You mean like playing maybe the worst game of his life against the Ravens in Week #1, then showing up at The Holy Grail the next night to face the music? That kind of leadership and facing tough situations?

 

Which makes a great person, great character. Not a leader on the field. When things start going badly during his whole career, in a game does he do much to help change the momentum? Or does his play usually get worst to? How has he done in big games? So I guess you believe his laid back demeanor is good for this team? His laid back demeanor is what can get us over the top even if everything around him was good? It's not like there is evidence or anything that he still plays bad in big moments even during his best seasons of 2013 and 2015.

 

See here is the problem. Dalton is a great guy, a true role model. The kind of guy you want your son to be. A guy who will face the criticism in tough times after games and show how to handle. However that doesn't mean he is the qb you need to lead a team.

 

It's not like I am the only one who thinks this. If you listened to Mo Egger today Tony Pike who obviously played qb and was in the NFL as a backup. Even talked about his laid back demeanor is not exactly what you want in a qb. When you look at the qbs who do make the big plays in big games and gets their teams over the top. They are not like that. Even he talked about yes the line is bad. However other qbs have bad lines too. But Dalton looks like he just accepts it and gives us on plays to fast. Doesn't try to give guys a chance to break open when rolling out with time and just throws it away. That even with time yesterday he was throwing balls at people's feet. He just accepts things to much and that gets back to his laid back demeanor.

 

He is a great guy. Doesn't mean he is a great qb or even a good one. Slightly better than average is what I think he is, and not a guy that really is going to light a fire under his teammates or inspire.

AD's stand up guy and undoubtedly the 3rd best QB this franchise has had in 50 years, behind Anderson and Esiason. He might be #2 when all is said and done. He is probably half way through his career. There is no doubt he can get better.

 

My biggest concern this year with him is his accuracy on the passes over 20 yards. He was #1 last year, he is mid 20's this year. That is concerning. That has nothing to do with leadership, but that does concern me. He has missed some pretty easy long throws this year that he has hit the last couple of years. He has reverted back to year 1 and 2 in that area.

 

There are plenty of QB's in the Hall of Fame with his type of personality Fouts and Montana to name two. He is not them and is not a HOFer, but you can win with his type of personality.

 

He has not shown that in 7 years. Even when he had good lines and talent to throw to. He still played poorly in big moments and big games. Even his best years 2013 and 2015 he struggled in those moments. So not sure how people can continue to say you can win with that personality. Joe Montana wasn't a get in your face guy, but he also wasn't a guy afraid of the moment. He wasn't a guy who missed the throws when they were there when their teams needed them the most.

 

It's been 7 years the book on him hasn't changed. He needs a lot around him to do well. Even then though in biggest moments you can't count on him to make the plays in big games.

He has not shown that in 7 years. Even when he had good lines and talent to throw to. He still played poorly in big moments and big games. Even his best years 2013 and 2015 he struggled in those moments. So not sure how people can continue to say you can win with that personality. Joe Montana wasn't a get in your face guy, but he also wasn't a guy afraid of the moment. He wasn't a guy who missed the throws when they were there when their teams needed them the most.

 

It's been 7 years the book on him hasn't changed. He needs a lot around him to do well. Even then though in biggest moments you can't count on him to make the plays in big games.

 

 

You really don't know how he is with teammates. Evrey game in the NFL is a big game. You could say yesterday was. They have a slim chance to make the playoffs if they won yesterday, almost none if they lose because I don't see them winning at both Jacksonville and Nashville. He makes as good a play as possible to Malone on the TD. No other QB could have done it better. He got crushed and stood there and didn't flinch and made a good enough throw, I think a great throw.

 

If some random Thursday or Monday Night game is a big game, that is misleading. They are games when it is the only game to watch and more people see him. Those almost always are really just another game. In his 4 playoff losses, he really played one awful half against San Diego that I put on him. The rest were not all on him.

 

However, he hasn't won a playoff game and that is a criticism of him that I get and agree with. Not enough to get rid of him, though. After the first two games this year, and he did make the throw to probably win the Texans game, but Eifert goes boneheaded and costs them, he has played pretty well considering the o-line.

 

AD is not an elite QB and I nhave never said he was. He is a better than average QB and always has them competitive. I have also said if we can get someone better, go get him. You can't say AJ because if he was better he would be playing. NFL coaches do not play guys because they like them. They play who gives them the best chance to win.

