Exactly and society owes you nothing. I'm all for short term assistance but artificial changing of the market is never good for the long term health of the economy. Any solution such as a raise in the mininmum wage artificialy is kicking the can down the road.

 

We have already defined the real problem and that is manufacturing jobs , people on both sides have stated it in this very thread. The minimum wage does nothing for the long term healthy of economy.

 

You can't really make any educated economic reasoning behind it except maybe a very small raise. The only true reason is a false sense of compassion without realizing your hurting people more.

 

Whether I agree with Trump or not on how he is going to get manufacturing jobs back , he has made it a central theme of his campaign. It's speaking to the working class.

 

I can point to a lot of flaws in his economic ideas but the bottom line it is resonating with the working class. Hillary doesn't have the ability to do that and barley talks about how she will bring jobs back.

 

It's the same thing for 8 years , Republicans are sexist , racist , xenophobes, this country is ran by white supremacy. Also here is a bunch of free stuff we can't pay for.

 

It's old and tired.

 

If everyone here agrees the manufacturing jobs leaving is the biggest issue for jobs quit talking about the minimum wage and let's talk about solutions for the real problem.

 

The minimum wage issue is not sustainable. Anybody with a brain knows $15 an hour at McDonald's when there are people making that now trying to pay off college loan debts is a lark.

 

A lot of our country's issues would be solved if the companies that are here bothered to pay their employees. Some folks haven't had decent raises in almost a decade. And no, one or two .15 or .25 on the hour raises in that period does not constitute a legit merit raise for people who have had their workload doubled and tripled in that decade. Don't even get me started on the garbage of paying salary to "department supervisors" who have nobody under their supervision and how they're getting taken advantage of.

 

A return of a real manufacturing base in the US would float all boats. Sadly, the corporate world isn't very patriotic. And then they wonder why Average Joe is upset with the haves/elites. Easy to see a Trump candidacy arise in such an environment, even though we all know he can't deliver such a manufacturing rebirth without counterproductive measures in terms of international trade (tariffs, cancelling trade agreements), or spending his own money and opening scores of plants all across the US.

 

So what's really gonna happen?

Exactly and society owes you nothing. I'm all for short term assistance but artificial changing of the market is never good for the long term health of the economy. Any solution such as a raise in the mininmum wage artificialy is kicking the can down the road.

 

We have already defined the real problem and that is manufacturing jobs , people on both sides have stated it in this very thread. The minimum wage does nothing for the long term healthy of economy.

 

You can't really make any educated economic reasoning behind it except maybe a very small raise. The only true reason is a false sense of compassion without realizing your hurting people more.

 

Whether I agree with Trump or not on how he is going to get manufacturing jobs back , he has made it a central theme of his campaign. It's speaking to the working class.

 

I can point to a lot of flaws in his economic ideas but the bottom line it is resonating with the working class. Hillary doesn't have the ability to do that and barley talks about how she will bring jobs back.

 

It's the same thing for 8 years , Republicans are sexist , racist , xenophobes, this country is ran by white supremacy. Also here is a bunch of free stuff we can't pay for.

 

It's old and tired.

 

If everyone here agrees the manufacturing jobs leaving is the biggest issue for jobs quit talking about the minimum wage and let's talk about solutions for the real problem.

 

There is no solution. No business in their right mind would make the sacrifices it would take to increase the manufacturing job market in America. That's bad business.

Come on, cap. BOTH parties say or do anything to get elected. That's why they are called politicians.

 

IMHO, the Dems have taken it to a new level. I really do.

Respect for one's work and the amount paid for doing it are not the same. Yes, people often look down on fast-food jobs and janitorial, and sanitation work, etc.

 

But this really has little to do with the amount of money paid. Many Used car salesmen make pretty decent wages but that career has traditionally been looked down upon, as well.

 

I think a person should be paid according to the value she or he puts into the company that she or he is working for. Artificially raising the minimum wage raises the cost of providing a good or service and will have unintended consequences.

 

One consequence it is sure to have is to eliminate jobs. Those who are already employed may keep their jobs but over time hiring will slow down and those who work will be made to do more. Maybe those jobs will be eliminated altogether by automated means. Order at a kiosk and an assembly line burger, made the same every time, is made available at the window.

 

ANother consequence is that when you artificially raise the cost of a good or service by artificially increasing the cost of labor, you make it really difficult for an employer to hire a young, inexperienced worker, with little to no skills. The people who are hurt the most are the young and minorities. This will increase the unemployment rate among young African-American teens. It's already very high. It will go even higher under this plan. This will rob them of the opportunity to gain valuable work experience and develop job skills that will enable them to move up in the labor market to a better wage that rewards the skills and work ethic learned on the entry-level jobs.

 

Another certain consequence is that I and many others will buy a lot fewer burgers over a year's time. Again, making fewer workers necessary and eliminating jobs.

 

I know raising the minimum wage to $15 per hour sounds compassionate but it will actually do more harm than good. The result is not compassionate. The owner of the business will be hurt some, but those who are on the bottom of the labor market will be among those who are hurt the most.

