I think the point is that no one is saying that the player population should reflect to overall population of the country.

 

I don't think that the point of the Rooney Rule is to ensure that the coaching population mirrors the racial demographics of players in the NFL. It is to ensure that interview opportunities for all qualified candidates, regardless of race, are protected.

 

I agree with your statement; that is why I think the racial demographics of the country are irrealevent to a Rooney Rule Discussion.

I'm not sure, but I do remember hearing that Doug Williams was interested and he never got intereviewed.

 

Of course, we have Joker and had Tubby so I don't know that I can harbor any ill will toward my alma mater.

 

Regardless of what UK has done (wheteher or not they offered Chow or truely rejected Williams), that does not negate the fact that only 14 of the 120 coaches in the FBS are African American and that the interviewing processes could, maybe, use a Rooney Rule to ensure that candidates of color that are qualified at least get an opportunity to interview for head coaching positions.

 

Maybe Barnhardt didn't think Williams was the right guy for the job. So if UK didn't have Joker or Tubby you would be offended?

Maybe Barnhardt didn't think Williams was the right guy for the job. So if UK didn't have Joker or Tubby you would be offended?

 

I don't know.

 

I did feel, at the time, that getting Rich Brooks without considering Doug Williams had to do with race.

 

Ironically, considering our basketball heritage, I never felt that way about our basketball coaching decisions until Tubby left. I do feel that, for some fans, his race was an issue.

 

If UK let Joker go tomorrow and hired a white head coach that I felt was more qualified, I don't know that I would even be offended.

 

I do feel that, when we look at the numbers, something doesn't jive. I do feel that a collegiate Rooney Rule would provide the opportunites for interviews and at least ADs and presidents can say without reservation and fans can be a little more certain that that the best candidates are being picked when the numbers get so out of whack, like they currently are IMO.

I go back to my original post....stupid rule.

I just checked and Doug Williams was interviewed for the UK job, so I retract my statements about not being interviewed or considered.

 

I still felt, at the time, that he was a better hire.

 

And, yes, Norm Chow was offered and rejected the job.

No, he's saying the Rooney Rule makes owners give minorities the opportunity to interview for the job. Not hire them, interview them. That's all the rule does.

 

I think some of you are missing the whole point about this rule. Jim Schue had a great post about "the old boy network". I think people would be naive to think that those NFL owners that grew up racist aren't racist anymore. At least the Rooney Rule prevents this racism from running rampant throughout the league. The Rooney Rule isn't making NFL teams hire minorities like affirmative action does, all the Rooney Rule is saying is to interview 1 minority before you make your hire. It boggles my mind to see so many people against a rule that says to interview 1 minority before you make hire.

 

Really, it bothers you that bad to "go through the motions" to interview 1 minority before you hire Pete Carroll even though we all knew you were going to hire him? Really?

 

I know some will say, "that's not what I meant when I said I don't like the rule", but in the grand scheme of things, 1 minority has to be interviewed before the team can make a hire, but people say that's wrong.......is it really that big of a deal to interview 1 minority before you make a hire whether you are going to hire him or not?

 

And then you wonder why I like the rule and affirmative action.:idunno:

 

 

I don't know why I'm confusing you guys so much. I know what the Rooney Rule is. What I was trying to say was, I'm against the whole idea, because I would like to think that owners would choose the best candidate, regardless of color of skin, making the Rooney Rule unneccessary. I'm not sure how I'm confusing you guys.

I don't know why I'm confusing you guys so much. I know what the Rooney Rule is. What I was trying to say was, I'm against the whole idea, because I would like to think that owners would choose the best candidate, regardless of color of skin, making the Rooney Rule unneccessary. I'm not sure how I'm confusing you guys.

 

The Rooney Rule only guarantees an interview, not a hire. All the owners have to do is interview 1 minority and then they can hire all the Pete Carrolls and Lane Kiffins they want.

The rule is stupid and offensive to qualified minorities. My previous statement was made to make the point of how dumb this process is.

 

I think the percentage of American that is black is less than 20%, I think the percentage of coaches in the NFL is close to or more than that and I can assure you that the percentage of millionaire players is much higher than 20%

 

It isn't the 60's and just in case the NFL missed it the President of our country is a minority and he wouldn't be so if a good number of old white people didn't vote for him.

 

It isn't offensive to me. I am grateful for it.

I just checked and Doug Williams was interviewed for the UK job, so I retract my statements about not being interviewed or considered.

 

I still felt, at the time, that he was a better hire.

