That one doesn't count.

You were wrong. Just admit it...

You don't get 50 for that. Performance enhancer...

Could have been amphetamines.

Could have been amphetamines.

Could be greenies...

The impact would be if those flyouts or groundouts advanced people on base.

Besides a DP the SO is worst case scenario for hitter with men on.

 

 

That would seem logical.

 

However, stats do not back it up.

 

From 1999 to 2002, they analyzed every play. One measure showed how many runs scored in an inning from particular events. For example, if a HR was hit, 1.942 runs (including the bomb) scored from that point on to the end of the inning.

 

If a K occurred, .207 runs scored in the rest of the inning. An out in general resulted in .240 runs.

 

One problem with the above is that its a general stat - no context. For example, a sac bunt (resulting in an out) has a value of 1.031 runs. Why? It usually happens late and its an out that is specifically designed to get ONE run.

 

In general when a team starts an inning they expect to score .55 runs. That expectancy changes with each out/man on base combination. For example, if the leadoff man gets out, the expected runs go down to .297 runs. Leadoff man gets on, it goes to .953 runs.

 

So, even taking all of that into account, there is no difference in runs scoring if a batter strikes out vs a general out.

 

Again, the purpose of my question was aimed at those that are hung up on not the fact that he gets out but that the out is a K. Of course there are situations where a K is worse than a regular out (man on third, one out) but overall, a K is insignificant vs a standard out.

That would seem logical.

 

However, stats do not back it up.

 

From 1999 to 2002, they analyzed every play. One measure showed how many runs scored in an inning from particular events. For example, if a HR was hit, 1.942 runs (including the bomb) scored from that point on to the end of the inning.

 

If a K occurred, .207 runs scored in the rest of the inning. An out in general resulted in .240 runs.

 

One problem with the above is that its a general stat - no context. For example, a sac bunt (resulting in an out) has a value of 1.031 runs. Why? It usually happens late and its an out that is specifically designed to get ONE run.

 

In general when a team starts an inning they expect to score .55 runs. That expectancy changes with each out/man on base combination. For example, if the leadoff man gets out, the expected runs go down to .297 runs. Leadoff man gets on, it goes to .953 runs.

 

So, even taking all of that into account, there is no difference in runs scoring if a batter strikes out vs a general out.

 

Again, the purpose of my question was aimed at those that are hung up on not the fact that he gets out but that the out is a K. Of course there are situations where a K is worse than a regular out (man on third, one out) but overall, a K is insignificant vs a standard out.

You can have numbers say anything you want. No way is striking out the same as hitting the ball. What if you he hits a routine fly ball to, lets say left field, and the lfer misjudges it and make an error. All kinds of things can happen when you hit the ball. One thing for a SO. Take a seat. You know what they say about stats. And thats what the Reds are.

You can have numbers say anything you want. No way is striking out the same as hitting the ball. What if you he hits a routine fly ball to, lets say left field, and the lfer misjudges it and make an error. All kinds of things can happen when you hit the ball. One thing for a SO. Take a seat. You know what they say about stats. And thats what the Reds are.

 

Classic.

 

Do you think I make this crap up?

 

You speak in generalities. I provide actual results.

 

There is no statistical difference between a K and an out in general AS IT IMPACTS RUNS SCORED.

 

By the way, just to play your game, the catcher could drop the 3rd strike with a man on 3rd base, right? Happens about as much as the LFers dropping the fly ball with less than 2 and a man on 3rd.

 

We can ASSUME all we want. Or we can actually go check to see what REALLY happens.

 

Obviously, you and I have gone opposite directions.

If you hit the ball you are putting pressure on the defense to make the play. If you strike out theres no pressure on the defense at all. I'll take my chances putting the ball in play. After saying that though, I am a Dunn fan and I hope they pick up his option.

If you hit the ball you are putting pressure on the defense to make the play. If you strike out theres no pressure on the defense at all. I'll take my chances putting the ball in play.

 

Again, logic would say you're right.

 

Unfortunately, stats do not back it up.

Reds lead 3-1 heading to the bottom of the 5th. All of the Reds runs courtesy of a Joey Votto 3 run homer. It's going to be an interesting winter for the Reds, with a lot of tough decisions for management, but I think the future is very bright for the Reds. :dancingpa

Again, logic would say you're right.

 

Unfortunately, stats do not back it up.

 

Stats only get ya so far You do have the stats to back it up though so no arguing from me... but imo I would stil rather have a productive out instead of a k.

Stats only get ya so far You do have the stats to back it up though so no arguing from me... but imo I would stil rather have a productive out instead of a k.

 

I think that's the point. Outs , in general, are killers regardless of how they happen. That's why some teams disdain the sac bunt other than in rare situations. Its also why teams don't like to try to steal. The runner thrown out stealing is the biggest rally killer there is.

Reds lead 3-1 heading to the bottom of the 5th. All of the Reds runs courtesy of a Joey Votto 3 run homer. It's going to be an interesting winter for the Reds, with a lot of tough decisions for management, but I think the future is very bright for the Reds. :dancingpa

 

I agree. This could be one of the more interesting hot stove leagues in quite a while.

 

Will WK keep his job?

 

Will Dunn's option get picked up?

 

Who will the manager be?

 

What about Jr? Do you keep him just so he can hit #600 as a Red?

 

Is Votto your first baseman going into Sarasota?

 

Do you trust your young arms to be better?

WK deserves at least another year. He has done a great job building our minor leagues system so far.

WK deserves at least another year. He has done a great job building our minor leagues system so far.

 

I think his fate is relying on what and how he does this offseason imo.

WK deserves at least another year. He has done a great job building our minor leagues system so far.

 

Despite what I'm hearing from my "source," I think WK is back next year.