 

Tell me who is out there they can get that is better? I don't see it. If they could get Russell Wilson, let's do it, but those guys will never be released. There is no 2nd stringer any better. It's easy to complain, but unless it is AJ, there is no other option. I've gone through that earlier.

 

They could draft Lamar jackson or one of the QB's coming out in 2018, but that would be a mistake because they need o-line much much more than a QB.

You really don't know how he is with teammates. Evrey game in the NFL is a big game. You could say yesterday was. They have a slim chance to make the playoffs if they won yesterday, almost none if they lose because I don't see them winning at both Jacksonville and Nashville. He makes as good a play as possible to Malone on the TD. No other QB could have done it better. He got crushed and stood there and didn't flinch and made a good enough throw, I think a great throw.

 

If some random Thursday or Monday Night game is a big game, that is misleading. They are games when it is the only game to watch and more people see him. Those almost always are really just another game. In his 4 playoff losses, he really played one awful half against San Diego that I put on him. The rest were not all on him.

 

However, he hasn't won a playoff game and that is a criticism of him that I get and agree with. Not enough to get rid of him, though. After the first two games this year, and he did make the throw to probably win the Texans game, but Eifert goes boneheaded and costs them, he has played pretty well considering the o-line.

 

AD is not an elite QB and I nhave never said he was. He is a better than average QB and always has them competitive. I have also said if we can get someone better, go get him. You can't say AJ because if he was better he would be playing. NFL coaches do not play guys because they like them. They play who gives them the best chance to win.

 

Tell me who is out there they can get that is better? I don't see it. If they could get Russell Wilson, let's do it, but those guys will never be released. There is no 2nd stringer any better. It's easy to complain, but unless it is AJ, there is no other option. I've gone through that earlier.

 

They could draft Lamar jackson or one of the QB's coming out in 2018, but that would be a mistake because they need o-line much much more than a QB.

 

I agree with this. Also, Andy has 15 4th quarter comebacks so it's not like he folds under pressure every time. He has more comebacks than Cam Newton and Aaron Rodgers. The only quarterback who has more come from behind victories that came into the league the same year as him or afterwards is Russell Wilson.

You really don't know how he is with teammates. Evrey game in the NFL is a big game. You could say yesterday was. They have a slim chance to make the playoffs if they won yesterday, almost none if they lose because I don't see them winning at both Jacksonville and Nashville. He makes as good a play as possible to Malone on the TD. No other QB could have done it better. He got crushed and stood there and didn't flinch and made a good enough throw, I think a great throw.

 

If some random Thursday or Monday Night game is a big game, that is misleading. They are games when it is the only game to watch and more people see him. Those almost always are really just another game. In his 4 playoff losses, he really played one awful half against San Diego that I put on him. The rest were not all on him.

 

However, he hasn't won a playoff game and that is a criticism of him that I get and agree with. Not enough to get rid of him, though. After the first two games this year, and he did make the throw to probably win the Texans game, but Eifert goes boneheaded and costs them, he has played pretty well considering the o-line.

 

AD is not an elite QB and I nhave never said he was. He is a better than average QB and always has them competitive. I have also said if we can get someone better, go get him. You can't say AJ because if he was better he would be playing. NFL coaches do not play guys because they like them. They play who gives them the best chance to win.

 

Tell me who is out there they can get that is better? I don't see it. If they could get Russell Wilson, let's do it, but those guys will never be released. There is no 2nd stringer any better. It's easy to complain, but unless it is AJ, there is no other option. I've gone through that earlier.

 

They could draft Lamar jackson or one of the QB's coming out in 2018, but that would be a mistake because they need o-line much much more than a QB.

 

Like it or not prime time games are big games. Even players get more excited for that. Here record in prime time and playoff games are horrible. Usually those games are against good teams. His record vs teams with winning records is not good. He does have a very good record against teams with bad records though. Which I admit is good to beat the teams you are suppose to beat.

 

As for McCarron idk if he is better or not. Neither of us do. However to say if he was better he would be playing is simply no true. We have seen Marvin Lewis for what 14 years now. The reason he loves veterans is because he knows what they are. He doesn't play rookies or even young guys as much because he doesn't trust them. He is a play it safe type of coach. The Bengals have made playoffs with Dalton. There is zero chance someone like Marvin would take a risk and go with a qb you won't know about unless he plays.

