I think that knowing myself personally, and many of you NKY 4A people, you would hate this....wait until you win that firt 4A or 5A trophy....and you didn't have to beat any of the Big III.....bittersweet, IMO.

Look, no offense, but many of our schools haven't exactly been 4A for a long time. Up until about 7 years ago, none of us really cared about "that" side of the football spectrum(except for Boone and Campbell). Most of us have been 3A for the majority of the programs lifespan. But if you told the folks from NKY that their district could be Boone, Conner, Ryle, SK, Dixie, Highlands, and CovCath........well I'm sure they'd be pretty happy to win a state title from that class. Probably a lot more than one over the Rocks or Tigers to be honest. We know you guys are good, we get it. If we ever stop building schools and have a school your size(we currently have HALF the number of boys you do) I'm sure we'd be glad to play in a class with you guys. Just as Boone Co. was glad to when it was one of two schools in Boone Co. But to say that winning a state title against our neighborhood rivals wouldn't be meaningful because we didn't beat the Rocks or the Tigers......well that's just silly.

4A cannot compete within their class, so they yell unfair, and want something created so they can have a piece of the pie whether they deserve it or not.

 

The smaller schools don't have to play the larger schools as it is now...so why the need for a change.

 

Because the larger schools beat up on each other too much.

That and more revenue.

I am still trying to grasp the size of the school issue. I am not familiar with 2A, but it seems only 4A is dominated by the bigger schools. I do know HHS is far from being the one of the largest schools in 3A. And Beechwood is certainly not the largest in 1A, and they seem to be able to compete. All of this seems generated by 4A schools that cannot compete within their class, so they yell unfair, and want something created so they can have a piece of the pie whether they deserve it or not. If you cant tell by now, I am opposed to increasing classes, and not one post on here has even begun to sway my opinion. I see no reason for it.

Here's the difference.

 

HHS- approx. 420 boys

Top in current 3A - approx. 500 boys

 

Beechwood - approx. 180 boys

Top in currrent 1A - approx. 275 boys

 

Ryle- approx. 750 boys

Dixie- approx. 630 boys

Top in current 4A - approx. 1450 boys

 

Anyone see a BIG difference? No where else is the disparity so great for so many teams than in 4A. Is 6 classes the answer? I'm not sure. While HHS may not be at the top of current 3A in enrollment, they certainly aren't far off(80 boys) in comparison to Ryle(700 boys). In math terms, the problem is that we have a couple of outliers(T and X) that are skewing the numbers. T and X have almost 300 more boys than ALL others schools in 4A, no other class has one team with 300 more boys than the other.

I take that back alittle.....

There are positives in it, like most things pros and cons.

 

 

But still, adding two classes seemed like alot.

 

And I would still like to see the class champions play each other.

 

If the small schools get chances to play larger schools in baseball, basketball, etc. tourneys for a championship, why not let them have a shot in football.

 

Or is the fact that they probably wouldn't win a multi-game district but would only have to win ONE game too much to risk.

OR22,

 

Just to be clear, it will be six even classes with no super class. The super class will be considered for the future but the current agreement is for 4 years so the first chance we will have at any super classes is 2011.

 

 

Here's the before and after effect of the class expansion:

 

% difference of largest to smallest school in 6 classification system (size differential):

 

6A - 112%

5A - 31%

4A - 23%

3A - 22%

2A - 51%

1A - 285%

 

% difference in 4 classification system (pre-change):

 

4A - 152%

3A - 43%

2A - 44%

1A - 395%

 

 

Heck, the size difference in the smallest 2A to largest 5A (in the 6 Class proposal) is barely bigger than the % difference from smallest to largest 6A team, and worse, is THREE TIMES LESS than the difference of smallest to largest 1A team... :sssh: :eek:

 

IMO, this makes it glaringly apparent that a class system with a smaller "upper 20" and "lower 20" classes is needed even MORE than going from 4 to 6 classes...!!

 

 

:bunny:

No I don't. Oh you forgot Scott. HHS and CCHS would dominate that district year in and year out. But that cant be. Smaller schools cant compete with really big schools thats why we need more classes. As for Beechwood they would finish 3rd or 4th most years therefore securing a playoff spot. Nobody said anything about these schools winning a state title in 4A. I just think you shouldn't look down your nose at the smaller schools. In NKY its not the size of the dog in the fight, but the fight in the dog that prevails.

But HHS and CovCath HAVEN'T dominated those teams. My school, Ryle, in only its 4th year of existence, beat the mighty Bluebirds back in the 3A days. HHS and Boone and CovCath and Boone have played some great games, and I don't think one side can claim dominance, nor would they. Beechwood and Ryle played some great games in the late 90's as well. And I think what Mr. Sandman is trying to say is that its not like NKY 4A is the cream of the crop when it comes to 4A over the past few years. Do I think Beechwood, HHS, and CovCath would play close competitive games with the majority of current 4A? You betcha. Dominate? No way. And I don't think you'll get anyone from those schools to say that either.

I think that knowing myself personally, and many of you NKY 4A people, you would hate this....wait until you win that firt 4A or 5A trophy....and you didn't have to beat any of the Big III.....bittersweet, IMO.

