I think there were between 10-12 charging calls made in the Bourbon-Clark Co game this past week. Pure judgement call.

Then on the other end the big kid barely bumps into the smaller player and the ref calls a foul because the smaller kid isn't strong enough to take the bump. I see this all the time!

:thumb: Big kid, foul target always. Especially at the middle school level where you can have some kids who are much bigger than others...

Who knows the requirements for a player control foul?

Who knows the requirements for a player control foul?

 

I don't.

I don't.

 

Can the defender be moving?

Can the defender be moving?

 

Clyde, why don't you just go ahead and educate us? To answer your question, I believe that a player can be moving and still draw a charge. Please go ahead and fill us in on the rest.

 

For the record in case anyone hasn't seen me rant on this in other threads, I hate the way officials call charging. I have nothing against a defender getting position and drawing a charge. But way too often I see defenders still sliding side to side or moving into the offensive player to create the contact and still getting the charging call. The one that really gets me is the offensive player jumping to his left or right to avoid contact, the defender continues to slide sideways to create the contact and the official still calls charging. I am all for a very strict calling of the charge, making the defender clearly establish position and stop moving side to side, and do not call the charge unless it is very clearly a charge. Do that and a lot of flopping will go away and we will see a much better calibre of basketball.

Clyde, why don't you just go ahead and educate us? To answer your question, I believe that a player can be moving and still draw a charge. Please go ahead and fill us in on the rest.

 

For the record in case anyone hasn't seen me rant on this in other threads, I hate the way officials call charging. I have nothing against a defender getting position and drawing a charge. But way too often I see defenders still sliding side to side or moving into the offensive player to create the contact and still getting the charging call. The one that really gets me is the offensive player jumping to his left or right to avoid contact, the defender continues to slide sideways to create the contact and the official still calls charging. I am all for a very strict calling of the charge, making the defender clearly establish position and stop moving side to side, and do not call the charge unless it is very clearly a charge. Do that and a lot of flopping will go away and we will see a much better calibre of basketball.

What VoR said.

My complaint is when a player simulates being fouled. I know I'm old and it's been a long time since I played. "disclaimer" (I in no way advocate intentionally hurting another player" Now, when I played and a player basically faked fouls, over and over. He payed for it. No coach involvement. You fake one and get by with it, good for you, you try to make a living at it, you didn't have to fake anything. Everyone, especially you, knew you were fouled. With the evolution of basketball to the physical sport it is today. Teaching players to take a charge is a part of the game. Teaching players to take a flop if they are bumped, is as cheap as under cutting a player on a layup. I'm not complaining because I'm a little guy that got pushed around, I'm 6'2 and on the north side of 240#, granted I didn't weigh that in school but I wasn't runt by any means. I just think it takes away from the game. I as well know coaches that teach the flop complain when they don't get the ticky tacky flop foul called. They as well complain if it's done to them. Man up, take a charge, if there is one, but don't flop on the floor every time someone bumps into you. Play Basketball!!!!!!!!!!!!

I think you can be moving but its usually called a block. The charge is a good defensive play and I commend all players who attempt them.

As for the discussion on the half circle... In high school basketball a charge should not be determined upon by a players position on the floor. In college and the NBA it should because they have the half circle. High school does not have the circle so if a defender takes a charge were that circle would be than it should still be called a charge, IMO.

This is one of the most misunderstood calls in the game of basketball,IMO. When did the charging foul change from running over a player, to bump and flop? :confused:

With today's dribble drive and spread offenses in vogue there are more real charges due to the offensive player being intent on getting to the basket and as a result lowering his head and becoming out of control. An out of control player will not be Rewarded with a foul on the defender.

On the otherhand, how many times have you seen the 6'5 kid get slapped and smacked as he is shooting and he goes through contact, the ref doesn't call the foul because the big kid doesn't stop his shooting motion, but the shot is missed. Then on the other end the big kid barely bumps into the smaller player and the ref calls a foul because the smaller kid isn't strong enough to take the bump. I see this all the time! It is all subjective.

Great point, see it all the time. Big kids dont get the calls.

The key to the call is the defender establishing a " defensive position in the path" of the offensive player...the dribbler must then avoid contact by changing direction or ending dribble. A defender can move laterally with an offensive player and still have obtained a defensive position. The defensive player does not need to be "set" or not moving, just having had established that defensive position. A defender standing still in the path of a driving offensive player is much easier to call than when both players are moving. Most calls will go "block" on a defender if they are moving unless 1) the offensive player drops the shoulder or 2) a clear defensive position was established. (Frequently the offensive player will initiate the contact in these situations)

 

As for both players going down...when there is a wreck, you should have a whistle, unless.....in the opinion of the official (unwritten) the wreck had no impact on the play (think layup, contact under board after shot) you can still have a block (typically) in this situation, but unless the collision is a true violent wreck, most officials will tell both to get up and play on.

Teaching players to take a charge is a part of the game. Teaching players to take a flop if they are bumped, is as cheap as under cutting a player on a layup.

 

 

A player "simulating" being fouled, flopping, if it interferes with the play and endangers the offensive player, will get the block call much lower in the paint than a flop out beyond where the semi-circle would be. IMO if the "flop" risks injury, stick the defender for the block, report it and play ball.

The key to the call is the defender establishing a " defensive position in the path" of the offensive player...the dribbler must then avoid contact by changing direction or ending dribble. A defender can move laterally with an offensive player and still have obtained a defensive position. The defensive player does not need to be "set" or not moving, just having had established that defensive position. A defender standing still in the path of a driving offensive player is much easier to call than when both players are moving. Most calls will go "block" on a defender if they are moving unless 1) the offensive player drops the shoulder or 2) a clear defensive position was established. (Frequently the offensive player will initiate the contact in these situations)

 

As for both players going down...when there is a wreck, you should have a whistle, unless.....in the opinion of the official (unwritten) the wreck had no impact on the play (think layup, contact under board after shot) you can still have a block (typically) in this situation, but unless the collision is a true violent wreck, most officials will tell both to get up and play on.

 

Pretty good recap , BirdBrain.

 

By rule it doesn't matter where the contact occurs on the floor. Your example of being under the basket after a layup has been made does not preclude a call. I assume your "unwritten" comment means that you believe many officials will not call it that way. You could be correct.

 

One thing you left out is that the contact by the offensive player has to be made to the torso of the defender. That's why contact is not always a foul even if the defensive player has legal guarding position. If the defender is standing there and the offensive player slides to the side and the contact is not to the torso it's nothing.

 

The biggest challenge is the drive to the basket and the the defender moves over to get into the path. Did he/she get there before the shooter left the ground? If not, it's a block. Tough call sometimes.