At Gun shows the dealers complete background checks on all gun sales.

 

If you are a gun dealer you complete a check on every sale, even at gun shows.

 

Having been audited by ATF several times they would find very quickly any gun you sold without the completed paperwork ( a 4473)

 

Perhaps better funding of the ATF would help.

I see the point of those who want gun control and all. Just like with any side on any issue you have those that are way out there in their thinking. But something needs to be done.

 

As MNT Ref pointed out in a thread recently (I forgot which one), you want the shooters to be taken alive so you can get inside their head, to help figure out why people commit this horrific acts, this does help a lot. More money needs to be spent so people can study these people even more.

 

The above brings up one of the issues that is always present, we need more money on mental health.

 

Background checks on every firearm sale.

 

If you steal a firearm which is now a felony, you must do a lot more time, the heck with any light sentence or parole. If you are had previous firearms arrest, you do more time too. If you are in a gang and you have a gun, you do a lot more time. If a firearm is used in a crime, you do a lot more time. All of this would happen with no parole.

 

Of course the above paragraph would not have prevented many of the mass shooting of the past, as they were not gang members and many had their firearms legally. But, this cannot be solved without attacking every aspect of the issue.

 

I would take some of the money that is wasted on the war on drugs and spend some more on the ATF, for a start.

 

Back to the mental health problem. Just because someone is down, or depressed shouldn't mean that they have their firearms taken away. We all have our issues, and we all get down at times. But to start, if you make threats or comments about harming yourself or anyone, you do get your firearms taken away, at least for a while.

 

If you have firearms and kids, if there is a tragic event, it's on your hands so you very well may have to loose your right to own firearms. Now, if people are over your house and some kid goes into a room that they shouldn't be in, I am willing to let that go, as the firearm very well may have been hidden.

 

Some of people on the gun control side have to realize, first is that we all have the right to protect ourselves. That reducing the capacity of magazines, or outlawing certain guns is not going to solve anything. Limiting the number of firearms someone owns is not going to slove anything. They have to realize that taking my 15 round magazine away and only allowing me to have, lets say, 5 rounds per mag, isn't going to help. Myself and many people on here can switch out mags within a blink of an eye without losing a step. As well as now with the 3D printers, you can make just about anything you want now, so if someone wants a much larger mag, they will get it, or make it.

 

This isn't something that can be solved overnight, but all sides need to come together and start figuring this out, but the gun control people need to realize that anything in the paragraph above is off limits.

Your premise fails with me because I don't think we should make it harder to take advantage of a constitutional right.

 

I know there is no overnight fix, but what are your ideas to solve this problem?

Perhaps better funding of the ATF would help.

 

Help how? What does the ATF need to do better/differently?

 

Help how? What does the ATF need to do better/differently?

 

Pretty sure I read somewhere that their budget hasn't really been increased since the 90s.

One thing that would help but no one will like it, stiffer penalties for those convicted of gun crimes. Get those people off of the street. Those aren't the people committing mass shootings, but they are the people committing 80%+ of the gun related murders in this country.

 

Mental Health issues are out of control, we gave a generation or two of people that have been prescribed psychotropic drugs for all sorts of behavior prpblems. I saw once that these sorts of drugs were a common thread in nearly every shooting that has taken place like this one.

Pretty sure I read somewhere that their budget hasn't really been increased since the 90s.

 

Could be, but what do they need to be doing differently or more of?

 

Could be, but what do they need to be doing differently or more of?

 

I'm just spitballing here.

Gotcha

I used to be a gun control advocate. I have since changed my position only because cultural and political forces in this country are simply too overwhelming to make gun control feasible or effective. I now support a policy of gun saturation. Arm everyone.

 

No, I am not a 2nd amendment zealot. My position is simply based on an analytical evaluation of the alternatives. Clearly, gun control policies aggravate, not diminish gun violence.

As much as mental health issues seem to be a part of the problem, it is worth noting that millions of people have mental health issues and manage to never even so much as threaten someone else, let alone shoot someone else.

 

I've outlined what I'd like to see countless times in the past. In a nutshell, my hot button issue is with irresponsibility that ends with children being killed, maimed or doing the same to either other children or adults.

 

In the case of mass shootings or gun violence in general, I'm now of the belief that these can't be regulated away at all.

 

I don't believe most of those who commit acts of violence are mentally ill. I'm of the opinion that with the exception of a select few, most are just evil. You don't have to be mentally ill to be a black soul. We want to say they are mentally ill, bit really, they are as rational as the rest of us, they just have no regard for human life. It's not just gun violence...it's domestic violence, it's abuse of animals, and it's sometimes just general belligerence.

 

We can blame drugs, guns, bad parents, mental illness....but in the end, it comes down to the fact that there have always been, and will always be, seriously bad people in the world. And now, they gain instant, worldwide recognition when their blackness is manifested in horrific acts. And often, their disregard for life extends to disregard for even their own life, as their quest for fame leads them to "die for their cause".