 

And, yes, Norm Chow was offered and rejected the job.

 

Do you still feel Doug Williams would have been the better hire?

 

I don't think him not getting hired had anything to do with race. Tubby Smith was already the basketball coach so UK obviously was willing to hire black coaches.

 

I thought it was time for Tubby Smith to move on. It had nothing to do with race it had everything to do with the fact that UK was slipping and slipping fast his last 3 years.

 

Speaking as honestly and I hope in a non offensive manner my problem is the feeling that their should be a certain percentage. A quota for lack of a better word. If a minority is the best man for the job then hire him if not don't. I seems to me that the "quota" is only applied in one direction.

It isn't offensive to me. I am grateful for it.

 

That's fine but I wouldn't want an interview given to me because an organization was required to interview someone from my race.

That's fine but I wouldn't want an interview given to me because an organization was required to interview someone from my race.

 

Me either.... :thumb:

Do you still feel Doug Williams would have been the better hire?

 

I don't think him not getting hired had anything to do with race. Tubby Smith was already the basketball coach so UK obviously was willing to hire black coaches.

 

I thought it was time for Tubby Smith to move on. It had nothing to do with race it had everything to do with the fact that UK was slipping and slipping fast his last 3 years.

 

Speaking as honestly and I hope in a non offensive manner my problem is the feeling that their should be a certain percentage. A quota for lack of a better word. If a minority is the best man for the job then hire him if not don't. I seems to me that the "quota" is only applied in one direction.

 

I honestly feel we would at least be where we are today with Doug Williams at the helm, but that is speculative and (unintentionally) a disrespect to the great job that Rich Brooks has done, so I will just leave it at that.

 

Football has always been different than basketball. The SEC has had only two minority head football coaches in its history. There are currently only 14 at the BCS level. I will never be convinced that this is because there are not enough qualified minorities to fill the positions.

 

I, too, would have an issue with any quota system. This is why I like the Rooney Rule because it has always focused on interviews and not hiring. I can't see how it would hurt to ask executives to look at one more qualified candidate before they choose to fill a position.

 

I have never felt that you have been disrespectful, Koun Dog. This is a great debate and very worth-while and you have been a class act in discussing it. :thumb:

No, he's saying the Rooney Rule makes owners give minorities the opportunity to interview for the job. Not hire them, interview them. That's all the rule does.

 

I think some of you are missing the whole point about this rule. Jim Schue had a great post about "the old boy network". I think people would be naive to think that those NFL owners that grew up racist aren't racist anymore. At least the Rooney Rule prevents this racism from running rampant throughout the league. The Rooney Rule isn't making NFL teams hire minorities like affirmative action does, all the Rooney Rule is saying is to interview 1 minority before you make your hire. It boggles my mind to see so many people against a rule that says to interview 1 minority before you make hire.

 

Really, it bothers you that bad to "go through the motions" to interview 1 minority before you hire Pete Carroll even though we all knew you were going to hire him? Really?

 

I know some will say, "that's not what I meant when I said I don't like the rule", but in the grand scheme of things, 1 minority has to be interviewed before the team can make a hire, but people say that's wrong.......is it really that big of a deal to interview 1 minority before you make a hire whether you are going to hire him or not?

 

And then you wonder why I like the rule and affirmative action.:idunno:

 

I agree with you %100. I can't believe people are offended or dislike giving a minority a chance to interview...

The Rooney Rule only guarantees an interview, not a hire. All the owners have to do is interview 1 minority and then they can hire all the Pete Carrolls and Lane Kiffins they want.

 

Once again, I know what the Rooney Rule is. I'm saying, that in my opinion, the rule is unneccessary, because people hire who they want to any way. I give up. :idunno:

It is an opportunity, not a guarantee. I have no problem with an opportunity for an interview where a candidate, ... who let's be totally honest probably wouldn't have been considered by the 'good ole boy' network, gets to present their case as to why they would be a good head coach. If they aren't the best qualifed and don't get the job, that is perfectly fine.

 

Now if the NFL stated that you had to hire someone based on something other that qualifications, I would have a big problem with that. But that is not what the Rooney rule is.

 

As far as Doug Williams not getting the UK job, ... noone knows how he would have done. BUT, you cannot compare his experience with what Rich Brooks had. Brooks had proven that he could take a program at the bottom and rebuild them. He also proved, by hiring/promoting 2 minority coordinators when no other D1 team in the country was doing the same, that race was not an issue with he or UK. I have no problem defending UK's current position on minority coaches. But this isn't about UK.