 

As I pointed out if Dalton is going to get credit for making the playoffs in 2011, 2012, and 2014 when he didn't do to much to help those years. It was more great defense and great running game in 2014. Then why is it not ok to blame him for bad years?

 

The fact that there always is some excuse for why Dalton doesn't do something well speaks volumes to me.

 

His laid back demeanor and his failure against good teams, and in big moments is fact and 7 years shows that. Not sure how you can continue to argue that. Dalton probably has been more fortunate than any qb in Bengals history with what he has had around him most of his career. Most of his career a top 10 defense. Most of his career good talent to throw to including a top 5 wr. Most of his career a good line. Yet against good teams and big games it's been the same with him. Yet it's always some excuse.

 

We waited a few more years than we should have by keeping Marvin. I'm sorry I don't want to waste a few more by keeping Dalton before people say hmmm, maybe we should have moved on a few years ago. Which is what has happened by keeping Marvin.

Now the question, with trade deadline looming, would you have taken the deal the Patriots took with Jimmy G, a second round pick for Mccarron? Do you take a chance with arbitration you keep him under control another year or do you shop him knowing you aren't going to make the playoffs this year.

I agree with this. Also, Andy has 15 4th quarter comebacks so it's not like he folds under pressure every time. He has more comebacks than Cam Newton and Aaron Rodgers. The only quarterback who has more come from behind victories that came into the league the same year as him or afterwards is Russell Wilson.

 

Most against teams with losing records that they shouldn't have been losing to anyways.

Now the question, with trade deadline looming, would you have taken the deal the Patriots took with Jimmy G, a second round pick for Mccarron? Do you take a chance with arbitration you keep him under control another year or do you shop him knowing you aren't going to make the playoffs this year.

 

I take the chance to keep him under arbitration and trade Dalton in the off season. Maybe he would be worth a 1st round pick. Then use the money i saved by trading Dalton to get lineman in free agency and use the first round pick I got on a lineman. Possibly use both first round picks on lineman unless one of those qbs are there. Then I draft one but roll with McCarron. If McCarron fails then you have a qb of the future ready. If McCarron does good, then you have a trade chip in the first round qb. Then also use rest of draft on lineman.

 

However I know I am in the minority. Majority of people still believe in Dalton. What's crazy is it Dalton plays in 2015 and loses to Pittsburgh in the playoffs like he probably would have. More people would want him gone. However that injury kind of saved him in terms of what people think. Since we will never know, people will always like to think with him we beat Pittsburgh. When history though says otherwise.

Most against teams with losing records that they shouldn't have been losing to anyways.

This is a false narrative. AD has the third highest winning percentage of active quarterbacks with 4th quarterback comebacks against winning teams. 5-18 for 21.74%. Top QB by far is Russell Wilson and number 2 is Tom Brady. Based on a qualifying 10 games.

 

QBs entering the 4th quarter trailing against teams that finish the season with a winning record : nfl

 

He's also in the top portion on wins on the road against winning teams.

 

Analyzing the 'wins on the road against winning teams' narrative - Pride Of Detroit

 

Now, his playoff record stinks is where it matters most.

Most against teams with losing records that they shouldn't have been losing to anyways.

 

I assume you don't like Rodgers, Ryan, Brees and Stafford either? Their records against winning teams are terrible.

 

Basically, AD is Alex Smith and Matt Stafford. A middle of the road quarterback that can win games. Do you pay AD like they paid those two? Or do you take your chance of a journeyman quarterback and hope they turn out ok.

I assume you don't like Rodgers, Ryan, Brees and Stafford either? Their records against winning teams are terrible.

 

Basically, AD is Alex Smith and Matt Stafford. A middle of the road quarterback that can win games. Do you pay AD like they paid those two? Or do you take your chance of a journeyman quarterback and hope they turn out ok.

 

Why does it have to be a journey man qb? Also I have already said numerous times I am willing to take the chance to move on from Dalton. Let's not do the same thing that we did with Marvin Lewis by keeping him longer than we should. Just because we're scared that a new coach may do worst than Marvin and take us back to the 90s. I'm done with the conservative mindset of Marvin, the conservative mindset of Dalton, and the conservative mindset of fans who fear moving on from Dalton. We aren't getting over the top with Dalton Even with a good line. We already seen that. So yes getting a new qb could lead us to terrible or could lead us to getting us where Dalton couldnt.