 

Arming everyone will not solve these issues. Disarming everyone will not solve any issues. As a society, we need to change the culture of our country.

 

That's where I am today with it all. I don't have any answers. There are no simple solutions, and every man, woman and child has to be involved in the solution.

National Firearms Act of 1934 - Prohibition and just ended and thousands of government "alcohol agents" needed something to do. The NFA of 1934 put the regulation of fully automatic machine guns, sawed off rifles and shotguns, and suppressors (often mistakenly called silencers, in reality they don't silence, I still wear ear protection around them) under the jurisdiction of the Bureau Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms. Today for a citizen to obtain a fully automatic machine gun, a rifle with a barrel shorter than 16 inches,a shot gun shorter than 18 inches and/or a suppressor requires a mountain of paper work, an extremely in depth background check, and a tax stamp.

 

Gun Control Act of 1968 - Passed as a reaction to the assassination of John and Bobby Kennedy along with Malcom X and Martin Luther King, Jr. all within a short period of time. The biggest component of the GCA of 68 was it restricted the interstate commerce of firearms. Basically, if I were over in Southern Indiana having Spin Doc implement torture often called Dentistry on my teeth and then decided to stop by Bass Pro Shops to look around and saw a gun I wanted to buy, I could not have Bass Pro Shops do the federal background check on me, buy the fire arm and take it home with me to Louisville. Instead, I would have to buy the gun, pay for Bass Pro to ship the firearm to a licensed dealer in Kentucky, go to that dealer, do the background check, pay the FFL fee and then take the gun home. Not sure how this makes society safer but, that is the law.

 

Firearm Owners Protection Act of 1986 - This law was sold as protecting the rights of Gun Owners but the NRA has since admitted that they had one pulled on them and missed the ball not opposing this bill. A major aspect of this act is that banned the ownership of any fully automatic firearms made from the date of the Act forward. So basically, pretty much all machine guns legally owned today were built May 7, 1986 or earlier (I think I have the right day).

I would never torture you Bert. I'd aggravate you mildly, but never torture.

As much as mental health issues seem to be a part of the problem, it is worth noting that millions of people have mental health issues and manage to never even so much as threaten someone else, let alone shoot someone else.

 

I've outlined what I'd like to see countless times in the past. In a nutshell, my hot button issue is with irresponsibility that ends with children being killed, maimed or doing the same to either other children or adults.

 

In the case of mass shootings or gun violence in general, I'm now of the belief that these can't be regulated away at all.

 

I don't believe most of those who commit acts of violence are mentally ill. I'm of the opinion that with the exception of a select few, most are just evil. You don't have to be mentally ill to be a black soul. We want to say they are mentally ill, bit really, they are as rational as the rest of us, they just have no regard for human life. It's not just gun violence...it's domestic violence, it's abuse of animals, and it's sometimes just general belligerence.

 

We can blame drugs, guns, bad parents, mental illness....but in the end, it comes down to the fact that there have always been, and will always be, seriously bad people in the world. And now, they gain instant, worldwide recognition when their blackness is manifested in horrific acts. And often, their disregard for life extends to disregard for even their own life, as their quest for fame leads them to "die for their cause".

 

Arming everyone will not solve these issues. Disarming everyone will not solve any issues. As a society, we need to change the culture of our country.

 

That's where I am today with it all. I don't have any answers. There are no simple solutions, and every man, woman and child has to be involved in the solution.

Perfectly stated. Agree 100%.

Unfortunately, I am pretty convinced nothing will be done in my lifetime. It is just rinse, repeat...

As much as mental health issues seem to be a part of the problem, it is worth noting that millions of people have mental health issues and manage to never even so much as threaten someone else, let alone shoot someone else.

 

I've outlined what I'd like to see countless times in the past. In a nutshell, my hot button issue is with irresponsibility that ends with children being killed, maimed or doing the same to either other children or adults.

 

In the case of mass shootings or gun violence in general, I'm now of the belief that these can't be regulated away at all.

 

I don't believe most of those who commit acts of violence are mentally ill. I'm of the opinion that with the exception of a select few, most are just evil. You don't have to be mentally ill to be a black soul. We want to say they are mentally ill, bit really, they are as rational as the rest of us, they just have no regard for human life. It's not just gun violence...it's domestic violence, it's abuse of animals, and it's sometimes just general belligerence.

 

We can blame drugs, guns, bad parents, mental illness....but in the end, it comes down to the fact that there have always been, and will always be, seriously bad people in the world. And now, they gain instant, worldwide recognition when their blackness is manifested in horrific acts. And often, their disregard for life extends to disregard for even their own life, as their quest for fame leads them to "die for their cause".

 

Arming everyone will not solve these issues. Disarming everyone will not solve any issues. As a society, we need to change the culture of our country.

 

That's where I am today with it all. I don't have any answers. There are no simple solutions, and every man, woman and child has to be involved in the solution.

You mentioned changing our country's culture.......AGREED. Our country has been experiencing culture rot for several years, which in my opinion, has contributed HEAVILY to this crap.