I figured we just needed to go ahead and create a thread to talk about Palmer. I just read through that long discussion about him on the TO thread, and obviously this is going to something we discuss on here a lot this season. So might as well have a thread just about him for people to go to through the season, because its something that definitely will get talked about if he is doing really well, or if he is struggling.

I'll start the chants:

 

OVERRATED!!! clap..clap...clap, clap, clap!!!! (By Bengals fans, no one else thinks he's anything special:D)

I'll start the chants:

 

OVERRATED!!! clap..clap...clap, clap, clap!!!! (By Bengals fans, no one else thinks he's anything special:D)

 

Once again, I'll ask the question, since no one will answer....How is a QB that is at best thought of as middle of the road overrated?

Nothing special. Hasn't proven anything late in seasons. One real playoff performance that stunk. Inaccurate with average arm strength.

Nothing special. Hasn't proven anything late in seasons. One real playoff performance that stunk. Inaccurate with average arm strength.

 

Average arm strength? :lol:

I think he'll be better this season. I'm not a Bengals fan by any means (Browns fan actually) but I think he'll have a solid season and come close to matching his 2006 season. He has a good offensive core, if he can stay healthy then he should fare pretty well.

Time to play guess the QB (these stats are 5 QBs over the same two year period).....

 

Player A:

 

669-1029, 65%, 7,871 yds, 60 TDs, 24 INTs, 97.5 QB Rating

 

Player B:

 

715-1220, 58.6%, 7,766 yds, 38 TDs, 47 INTs, 71.8 QB Rating

 

Player C:

 

679-1054, 64.4%, 7,994 yds, 50 TDs, 26 INTs, 92.7 QB Rating

 

Player D:

 

667-1010, 66%, 8,144 yds, 59 TDs, 19 INTs, 102.6 QB Rating

 

Player E:

 

653-1046, 62.4%, 7,639 yds, 50 TDs, 26 INTs, 90.1 QB Rating

 

 

How's that for stats for ya Spindoc....

I read a lot of interesting post in the TO thread. People say he is overrated, they say he has always been just average (3x'sCats) and all that stuff. All that is fine because everyone has their own opinion. However to say that only Bengal fans thought of him as a top 5 QB is wrong. Most people around the NFL thought of him as a top 5 QB in 2005 and 2006. So the real question is what has changed?

 

People will say he has not been the same since the knee injury. Well if that injury was the problem then you think his first year back after the injury would have been his worst. However no it was not, he put up great numbers and was considered a top 5 QB still after that year. Even drove his teams down to what should have been wins to get them in the playoffs. So the knee injury is not what has changed about him. 2007 Rudi Johnson hit the NFL wall of runningbacks and became washed up. Rich Braham career ended, Willie Anderson didn't play that much, and Levi started going down hill. Not to mention Chris Henry suspended for first 8 games, so he couldn't help much that year. So a lot of things changed in 2007, but yet he still passed for 4000 yards and 26 touchdowns. Not bad considering the circumstances, would be hard for an average QB to do. 2008 only played 3 games, so enough said about that. 2009 had basically one receiver, but was doing well early in the year and led them on game winning drives before Henry's unfortunate death.

 

Style of play also will determine how a QB will do. 2005-2007 when Palmer looked like a top 5 QB and at worst top 10 they were pass first. 2009 they were run first. The top QB's in the league play in pass first offenses, and are allowed to get in a rhythm because of it. Not to mention also easier to make all receivers look good in pass first offenses. However all these top QB's also have very good receiving cores, something Palmer did not have since 2007. So to look just at how he had done, and not really evaluate the whole thing about everything is not really looking at the big picture.

 

I will agree with people who say he is not a top 10 QB right now because he definitely was not anymore basing on just the eye test. However what I have argued all along, is if he is given the same opportunties like these other top QB's then we will see him being one of the top QB's again. He has that around him this year, so if I am wrong and he still is just average. Then I will eat all the crow that you all want to give.

However about the Steve Young thing. Even though I believe if Palmer has around him like the other top QB's in the league that he would be a top 5 QB again. I do not think he is as good as Steve Young. I mean no reason for anyone to make that comparison at this time. Steve Young won a MVP, Super Bowl and is a Hall of Famer. So I do not agree with whoever said that.

I'll say Player B is Brett Favre. I'm guessing the "two-year period" isn't from the last two years anyway. Favre threw a ton of INT's in a two year span and I'm guessing you're using good QB's to compare so that's my guess.

