So you didn't like the teams that won more games than any other team during the 03,04,05 seasons?

 

When I said that Tubby wasn't that good, my fingers got ahead of my brain. I realized later what I had put. I don't think he's great. But he's an ok coach. He did pretty good at Tulsa and Geogria. The only problem is, he had the same sucess at those schools as he's had at UK, with the exception of '98.

 

As far as them winning more games than any other team, I've said this MANY times. It's easy to win with the schedule that they have. I don't remember what year, but it was one of the 3 that you metioned, UK only played 1 ranked team OOC. How hard of a schedule is that? Any top 10 team's second 5 could probably have a similar record against UK's OOC. But they don't give titles for regular season wins. You realize that in two of those three seasons you mentioned, UK had second round losses in the tourney? I don't understand how Tubby supporters could be happy with that. But that's all I hear. "Tubby is a great coach and has UK as one of the best programs in the country." To me, that's bull. They're not even one of the best in the SEC anymore.

 

The original post by Adopted Admiral stated that Tubby could've won with the '97 team. I find that hard to believe. As I said, Tubby can't win with HIS players, so how could he say that they would've won the title that year with Pitino's players? It's ridiculous.

I hear alot of people who do not like Tubby as The UK Basketball coach claim that in 98 that Tubby won the championship with Pitinos Players! Which I guess he did,but in 97 Pitino couldn't win it with his own Players! It makes me think that if Pitino had quit after the 96 championship and Tubby could have coached Pitinos 97 Players,The cats may have won three in a Row!

 

I really don't think that Pitino would have won it at UK in '98 if he would have stayed. Tubby is a very good coach, his main problem is attracting big-time players who, for whatever reasons, do not seem attracted to UK as this time.

I really don't think Pitino would have won it in 98 with that team. At that time he coached only one style, and the best I can remember that team was only 7 deep. Rick wouldn't have been able to press the entire season and won the national title. Tubby's style better suited that team and that's why he was able to win it all.

And I keep saying it: Who had Ron Mercer? That sort of answers it for me. Rick lost with hiim in 97 and Tubby won without him in 98. Zona was a great team it was argued in 97 and Utah was maybe not as good in the 98 finals but LEST WE FORGET----Zona was not there because Utah beat the tar heel out of them by about 25 points a game or two before that. So Zona got beat by Utah and Ky beat Utah without Mercer. But who really knows? That is just my angle on it on just that game.

 

Also people talk like Tubby has never recruited good, but there has only been two years really when he didn't recruit good and that was this years senior and sophomore classes.

 

I know I still believe in Tubby, but if this year ends up like last year. Then I could see making a change, but it wouldn't be because Tubby is terrible like you all say, it would just because sometimes change is good and it could be best for both parties....But as I been saying, I really think this season will end up being a really special season, and alot of fans will be very happy in March...

:thumb: :thumb:

I have no clue why i posted that, i was just running through things in my head, it's off topic and i apalogize, i was just wondering what everyone else though of it. Rambler I'm like you I'm a college fan, I'd rather watch a college game anyday.

:thumb:

Right there IMO is why alot of people argue and stick up for Tubby. Because Tubby is a good coach unlike what you just said, actually he is one best coaches in the country..Now is the the best coach for UK? That is something that could be questioned. With everyone being so in love with Pitino and his fast pace style when he was here, and now Tubby coming in with his new style alot of people are just not going to like it. Not to mention anytime you follow a legend like Pitino was when he was here, then usually no matter what you do the fans just are not going to like you. So not only does he have the pressure at coaching at the best basketball program of all time, but also the pressure of following a legend. So no he is not a bad coach like some say, he is actually a great coach, but maybe this situation here is just not the best for either. If Smith was to leave, who ever the new coach would be wouldn't nave nearly as much pressure, and even if he does the same as Tubby he still wouldn't be hated as much as Tubby is, just because he is not following a legend....

 

Also people talk like Tubby has never recruited good, but there has only been two years really when he didn't recruit good and that was this years senior and sophomore classes. I blame the fact of the success of Daniels, Fitch, and Hawkins for the reason of these classes. Tubby was able to take those gusy who weren't that great coming out of high school and turned them into a team that was one of the best in the country. And well these players except for Perry, have just never gotten better and that is what is hurting the program right now more than anything...

 

I know I still believe in Tubby, but if this year ends up like last year. Then I could see making a change, but it wouldn't be because Tubby is terrible like you all say, it would just because sometimes change is good and it could be best for both parties....But as I been saying, I really think this season will end up being a really special season, and alot of fans will be very happy in March...

