Smh....yeah...racial relations will never be satisfactory. I've lost hope on a society where everyone truly gets along. It's obvious that it isn't possible. Carry on wih your racially insensitive selves. I'll never discuss race on here again. I thought most of you were smart enough to have a productive conversation about it. Forget it.

 

Well, that's a shame. You're always a provider of much needed insight. It is fascinating how many threads and debates we have about race here, though. And how defensive it makes people. Post-racial society...:lol:

Right. The point is that the word thug is being thrown out unfairly to those black athletes that act like turds.

Unfair? You have to admit that the celebration of "gang culture" that is celebrated in hip/hop does not help matters. Just the same as I am probably labeled a redneck by some due to my love of music by the likes of Pantera, Skynyrd, Ted Nugent, etc...

Well, that's a shame. You're always a provider of much needed insight. It is fascinating how many threads and debates we have about race here, though. And how defensive it makes people. Post-racial society...:lol:

 

Can't do it homey. Too frustrating when people(not everybody) refuse to even try to understand where the other is coming from. There's just no point anymore. It is what it is.

To me 'thug' is anyone who uses violence or threats of violence to get their way. If you just use the word 'thug' without context the image I draw up is a Chicago street mobster from the 1930s - i.e. Capone and crew. And I do not view all Italians as thugs.

Counselor, I would suggest you read that words I posted. I didn't say that a person who says "thug" is "racist."

 

I said the term has a racial undercurrent ie it's associated more with blacks than whites.

 

I do NOT believe that people that say "thug" in reference to any black male is racist.

 

Sorry for misunderstanding you, although I still don't understand you. If the term is associated more with blacks than whites, in you opinion is that caused by: A. more blacks act like thugs, or B. because people unfairly use that word against blacks (ie because the people using the word are racists)? Help me out and tell me what you are really trying to say.

Edited April 25, 201214 yr by leatherneck

This American of German heritage 64 year old father of three , grandfather of soon to be 4 , Lector and Extraordinary minister of the Eucharist in the Catholic Church , former soccer coach and Referee has been called a Thug on this board by an ignorant poster because I happen to belong to a labor union .

 

Seriously?

 

As you know, I've worked with a lot of union pipefitters and a large, large majority of them are some of the nicest people, best family men and hardest workers that I've ever met.

 

Somebody really missed the mark calling you a thug.

Can't do it homey. Too frustrating when people(not everybody) refuse to even try to understand where the other is coming from. There's just no point anymore. It is what it is.

If I'm one of them, apologies if I came across that way. Didn't intend to. I merely have a different opinion about the term is all.

Sorry for misunderstanding you, although I still don't understand you. If the term is associated more with blacks than whites, in you opinion is that caused by: A. more blacks act like thugs, or B. because people unfairly use that word against blacks (ie because the people using the word are racists)? Help me out and tell me what you are really trying to say.

 

I think the problem is that there isn't a perfect dichotomy between racists and non-racists as you've outlined, where you're either a racist or you're not and any insinuation that race matters in society is an insinuation that you're a card-carrying racist. I think the other side of the debate sees a much more fluid spectrum of how race affects us and society, especially in subtle ways, and it doesn't mean that everyone is a racist, or even close. A racist is a very particular and specific label.

 

I think there are a lot of people who might be quick on the trigger finger, so to speak, when it comes to labeling black athletes "thugs," or that they might be more inclined to give a white player in a similar situation the benefit of the doubt. It's kind of like the term "white trash." How many of us use that term? But, it implies that typical trash isn't white, so we have specify when it is referring specifically to white people instead, right? But that doesn't make you a racist. It just means you use a common expression that has some racial undertones that you perhaps haven't thought about.

 

I think society has some unfortunate stereotypes of black people that a lot of us play into, most of the time without ever realizing it. I think the point of the debate in a thread like this is to perhaps realize it or at least think about it from another perspective. Of course, we all don't have to agree or see it the same way, but I understand PP92's disheartenment when it seems many would rather cover their ears, close their eyes, and shout in anger at the very mention of it.

Absolutely. The problem is that hockey isn't as mainstream as the NFL, NBA or college basketball. Only those clued into all sports and not just a few even know who half your list is. Nobody is denying that there are white athletes that are labeled as thugs. You just never hear it as frequently as you do about black athletes and part of that is because of the proportions that you mentioned but also in how mainstream that sport is. Even the NFL players you mentioned are long retired or even passed away. Randy Moss has been called a thug.(:lol:....not even close) The word is thrown around so loosely that it doesn't take much from a black athlete to garner that label.

