also changed games with his rim protection, and he showed the ability to knock down the 3 as the year progressed. I do, however, think that Craig deserves to be in the conversation. He’s a great scorer and a very tough matchup in the 12th given his length as a perimeter player.

As far as Ateny, I think he can be top 3-5, perhaps even challenge Ellis & Craig. He has shown high potential. But I fully expect Ellis & Craig 2 to be the best 2 players in the region this year. And I expect Mercer to be a top 2 team.

I saw DCA and PC at Collins event. 

DCA: Boyd is the best player. And honestly it's not even close. He does it all for them ( ball handling, scoring, assisting, etc). Very impressed by his defensive effort. He is tenacious, and looks to guard best player. He is a top 3 player in the region in terms of what he does on both ends. Ateny has the highest celing, but plays weak and lazy. Feels like he turns it over about half of his touches. Also seems disinterested most of the time. But none the less will average double double on size and talent alone. Lu Ayiei is an elite shot blocker, but didn't show much otherwise. DCA doesn't have much beyond those three.

Pulaski: Looked like a team that will lack quickness, but will be typical Pulaski. Phillips looked ok, but as a Covid junior (and all the hype) I would've expeted him to be more dominant by now. Feel like he is a bit overrated, but still a nice player. They will beat tough to beat when Fraley gets healthy.

My top 5 players:

1. Ellis

2. Boyd

3. Craig

4. Ateny

5. Dumford

1 hour ago, jtb12882 said:

I saw DCA and PC at Collins event. 

DCA: Boyd is the best player. And honestly it's not even close. He does it all for them ( ball handling, scoring, assisting, etc). Very impressed by his defensive effort. He is tenacious, and looks to guard best player. He is a top 3 player in the region in terms of what he does on both ends. Ateny has the highest celing, but plays weak and lazy. Feels like he turns it over about half of his touches. Also seems disinterested most of the time. But none the less will average double double on size and talent alone. Lu Ayiei is an elite shot blocker, but didn't show much otherwise. DCA doesn't have much beyond those three.

Pulaski: Looked like a team that will lack quickness, but will be typical Pulaski. Phillips looked ok, but as a Covid junior (and all the hype) I would've expeted him to be more dominant by now. Feel like he is a bit overrated, but still a nice player. They will beat tough to beat when Fraley gets healthy.

My top 5 players:

1. Ellis

2. Boyd

3. Craig

4. Ateny

5. Dumford

I saw those Collins games too and can see why you'd think that.  I was making my assessment more on what I've seen Ateny do when he's focused than what I saw in those games.  It will definitely be dependent on whether the new coach can get him to play hard consistently.  I think that it takes awhile for the international kids to understand the intensity and physical nature of the game here in America.  Boyd is definitely a valuable player for DCA.  He's a tough kid and gives his all.  I was impressed by how much he stepped up his defense last year and improved his shot selection.  Two years ago it was not uncommon for him to launch a three from way behind the line but he cleaned that up this past year.  

I agree on Pulaski, they'll beat a lot of people but in a game where their opponent has speed and knows how to use it they might struggle.  Any team with quick guards on defense could be a problem for them.  They do have experience though and that will be to their advantage.  

Well, West Jessamine Guard Gavin Murphy has picked up his 3rd D1 offer. Seems to me that he's legit. Nobody else in the 12th Region has an D1 offer bedside his teammate.