 

Those three players, especially Fitch and Daniels, prove that Tubby Smith is a very good coach. You had those two who bought into Tubby's system, and prospered because of it. Tubby Smith and his staff developed those players that were not highly recruited by anyone. Fitch is one of my favorite UK players of all time. His 9 point 13 rebound performance as a freshman guard @Michigan State his freshman year was great. Recruiting is such a hit and miss gamble and sometimes you go on a bad streak. (Anyone who has been to Vegas knows what I am talking about) I think that any coach in the future at UK will have a hard time with the fans. Even Pitino had his group of detractors. So many did not like the fact that he was from NY. And remember, only one coach at UK has won more championships at UK than Tubby, and that is Adolph Rupp. And in my opinion, Rupp never won, nor made it to the Final Four with his best player (Issel).

Everyone complaining about Tubby (myself at times included) needs to take a look at the Alabama football situation. Too much to put up with when it's possible to win a national championship elsewhere.

 

If and when Tubby is gone, it's going to be slim pickins'. Why would any coach want to put up with what Tubby does? And remember, keep Alabama football in mind when you answer that...

If Derek Anderson would have not got hurt, UK would have won 3 in a row.

If Nazr hits ONE Free Throw, they win 3 in a row. Come on 0 for 10.

Coker won a Championship in 2001 at the U and made it to another one after that, and still he ended up canned after one and a half dismal seasons. Not said anything in a while and hadn't planned on it, but it kills me to hear people still talk about something that has happened almost ten years ago. Like said, Miami cleaned house after two years of an un-Miami type season, and people complain that people complain about Tubby.

 

P.S. Pitino lost to a pretty incredible Arizona team in 97' (in OT). I find it laughable that people say Tubby could have done better.

 

 

But I'm just stating fact rather than opinion so I guess I'll go back into seculision from the Tubby Smith/Kentucky threads before someone unwisely questions my creditibility as a fan.

 

:thumb: I know the feeling man...

Boy there's a lot of stuff on here about '98 and '97 that I'm not sure if all that accurate.

 

1. In '97 Nazr Mohammad I think was 0-6 from the FT line, not 0-10.

 

2. Arizona peaked at the right time that year and had the perfect team to combat a tired and injury riddled UK. I thought UK showed guts getting it to OT when they could have folded up.

 

3. Anderson hit his only FT in the Final Four game against Minnesota if memory serves, not Arizona. He was brought in for a Technical shot.

 

4. Anderson was cleared by the doctors to play, it was Pitino's call to bench him. For the person who talked about Pitino going to the Celtics and wanting to draft DA, he wanted Tim Duncan. They had the odds going into the lottery and that's one of the reasons he took the job. But the ball didn't fall in his lap right and he missed out on one of the best big men of his era.

 

5. That '97 team was up and down with losses to Clemson (when DA missed FT's that could have won it but UK lost in OT) and 2 losses to South Carolina. (Including the Senior Night Game which was the first UK had dropped since like 1962.)

 

6. The '98 team was even more Cinderella because of their perplexing losses. They were thumped by Arizona in Hawaii that December. Lost at home to one of Crum's worst Louisville teams and to Florida and Ole Miss at Rupp. They caught fire at the right time.

 

7. Some say the '97 game would have given us 3 in a row. I don't look at it that way. It was the loss in '97 that spurred on UK's leaders in '98 to not give up and drove them to the title. That and some help in playing teams they matched up with well were big factors. Arizona and UNC would have been much tougher matchups for UK than Stanford and Utah ended up being.

 

8. In '98 all the players were Pitino's recruits except for Saul Smith. That said, I think Tubby mixed them just right. Pitino may have won with them, I don't know but my head says he might not have had the patience to adapt to slow and up tempo the way Tubby had that team adapt.

BTW, that team was a legitmate 8 deep. Starting five were: Padgett, Edwards, Mohammad, Turner and Shepherd but coming off the bench were: Magloire, Heishmu Evans and Cameron Mills. (Saul Smith played more as the year progressed)

 

Just some thoughts on the tail end of this discussion. :thumb:

Boy there's a lot of stuff on here about '98 and '97 that I'm not sure if all that accurate.

 

1. In '97 Nazr Mohammad I think was 0-6 from the FT line, not 0-10.

 

2. Arizona peaked at the right time that year and had the perfect team to combat a tired and injury riddled UK. I thought UK showed guts getting it to OT when they could have folded up.

 

3. Anderson hit his only FT in the Final Four game against Minnesota if memory serves, not Arizona. He was brought in for a Technical shot.