 

That's why I'm against raising the minimum wage and most socialist ideas. They sound good but actually have devastating consequences. The way to show people you respect them is to allow them to make their own decisions. This is hard for those who are much smarter than the rest of us to do. But consider that perhaps I know better what is good for me and you know better what is good for you. If a person is willing to accept a job for $7.25 per hour, she should be allowed to do so without interference from the elitist. Let her and the employer come to an agreement about the value she brings to the job. That is how you show you respect her.

 

After she develops a work record, gains skills, learns how to work for someone and with fellow-employees, she can negotiate for a higher wage. If the employer is not willing to pay that higher wage, she may take her skills elsewhere to an employer willing to pay more.

 

This is how freedom works. Each person makes their own free decisions. That is how to show a person respect. Government making decisions for both employer and employee by coercion is disrespectful. I don't know of too many people who actually make the minimum wage. A testament to the fact that we don't need the government to tell us how much to pay someone. It is determined by how much value a person puts into the company. That is why employers don't pay everyone as little as possible--the minimum wage. I'll bet no one on BGP earns minimum wage. That's because you are more valuable to your employer than that and if they tried to pay you a lesser wage you would take your services to another company. A company who would only pasy minimum wage will end up with all the worst employees and this would jepoardize the companies ability to provide its goods or services and therefore jeopardize the existence of the company.

 

Keep the government out of our business. Government does not know best.

 

BTW, I worked in a restaurant as a bus boy and dishwasher and I was a gas station attendant when there were still full service gas stations, checking the oil, changing the oil, washing windshield, etc. Valuable jobs. I respect anyone who does an honest job. I gained experience and skill and went on to something else. I'm glad the job was available to help me learn and to move on.

 

I'm no economist by a long shot, and in theory you do make good arguments against raising the minimum wage with your list of possible negative consequences.

 

You might even be 100% accurate with your assessment, but considering this country has never truly established a sufficient minimum wage that people can support themselves on, without the benefit of ever having tested the theory of its possible merits, we also have never necessarily been able to measure if what you are saying would be the for certain without a doubt outcome.

 

It was also stated here by LB13 that minimum wage jobs were not meant to be career jobs to raise families on.

 

In a perfect world everyone would be educated and skilled enough to be qualified for higher paying jobs, and that fast food jobs would only be taken by teens or college kids getting their start in life, but reality tells another story, and like PP92 said,

 

"it's a catch-22. People don't want minimum wage raised so they can support their families, and people also don't want them to get government assistance so they can support their families".

 

It seems to me to be unethical that companies can expect from their employees 40 hours a week of their time and not compensate them adequately enough that they can find affordable housing and feed themselves along with other basic necessities. At the very least it should be mandated that companies must be able to pay their full time employees enough to cover these basic needs because if those can't be covered what else is the point of being employed to begin with?

 

In our modern society it is not practical, or structurally set up for individuals to be able to physically build their own homes, grow their own food, and knit their own wares. We are at the mercy and rely on employment to provide us with the means to be able to provide for ourselves the goods and services that we need to survive, and we are reliant on a system that should exhibit an agreement that if you are apart of the spinning wheel that keeps our economy moving, that it would only be fair that you as a player in that big picture earn at the very least enough to meet these needs.

 

Just as we expect, and it's also the law that home owning landlords provide to its tenants electricity, hot water, and heat along with suitable living conditions, it should also be law that business owners using the services of their employees should be required to pay their employees at the very least enough to meet their basic needs, and nothing less.

 

Employees are an instrumental part of the whole workings of a business, and without them profits are nonexistent, but to be fair to everyone involved, business owners included, the fair share should be structured so that both profits can be made while employees are also fairly paid.

 

Just as we have child labor laws, and laws against paying employees under the table to either to avoid taxes, or to underpay them, no full time position should be able to exist unless it earns for the employee sufficient funds to be able to cover their most basic needs. If they want to be anymore financially secure than that then it's on them to seek employment that can provide for them more, but the minimum wage at least should be able to cover a person's most basic needs. Again if those most basic needs cannot be covered what else is the point of being employed to begin with?

Regardless of your feelings towards Bernie as a candidate this is sweet.

 

 

Bernie Sanders Holds Back Tears As Brother Memorializes Their Parents During DNC Vote

Bernie is a complete sell out.

 

I didn't agree with his platform but respected him for his, what seemed to be, genuine belief in his platform. I don't blame his supporters for being so outraged.

 

Hillary will promise him anything and deliver on nothing.

There is no solution. No business in their right mind would make the sacrifices it would take to increase the manufacturing job market in America. That's bad business.

 

What your really saying is we don't have leaders on either side coming up with creative ideas to do so , and I agree. Of course businesses look out for their own self interest and they should. We need incentives to help compete with the lower wages in other countries. Incentives such as corporate tax forgiveness to bring money back over tax credits or breaks that are much more aggressive than we currently give. Lock those jobs in . Why do local and state governments compete so hard to gets jobs threw these incentives but our Federal government rarely does when competing with other countries.