 

I'm not necessarily disagreeing with your premise. I believe, though, that if the NBA was made up of primarily white players and the majority of the players in the NFL were as well, what you say would be true in reverse. Those dead and retired NFL players on my list were from and era where a larger portion of the players in the NFL was made up of white players and they were referred to then, as thugs. If the NHL were main stream, those hockey players I listed would still be thugs.

 

Let me use a different example. Look at the franchise owners and all corporate CEOs. All of them are a portrayed as greedy, uncaring, money grubbing, bastages. Are they? Some. But because the CEOs and corporate moguls of this country are primarily white, it doesn't take much for a white person in upper management of corporate America to garner that label, either. Should those labels be restricted, too?

 

I think I fully understand the issue, maybe not. I'm guilty of what you speak of, though. I freely admit that. However, I honestly feel that if the situations were reversed, I be guilty of the same in reverse.

 

Maybe I'm just naive. That's a distinct possibility, too.

Wow. Sensitive? I have never heard that one.

 

Are you black. I said it was a black joke. Not a joke about blacks. But a little something we keep to ourselves. Ooops, I put our business in the street.

Smh....yeah...racial relations will never be satisfactory. I've lost hope on a society where everyone truly gets along. It's obvious that it isn't possible. Carry on wih your racially insensitive selves. I'll never discuss race on here again. I thought most of you were smart enough to have a productive conversation about it. Forget it.

 

Yep. And anonymity makes folks brave as heck. That real tlak. Race ain't going nowhere. People think if you just ignore it, it is no longer there. No simpleton. It takes real conversation and action to get rid of it. Action as in calling out your co-worker; friend or family member for their rqcists acts and opinions.

Yep. And anonymity makes folks brave as heck. That real tlak. Race ain't going nowhere. People think if you just ignore it, it is no longer there. No simpleton. It takes real conversation and action to get rid of it. Action as in calling out your co-worker; friend or family member for their rqcists acts and opinions.

 

I wish the black community would do it to Rev's Sharpton and Jackson, then I will listen a little more carefully....

Yep. And anonymity makes folks brave as heck. That real tlak. Race ain't going nowhere. People think if you just ignore it, it is no longer there. No simpleton. It takes real conversation and action to get rid of it. Action as in calling out your co-worker; friend or family member for their rqcists acts and opinions.

You're sounding really one sided with that post. There are plenty of racist people that are black as well as white, lets not pretend otherwise.

I think the problem is that there isn't a perfect dichotomy between racists and non-racists as you've outlined, where you're either a racist or you're not and any insinuation that race matters in society is an insinuation that you're a card-carrying racist. I think the other side of the debate sees a much more fluid spectrum of how race affects us and society, especially in subtle ways, and it doesn't mean that everyone is a racist, or even close. A racist is a very particular and specific label.

 

I think there are a lot of people who might be quick on the trigger finger, so to speak, when it comes to labeling black athletes "thugs," or that they might be more inclined to give a white player in a similar situation the benefit of the doubt. It's kind of like the term "white trash." How many of us use that term? But, it implies that typical trash isn't white, so we have specify when it is referring specifically to white people instead, right? But that doesn't make you a racist. It just means you use a common expression that has some racial undertones that you perhaps haven't thought about.

 

I think society has some unfortunate stereotypes of black people that a lot of us play into, most of the time without ever realizing it. I think the point of the debate in a thread like this is to perhaps realize it or at least think about it from another perspective. Of course, we all don't have to agree or see it the same way, but I understand PP92's disheartenment when it seems many would rather cover their ears, close their eyes, and shout in anger at the very mention of it.

 

Thank you. Word up.

I'm not necessarily disagreeing with your premise. I believe, though, that if the NBA was made up of primarily white players and the majority of the players in the NFL were as well, what you say would be true in reverse. Those dead and retired NFL players on my list were from and era where a larger portion of the players in the NFL was made up of white players and they were referred to then, as thugs. If the NHL were main stream, those hockey players I listed would still be thugs.

 

Let me use a different example. Look at the franchise owners and all corporate CEOs. All of them are a portrayed as greedy, uncaring, money grubbing, bastages. Are they? Some. But because the CEOs and corporate moguls of this country are primarily white, it doesn't take much for a white person in upper management of corporate America to garner that label, either. Should those labels be restricted, too?

 

I think I fully understand the issue, maybe not. I'm guilty of what you speak of, though. I freely admit that. However, I honestly feel that if the situations were reversed, I be guilty of the same in reverse.

 

Maybe I'm just naive. That's a distinct possibility, too.

 

Great post. You definitely understand the issue and provided a great example as well with a great point. It reminds me that I have a lot of friends that are republican and I need to do a better job going forward of not labeling the entire republican party a bunch a money grubbing racists because the ones I know aren't. I am guilty of stereotyping and I need to do better going forward. The only way we can get all of these unfair labels removed is if we all pay it forward.