 

4. Anderson was cleared by the doctors to play, it was Pitino's call to bench him. For the person who talked about Pitino going to the Celtics and wanting to draft DA, he wanted Tim Duncan. They had the odds going into the lottery and that's one of the reasons he took the job. But the ball didn't fall in his lap right and he missed out on one of the best big men of his era.

 

5. That '97 team was up and down with losses to Clemson (when DA missed FT's that could have won it but UK lost in OT) and 2 losses to South Carolina. (Including the Senior Night Game which was the first UK had dropped since like 1962.)

 

6. The '98 team was even more Cinderella because of their perplexing losses. They were thumped by Arizona in Hawaii that December. Lost at home to one of Crum's worst Louisville teams and to Florida and Ole Miss at Rupp. They caught fire at the right time.

 

7. Some say the '97 game would have given us 3 in a row. I don't look at it that way. It was the loss in '97 that spurred on UK's leaders in '98 to not give up and drove them to the title. That and some help in playing teams they matched up with well were big factors. Arizona and UNC would have been much tougher matchups for UK than Stanford and Utah ended up being.

 

8. In '98 all the players were Pitino's recruits except for Saul Smith. That said, I think Tubby mixed them just right. Pitino may have won with them, I don't know but my head says he might not have had the patience to adapt to slow and up tempo the way Tubby had that team adapt.

BTW, that team was a legitmate 8 deep. Starting five were: Padgett, Edwards, Mohammad, Turner and Shepherd but coming off the bench were: Magloire, Heishmu Evans and Cameron Mills. (Saul Smith played more as the year progressed)

 

Just some thoughts on the tail end of this discussion. :thumb:

Thank you... I was about ready to make a similar post... :thumb:

 

Something that frustrates me is when people say the '98 team was loaded with talent. UNC, Duke, Arizona, (can anyone remember the other #1 seed?), were a lot more talented. The '98 team was a solid collection of kids that made the NBA, but nobody that spectacular or even anyone that spectacular in college.

Thank you... I was about ready to make a similar post... :thumb:

 

Something that frustrates me is when people say the '98 team was loaded with talent. UNC, Duke, Arizona, (can anyone remember the other #1 seed?), were a lot more talented. The '98 team was a solid collection of kids that made the NBA, but nobody that spectacular or even anyone that spectacular in college.

 

 

It might have been Purdue was the other #1 seed. (Or maybe Kansas?) Of the kids on that team only 3 can I say had good to decent NBA careers: Magloire, Padgett and Mohammad. (I feel I'm stretching it with the descriptions of their careers with those words) Shepherd made it as a free agent I think and the same was for Turner but neither lasted long. Of the other 2 remember Magloire was only a Sophomore and he was there for shot blocking and defense.

 

The other top teams had:

 

Arizona: Miles Simon (NBA bust), Mike Bibby and there was one other swingman.

 

UNC: Vince Carter, Antwan Jamison were the standouts.

 

Duke: Youthful Brand, Maggette, Avery, Trajan Langdon.

 

If memory serves Kansas may have still had Paul Pierce at that point.

 

There were a lot more talented teams but none that played better as a team than the '98 squad.

It might have been Purdue was the other #1 seed. (Or maybe Kansas?) Of the kids on that team only 3 can I say had good to decent NBA careers: Magloire, Padgett and Mohammad. (I feel I'm stretching it with the descriptions of their careers with those words) Shepherd made it as a free agent I think and the same was for Turner but neither lasted long. Of the other 2 remember Magloire was only a Sophomore and he was there for shot blocking and defense.

 

The other top teams had:

 

Arizona: Miles Simon (NBA bust), Mike Bibby and there was one other swingman.

 

UNC: Vince Carter, Antwan Jamison were the standouts.

 

Duke: Youthful Brand, Maggette, Avery, Trajan Langdon.

 

If memory serves Kansas may have still had Paul Pierce at that point.

 

There were a lot more talented teams but none that played better as a team than the '98 squad.

'Zona: Probably thinking of Dickerson on the perimiter. Who was the shot blocker on the interior??? Bramlett? Why is that name in my head, lol? :lol:

 

UNC: Carter and Jamison were All-Americans

 

Duke: Also had Wojo and Battier. Talented, but young.

 

That was a stupid question on who the other #1 was. It was Kansas. Heck, I watched them play out in Oklahoma City first round of the tourney against Prarie View. They lost second round to Tyson Chandler, Cutino Mobley, et. al of Rhode Island.

Pitino won one title and had an injury possibly keep him from a second. Tubby has won one title and had an injury possibly keep him from a second. Even. Question for speculation is even though he may not have won the title in 98, would he have won more that one over that time?