Shenanigans. Argument over...

 

So your saying the trade has helped the team this year?

7 quality starts in his last 10 outings before the injury...

 

2005 · 8-15

2006 · 8-7

 

That seems to be about $1mil per win....not impressive and like I've mentioned on other thread, one good year does not make a player worth that kind of money.

 

Where does he rank on allowing the most HR's in the NL, over the last 2 years and they get him, to pitch at GABP.

There is no way they keep both after 07, and truth be told I doubt they sign either...

 

 

:thumb: If they would have, they would have had to overpay them to keep them around and we already have Griffey, Larue, and Milton making enough extra money to last my family 200 years.

Just in case you forgot Latch, the Reds lost 8 of 9 and 20 of 29 overall going into the AS break to fall one game under .500 with Kearns and Lopez on the roster. They were a .500 team with and without them...

2005 · 8-15

2006 · 8-7

 

That seems to be about $1mil per win....not impressive and like I've mentioned on other thread, one good year does not make a player worth that kind of money.

 

Where does he rank on allowing the most HR's in the NL, over the last 2 years and they get him, to pitch at GABP.

If you have a quality start blown after you leave with the lead, that makes you a bad pitcher? Not in my book...

7 quality starts in his last 10 outings before the injury...

 

 

He's quite overpaid, but I am comfortable with him as our 3rd pitcher.

He's quite overpaid, but I am comfortable with him as our 3rd pitcher.

:thumb:

 

Dan O' sure knew how to over pay for players...

Not many teams in the history of baseball have blown a 5 game lead in the division once September has started. No one is saying they were run producing machines. But the club scored more runs while they were on the team.

 

Friendly wager, the Reds will not lead or be tied for the division lead in the next 3 years in the month of September.

 

Not because of them.

 

Agreed...

If you have a quality start blown after you leave with the lead, that makes you a bad pitcher? Not in my book...

You're hanging on the premise, he's a quality starting MLB pitcher.

 

ERA's, which hover around the 5.00± for most of the last two seasons, is not quality....Giving up HR's in the 1st or 2nd inning, is not quality....Exiting after 4-5 innings, for most his starts is not quality.

 

Quality is looked upon, over the entire body of work and not a stretch....His body of work, is overpaid and underachieving but consistent, in his ability to not be very good.

 

He's quite overpaid, but I am comfortable with him as our 3rd pitcher.

Than be comfortable with inconsistency and the Reds not being very good next year, when Milton pitches.

I've said it several times and I'm still right. This was a money deal that addressed some immidiate concerns. I don't think Lopez and Kearns were the greatest thing ever, but they were about to get paid and the Reds didn't want to pay them. Might as well get something for them while you can. This was a money deal. Bray may end up a stud, but Kearns and Lopez are both going to have productive years. Both are young, have formerly been ranked as high prospects, and are both having decent years. We traded 2 young starters away for average prospects. It isn't as bad a deal as I'm making it out to be because I agree with not paying Kearns and Lopez big money, but thinking that the Nationals got the short end of the stick is far and near sighted.

 

This is the thing I think people have trouble separating. Trades have nothing to do with the other team, it's what YOU need. I don't like that comparison because it's based on necessity, not who won.

Here's an article, comparing the Twins and Reds, similar market areas and discussion on Milton and Krivsky.

 

Twins and Reds

You're hanging on the premise, he's a quality starting MLB pitcher.

 

ERA's, which hover around the 5.00± for most of the last two seasons, is not quality....Giving up HR's in the 1st or 2nd inning, is not quality....Exiting after 4-5 innings, for most his starts is not quality.

 

Quality is looked upon, over the entire body of work and not a stretch....His body of work, is overpaid and underachieving but consistent, in his ability to not be very good.

 

Than be comfortable with inconsistency and the Reds not being very good next year, when Milton pitches.

 

 

So Woo, Elizardo, Ryan Franklin, etc. etc. should be number 3? I would love to get Jason Schmidt (who's going to make 12-15 million a year) and have Arroyo as the 3, but it's not going to happen. Milton's ERA is not that bad and his ERA is 4.84, plus he doesn't walk a lot of guys. He's average. He's not great, but he's not that bad. 15 times this year he's given up 3 or fewer runs. That isn't too bad when you have a good offense. If he was in NY (either team) then he'd have won 13-15 games this year. I'm comfortable with him because he's servicable, not good, but not bad either.

This is the thing I think people have trouble separating. Trades have nothing to do with the other team, it's what YOU need. I don't like that comparison because it's based on necessity, not who won.

 

 

If you needed to get rid of 2 starters who were former prospects who are about to hit their respective primes for middle relief then you must have needed to cut some salary and build the farm system some. Not get better.

So Woo, Elizardo, Ryan Franklin, etc. etc. should be number 3? I would love to get Jason Schmidt (who's going to make 12-15 million a year) and have Arroyo as the 3, but it's not going to happen. Milton's ERA is not that bad and his ERA is 4.84, plus he doesn't walk a lot of guys. He's average. He's not great, but he's not that bad. 15 times this year he's given up 3 or fewer runs. That isn't too bad when you have a good offense. If he was in NY (either team) then he'd have won 13-15 games this year. I'm comfortable with him because he's serviceable, not good, but not bad either.

An ERA of 4.84 and that is not that bad for an MLB pitcher, who got a $25.5 mil contract and makes $9.8mil this year....:lol:

 

You keep convincing yourself, he can be an effective winner for the Reds. If you assume that he is "not that bad" as you say, than a player who is 16-22 lifetime for the Reds, will be nothing more than mediocre....which is where the Reds are right now, below .500

 

You say 15 times he given up less than 3 runs, what about the other times....I've rode the beat Milton horse to long and stated my opinion on him.

 

Milton is a former Twins player and Krivsky, may or may not retain him. If I'm GM for a day....

If you needed to get rid of 2 starters who were former prospects who are about to hit their respective primes for middle relief then you must have needed to cut some salary and build the farm system some. Not get better.

 

Brandon Larson was a "former prospect" also...

 

Actually, they were doing both. In my unpopular opinion.