Big difference between McVeigh and Al-awlaki. Al-awlaki publicly declared himself an enemy of the US. What more do you need? There is nothing to go to court and prove. To Bluegrass' comment above, I think Al-awlaki was killed in field operations acting as an enemy combatant directly against the US. the field has changed in the war on terror, just like it changed with the advent of guerrilla war fare during the revolutionary times.

This is a reasonable question. Very reasonable.

 

Awlaki was an American citizen. Had he been killed in normal field operations acting as an enemy combatant directly against US military forces he would have been more than fair game. But that is not the case. He was specifically targeted for assassination. Not capture, not trial. He was given a death sentence without a trial, without a conviction - nothing in a US court. He was just labeled a terrorist and targeted.

 

Had the US revoked Awlaki's citizenship this may have been legal. Had the US held a trial and convicted Awlaki of terrorism and sentenced him to death this may have been legal.

 

But all they did was put a label on him and killed him with no formal due process what so ever - an American Citizen.

 

I am not saying Awlaki did not get what he deserves but the method and lack of process should make every US citizen shutter. This is a dangerous precedent.

 

Additional by MSM:

 

http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/politics/2011/09/the-us-case-against-awlaki/

 

I'd agree with that.

 

But, to further complicate the issue...isn't this what police/SWAT teams are called upon to do?

I think one big difference between the two is the time. McVeigh's trial occurred prior to 9/11, prior to the United States declaring war on terror. Things have changed dramatically over the last 10 years. I think a better barometer would be to see how a McVeigh situation would be handled today.

 

I agree it is a dangerous precedent. It also leads me to another question. Can we declare war on an idea? We call it the War on Terror. So basically anyone who is viewed as a terrorist is an enemy combatant? So, what defines whether a person is a terrorist, and thus an enemy combatant? How do you prosecute a war against terror? How far does it go? Is it just Islamic terrorists or anyone who is a terrorist?

 

Ironically, those were the premises I posted many years ago in some epic aguments about going into Iraq. :lol:

I'd agree with that.

 

But, to further complicate the issue...isn't this what police/SWAT teams are called upon to do?

 

Yes, if the gunman/gunmen are armed.

 

I have never heard of a SWAT team being told to go find someone and kill them even if they are not armed .

You can't have said that it's cool for the US govt to spy on email and phone calls and NOW be bothered by an assassination of a citizen . You're either for rights being revoked in the name of fighting terrorism or you're against it completely. That's why we have the term "slippery slope." Once you start......

Why was Timothy McVeigh given a trial then? Using that logic, shouldn't they have just put a bullet between his eyes when they arrested him?

Nope. He was easily captured on our own territory. No dangerous military mission necessary. And he was an American citizen, which al-Awlaki no longer was.

Nope. He was easily captured on our own territory. No dangerous military mission necessary. And he was an American citizen, which al-Awlaki no longer was.

 

When did the US revoke his citizenship? :confused:

Citizen or not, like BF said, once you cross that line and draw arms against the US you lose your rights. And I'm not talking about the terrorist Tea Party either. I'm talking Al-Queda terrorists and the like. They better be glad I can't be POTUS because they would get no trial just bullets to the head without hesitation. It's funny. I'm the liberal screaming no rights and to kill them all and the Obama haters want the guy to go to trial. He already had a trial and he lost. The judge threw out the trial his dad brought forth against Obama. That's enough for me. Who's next on the list?

When did the US revoke his citizenship? :confused:

How about when he renounced his US citizenship by moving to Yemen where he began plotting to kill American citizens. Good enough for me.

Do we as citizens need to see real evidence against a fellow citizen or do we simply let the "terrorist" label suffice?

Do we as citizens need to see real evidence against a fellow citizen or do we simply let the "terrorist" label suffice?

As described on Wikipedia he was a senior talent recruiter and motivator who had become "operational" as a planner and trainer for al-Qaeda. He was implicated in helping to motivate at least three attacks on U.S. soil. I don't think "fellow citizen" applied any longer. An enemy of the state would be a better description.

As described on Wikipedia he was a senior talent recruiter and motivator who had become "operational" as a planner and trainer for al-Qaeda. He was implicated in helping to motivate at least three attacks on U.S. soil. I don't think "fellow citizen" applied any longer. An enemy of the state would be a better description.

 

What? Wikipedia said it?

 

Come on. That's now our required evidence?

I'm rolling with RTS in this thread. Word up.

 

Cheers.

 

*raises beer*

This guy may indeed be 100% guilty. That's not the issue.

 

We are now lowering our standards of proof and rights in the name of terrorism.

 

That cannot be a good thing.

I'd agree with that.

 

But, to further complicate the issue...isn't this what police/SWAT teams are called upon to do?

 

Only if they themselves or others are in danger. Basically self defense during apprehension.

 

If the US had done a Osama-like raid and Awlaki was killed 'resisting' like Osama - so be it.

 

But was open policy to kill this US Citizen with no due process.

 

Also, our intelligence groups kill foreign nationals for security reasons. But they are not citizens and it is not open policy.

 

Awlaki was as of today a US Citizen, contrary to some postings. If he had his citizenship formally revoked then this may not be as alarming. But the peoples government did not do that. They just put him on a list and executed him. A US Citizen.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anwar_al-Awlaki

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Targeted_killing

 

If this is 'OK' I never want to here any more complaints about the Patriot Act or Gitmo.