 

I know some on the left don't like giving corporations breaks but if we wake up and understand the modern world where our wages at home our much higher we have to be creative and create our own advantages. Be proactive and not reactive.

From a messaging standpoint it will be interesting to see how much time is devoted to national security.

I learned this specific lesson many years ago. Mom worked as a part-time receptionist at a day care center. She made something over minimum; not very much. When minimum increased to over what she was making, she asked for a relative pay increase. Didn't get it.

 

Then in the course of many years as the CFO of the local community mental health center, federal minimum wage increased often, maybe half a dozen times.

 

We never laid off a single employee.

 

Never once did it almost double, never even in that stratosphere.

Never once did it almost double, never even in that stratosphere.

 

Correct. And for the record, I would support a much more graduated approach.

Correct. And for the record, I would support a much more graduated approach.

 

I would be ok with that but not to $15. I could see a 33% increase to $10 or so over two or three years. Maybe 10% a year for three years. Then let it stabilize and see how the economy reacts.

The minimum wage increase would also really put a hurt on the nursing home industry, small manufacturing companies, retail trade and most small businesses. Do they have a plan to address these problems? If so, I would like to hear it.

There is no solution. No business in their right mind would make the sacrifices it would take to increase the manufacturing job market in America. That's bad business.

 

The entity that needs to make a sacrifice for the good of the economy is the government. Give up control and allow private enterprise to thrive. Stop with regulations and high taxes and manufacturing will come back.

 

Housing prices go up when local, state, or federal governments put restrictions on it. Energy prices are driven higher by stifling regulations. Automobile costs are driven up by the same thing.

I'm no economist by a long shot, and in theory you do make good arguments against raising the minimum wage with your list of possible negative consequences.

 

You might even be 100% accurate with your assessment, but considering this country has never truly established a sufficient minimum wage that people can support themselves on, without the benefit of ever having tested the theory of its possible merits, we also have never necessarily been able to measure if what you are saying would be the for certain without a doubt outcome.

 

It was also stated here by LB13 that minimum wage jobs were not meant to be career jobs to raise families on.

 

In a perfect world everyone would be educated and skilled enough to be qualified for higher paying jobs, and that fast food jobs would only be taken by teens or college kids getting their start in life, but reality tells another story, and like PP92 said,

 

"it's a catch-22. People don't want minimum wage raised so they can support their families, and people also don't want them to get government assistance so they can support their families".

 

It seems to me to be unethical that companies can expect from their employees 40 hours a week of their time and not compensate them adequately enough that they can find affordable housing and feed themselves along with other basic necessities. At the very least it should be mandated that companies must be able to pay their full time employees enough to cover these basic needs because if those can't be covered what else is the point of being employed to begin with?

 

In our modern society it is not practical, or structurally set up for individuals to be able to physically build their own homes, grow their own food, and knit their own wares. We are at the mercy and rely on employment to provide us with the means to be able to provide for ourselves the goods and services that we need to survive, and we are reliant on a system that should exhibit an agreement that if you are apart of the spinning wheel that keeps our economy moving, that it would only be fair that you as a player in that big picture earn at the very least enough to meet these needs.

 

Just as we expect, and it's also the law that home owning landlords provide to its tenants electricity, hot water, and heat along with suitable living conditions, it should also be law that business owners using the services of their employees should be required to pay their employees at the very least enough to meet their basic needs, and nothing less.

 

Employees are an instrumental part of the whole workings of a business, and without them profits are nonexistent, but to be fair to everyone involved, business owners included, the fair share should be structured so that both profits can be made while employees are also fairly paid.

 

Just as we have child labor laws, and laws against paying employees under the table to either to avoid taxes, or to underpay them, no full time position should be able to exist unless it earns for the employee sufficient funds to be able to cover their most basic needs. If they want to be anymore financially secure than that then it's on them to seek employment that can provide for them more, but the minimum wage at least should be able to cover a person's most basic needs. Again if those most basic needs cannot be covered what else is the point of being employed to begin with?

 

The effect of minimum wage increases due to government mandate has shown to be detrimental in a variety of times and locations all over the world. Minimum wage was introduced in this country in the south to keep employers from hiring black men who would work for less money than their white counterparts. Whites didn't like that black men were taking their jobs so they instituted the minimum wage to prevent that from happening. If black men had to be paid as much as white men a racist would pay the white person. But if he had a choice, he may higher the one that would provide the lower labor cost. As other emplyers did this, it would start to drive up the wage. Government coercion ensured that whites would be preferred in hiring practices through establishing the minimum wage.

 

Your proposals, such as mandating paying a "living wage" will ensure that the unemployment rate will go up. What you propose cannot work for the very reasons I gave for why raising the minimum wage to $15 an hour will cause great harm to people on the bottom of the labor ladder--young, inexperienced, low-skill workers. Those jobs will just go away.

 

You need to look at a book called, Economic Fallacies by Thomas Sowell

 

You can also see a clip of him or Walter Williams on youtube discussing these issues.

There is no solution. No business in their right mind would make the sacrifices it would take to increase the manufacturing job market in America. That's bad business.

I would argue American consumers won't do what is necessary to bring back the jobs.