Once again, I'll ask the question, since no one will answer....How is a QB that is at best thought of as middle of the road overrated?

 

See FC's post. Some Bengals guys think he's a legit top 5 guy now. Better than Rodgers? Better than Big Ben? Better than Favre? Where do we draw the line?

 

Time to play guess the QB (these stats are 5 QBs over the same two year period).....

 

Player A:

 

669-1029, 65%, 7,871 yds, 60 TDs, 24 INTs, 97.5 QB Rating

 

Player B:

 

715-1220, 58.6%, 7,766 yds, 38 TDs, 47 INTs, 71.8 QB Rating

 

Player C:

 

679-1054, 64.4%, 7,994 yds, 50 TDs, 26 INTs, 92.7 QB Rating

 

Player D:

 

667-1010, 66%, 8,144 yds, 59 TDs, 19 INTs, 102.6 QB Rating

 

Player E:

 

653-1046, 62.4%, 7,639 yds, 50 TDs, 26 INTs, 90.1 QB Rating

 

 

How's that for stats for ya Spindoc....

 

I thought you didn't do stats?

I read a lot of interesting post in the TO thread. People say he is overrated, they say he has always been just average (3x'sCats) and all that stuff. All that is fine because everyone has their own opinion. However to say that only Bengal fans thought of him as a top 5 QB is wrong. Most people around the NFL thought of him as a top 5 QB in 2005 and 2006. So the real question is what has changed?

 

People will say he has not been the same since the knee injury. Well if that injury was the problem then you think his first year back after the injury would have been his worst. However no it was not, he put up great numbers and was considered a top 5 QB still after that year. Even drove his teams down to what should have been wins to get them in the playoffs. So the knee injury is not what has changed about him. 2007 Rudi Johnson hit the NFL wall of runningbacks and became washed up. Rich Braham career ended, Willie Anderson didn't play that much, and Levi started going down hill. Not to mention Chris Henry suspended for first 8 games, so he couldn't help much that year. So a lot of things changed in 2007, but yet he still passed for 4000 yards and 26 touchdowns. Not bad considering the circumstances, would be hard for an average QB to do. 2008 only played 3 games, so enough said about that. 2009 had basically one receiver, but was doing well early in the year and led them on game winning drives before Henry's unfortunate death.

 

Style of play also will determine how a QB will do. 2005-2007 when Palmer looked like a top 5 QB and at worst top 10 they were pass first. 2009 they were run first. The top QB's in the league play in pass first offenses, and are allowed to get in a rhythm because of it. Not to mention also easier to make all receivers look good in pass first offenses. However all these top QB's also have very good receiving cores, something Palmer did not have since 2007. So to look just at how he had done, and not really evaluate the whole thing about everything is not really looking at the big picture.

 

I will agree with people who say he is not a top 10 QB right now because he definitely was not anymore basing on just the eye test. However what I have argued all along, is if he is given the same opportunties like these other top QB's then we will see him being one of the top QB's again. He has that around him this year, so if I am wrong and he still is just average. Then I will eat all the crow that you all want to give.

 

I just always thought he was overrated and never saw him as a top 5 guy. Carson just doesn't make those "it" plays the way other top QBs do and he never really has IMO. If I'm starting a team I take alot of guys in front of him as my QB. He put up great #'s in his really good years, but to me he just was the same type of QB as even an Eli Manning or a Matt Ryan, let alone top 5 guys like Brees, Peyton Manning or Brady.

 

In theory Carson is a very good QB, but when push comes to shove I just have never trusted him. To be honest I think his closest comparison is Tony Romo in terms of how good he was.

See FC's post. Some Bengals guys think he's a legit top 5 guy now. Better than Rodgers? Better than Big Ben? Better than Favre? Where do we draw the line?

 

 

 

I thought you didn't do stats?

 

I don't normally...But since I've been told all I do is shove them down everyone's throats, I thought I might as well start. :lol:

I think he'll have a better year than last. To me, this is really a make or break season on what type of QB Palmer will be known as.

I think he'll have a better year than last. To me, this is really a make or break season on what type of QB Palmer will be known as.

 

Couldn't agree more.

 

The talent is finally in place in all areas for a deep run. They really don't have any noticable weaknesses at this point. It's put up or shut up time for Palmer.