Why does it have to be a journey man qb? Also I have already said numerous times I am willing to take the chance to move on from Dalton. Let's not do the same thing that we did with Marvin Lewis by keeping him longer than we should. Just because we're scared that a new coach may do worst than Marvin and take us back to the 90s. I'm done with the conservative mindset of Marvin, the conservative mindset of Dalton, and the conservative mindset of fans who fear moving on from Dalton. We aren't getting over the top with Dalton Even with a good line. We already seen that. So yes getting a new qb could lead us to terrible or could lead us to getting us where Dalton couldnt.

 

One thing I would like to see... Dalton with a different head coach....

 

Marvin has coached with Kitna, Palmer, Fitzpatrick and Dalton... hasn’t won big games with any of them....

 

Dalton has only had Marvin.... he’s had a few coordinators and he obviously did better with the better coordinators, Gruden and Jackson... hmmmm... just maybe he’d do better with a great head coach, just a thought.

One thing I would like to see... Dalton with a different head coach....

 

Marvin has coached with Kitna, Palmer, Fitzpatrick and Dalton... hasn’t won big games with any of them....

 

Dalton has only had Marvin.... he’s had a few coordinators and he obviously did better with the better coordinators, Gruden and Jackson... hmmmm... just maybe he’d do better with a great head coach, just a thought.

 

He has had 2 years where people can say ha was better than just average 2013 and 2015. Even in those years with good lines, skill guys, etc. He looked exactly the same in the sitautuons he struggles in. Kind of like a front runner. When things are going well he is awesome. Hence his record against bad teams. When things start going down hill especially against good teams he struggles. Don't you think it's sad we may know the type of game Dalton will have against a good team by the end of the first quarter? That's because he is not someone who figures it out and gets better as the game goes on. Or the Bengals leading and the other team makes a few big plays in a row and get the lead. It's rare at that point that Dalton makes a play to change the momentum back. In fact he usually adds to it by then pressing and making a bad play himself.

 

So while yes I think a new coach would be good for the team as a whole. I don't think a new coach is going make Dalton the type of qb who handles the big moments well against good teams. His lack of leadership and demeanor shows that in 7 years so far.

 

I hope Dalton proves me wrong because he is the type of person you want to see do well. However the book on him has basically been the same all 7 years. Plus honestly I'm tired of hearing well he needs this or that. Basically he needs a perfect team around him. A great line, great skill guys, great backs. As long as he has that he can look good. Don't you think that's a problem? Shouldn't the qb help make his teammates better, and not the other way around? Then Even when he had all that in 2013 and 2015 he still struggled in those moments.

Dalton has been like the LeBron James of football with all the talk every year of well Dalton needs more help he needs this or that. It's never Dalton for some people it's always well he needs better skill guys, better backs, better line, etc. The problem is how many qbs have all that stuff? A great line, a great back, great receivers? Yet if Dalton struggles it's always because he needs more help. How about having a qb that helps make his teammates better. Or a qb who may inspire his teammates. Or a qb with a fire in him or a passion that players want to rally behind. A guy that will hold others accountable. All those things usually good or great qbs have some of those variables. Dalton has none. Dalton has he is a a great person which everyone likes. Who if he has a lot of help in all areas can look better than just an average qb. I'm sorry if I just don't see that as being a qb we will ever truly win big with no matter who is coach.

 

Imo you can put Dalton on any team in the NFL and he would not win a super bowl with them. Which I am sure people will say oh well he needs more help.

Dalton has been like the LeBron James of football with all the talk every year of well Dalton needs more help he needs this or that. It's never Dalton for some people it's always well he needs better skill guys, better backs, better line, etc. The problem is how many qbs have all that stuff? A great line, a great back, great receivers? Yet if Dalton struggles it's always because he needs more help. How about having a qb that helps make his teammates better. Or a qb who may inspire his teammates. Or a qb with a fire in him or a passion that players want to rally behind. A guy that will hold others accountable. All those things usually good or great qbs have some of those variables. Dalton has none. Dalton has he is a a great person which everyone likes. Who if he has a lot of help in all areas can look better than just an average qb. I'm sorry if I just don't see that as being a qb we will ever truly win big with no matter who is coach.

 

Imo you can put Dalton on any team in the NFL and he would not win a super bowl with them. Which I am sure people will say oh well he needs more help.

The Lebron James of football? I get what you are trying to say but you could have used a better analogy.