 

Is the joy of winning a current 4A championship diminished (bittersweet to use your word) by the thought of winning it from, on average, schools that are half the size of yours?

 

If not, why would winning a new 4A or 5A championship be diminished if the road didn't pass through the Big 3?

Here's the before and after effect of the class expansion:

 

% difference of largest to smallest school in 6 classification system (size differential):

 

6A - 112%

5A - 31%

4A - 23%

3A - 22%

2A - 51%

1A - 285%

 

% difference in 4 classification system (pre-change):

 

4A - 152%

3A - 43%

2A - 44%

1A - 395%

 

 

Heck, the size difference in the smallest 2A to largest 5A (in the 6 Class proposal) is barely bigger than the % difference from smallest to largest 6A team, and worse, is THREE TIMES LESS than the difference of smallest to largest 1A team... :sssh: :eek:

 

IMO, this makes it glaringly apparent that a class system with a smaller "upper 20" and "lower 20" classes is needed even MORE than going from 4 to 6 classes...!!

 

 

:bunny:

Agreed on the need for upper 20 and lower 20 in the 6 class system. As I mentioned earlier, the problem is the outliers, the really large and really small schools that skew the numbers(or in this case percentages).

Here's the before and after effect of the class expansion:

 

% difference of largest to smallest school in 6 classification system (size differential):

 

6A - 112%

5A - 31%

4A - 23%

3A - 22%

2A - 51%

1A - 285%

 

% difference in 4 classification system (pre-change):

 

4A - 152%

3A - 43%

2A - 44%

1A - 395%

 

 

Heck, the size difference in the smallest 2A to largest 5A (in the 6 Class proposal) is barely bigger than the % difference from smallest to largest 6A team, and worse, is THREE TIMES LESS than the difference of smallest to largest 1A team... :sssh: :eek:

 

IMO, this makes it glaringly apparent that a class system with a smaller "upper 20" and "lower 20" classes is needed even MORE than going from 4 to 6 classes...!!

 

 

:bunny:

 

 

Good post! But.....

 

Was the idea of additional classes to even out both the 4A and 1A classes repectively?

 

 

I don't know, the difference from largest to smallest just shows the effect on only 2 schools in a class.

 

How about the number of schools that are within similar population? I mean, are most schools relatively close to each other or is it a drastic difference for the majority?

 

Where are you getting your numbers?

Do I think Beechwood, HHS, and CovCath would play close competitive games with the majority of current 4A? You betcha. Dominate? No way. And I don't think you'll get anyone from those schools to say that either.

 

Agreed.

 

:thumb:

 

which is why they play in different classes already!

I look forward to your arrival when we reclassify so you can thump us, matter of fact I will lead a charge at my school if you guys want to go all the way up to. 6A

I guess I got off point here. I took exception to your statement inviting Beechwood to your dist. as you believed they would struggle. Whats the point? Beechwood is as good a program as any other, in NKY why throw rocks at them. Sensing some arrogance from the 4A faction I couldnt resist from heaving a few boulders myself:p

Is the joy of winning a current 4A championship diminished (bittersweet to use your word) by the thought of winning it from, on average, schools that are half the size of yours?

 

If not, why would winning a new 4A or 5A championship be diminished if the road didn't pass through the Big 3?

First, know because a huge percantage of our kids in the school don't play...roughly 11%-12%...so that's relative IMO...

 

2 - The Big III are the staple of success in the big boy class. To not have to go through that, would be terrible IMO.....

 

Envision winning the World Series with out Boston, the Yankees, or St. Louis (HUGE PAYROLL) not being in the league. Sounds great? NOPE.

First, know because a huge percantage of our kids in the school don't play...roughly 11%-12%...so that's relative IMO...

 

2 - The Big III are the staple of success in the big boy class. To not have to go through that, would be terrible IMO.....

 

Envision winning the World Series with out Boston, the Yankees, or St. Louis (HUGE PAYROLL) not being in the league. Sounds great? NOPE.

I'm a Cubs fan. It sounds wonderful!!! :bunny:

I guess I got off point here. I took exception to your statement inviting Beechwood to your dist. as you believed they would struggle. Whats the point? Beechwood is as good a program as any other, in NKY why throw rocks at them. Sensing some arrogance from the 4A faction I couldnt resist from heaving a few boulders myself:p

Actually my ire got pricked when someone said LLoyd who we play would do well against the 4A boys. I respect and root for the Tigers. But it seems ludicrous to say that the listed 1A and 2A teams would do well in 4A, so lets have one class. My posts were just trying to point out that there are different classes right now and for good reason. I would never advocate Beechwood or NCC moving up to 4A, or any 2A school for that matter either. I believe they should be aloud to compete against like sized competition. By that I mean, I like the 4A system we have, but are loosing.

First, know because a huge percantage of our kids in the school don't play...roughly 11%-12%...so that's relative IMO...

 

2 - The Big III are the staple of success in the big boy class. To not have to go through that, would be terrible IMO.....

 

Envision winning the World Series with out Boston, the Yankees, or St. Louis (HUGE PAYROLL) not being in the league. Sounds great? NOPE.

We have about the same percentage, so we have 65 and you guys have 150.

 

"Red means run son, and numbers add up to nothing." My favorite Neil Young quote.