Stats do not tell the entire story. Georgia is going to win games, just not big ones. And I do think that Coker does have something that Richt will never achieve...a MNC as head coach. Richt is just as big of a joke as Coker and Zook, he's another guy that can maintain a team, but not the guy that takes a team to the next step. Richt has to be one of the 5 most overrated coaches in America, IMO. More wins than any other SEC team the last 10 years, and nothing to show for it. This Georgia team is bad, and I expect that Georgia will only continue to slide a little farther. I cannot see them being a challenger to UF, Bama, LSU or Tennessee in the near future. Other teams are going to catch up with them. And don't worry, I'll tell you then that I told you so

 

Coker and Zook maintained their teams... really?

 

Overrated coach? Nobody talks about Richt.

 

He has the most wins of any SEC team in a decade dominated by SEC football, now that is impressive. The ONLY thing he is missing is a national championship. 6-2 in Bowls and that includes 2-1 in BCS Bowls. He lacks the title, but he is very consistent unlike a lot of top programs in the SEC this decade.

He is 6-2 in bowl games... 4 SEC East titles and 2 SEC titles. I like him a lot.

 

:thumb:

 

He's a great coach, IMO. Florida State sure hasn't been the same since he bolted for Georgia...although that would speak more to his ability as offensive coordinator. But, look at their offensive production under Richt in the 90's and what it has been since. Per wikipedia...

 

Under Richt’s direction, Florida State had some of college football's most explosive offenses; in his seven years as offensive coordinator, the Seminoles ranked in the nation’s top five scoring offenses on five occasions, were top twelve in total offense five times, and top twelve in passing offense five times. The 2000 Seminoles offense finished the regular season ranked first nationally in total offense (549.0 yards per game), first in passing offense (384.0 ypg), and third in scoring offense (42.4 points per game).

 

While an assistant coach at Florida State, Richt coached two Heisman Trophy winners, quarterbacks Charlie Ward and Chris Weinke, and was part of two national championships (1993 and 1999).

 

 

The struggles offensively for FSU began almost immediately upon his departure and haven't been fixed yet (although Ponder has looked better this year). They haven't had a good QB in a long time. The 'Noles used to always have a good QB and some studs at WR.

It isn't Richt's fault that the conference is LOADED with great coaches. Of the above listed... Meyer, Saban and Miles are the only ones that I would for sure take over Richt.

 

Les Miles over Richt? Really? I wouldn't.

 

If you want to talk about underachieving, look at Miles. LSU is and has been absolutely loaded with talent...if you look at recruiting over the past decade, there was a stretch when the Tigers were second only to USC in the amount of talent they stockpiled. Miles gets a pass because of the championship, but they lost two games during that season...to teams that were clearly inferior. It just so happened that he had the not good, but great, fortune of playing in a year when everybody lost, most more than once and managed to get to the big game with two losses. And, the icing on the cake was that tOSU was the lamb sent for the slaughter, so they got a free pass in the big game.

 

There's a lot of luck that goes into winning a BCS Title...LSU loses two games and gets Ohio State in the big game. Auburn goes undefeated and doesn't get an opportunity. Miles is a great coach. Tuberville gets fired. Richt has never had the opportunity to play in the big game either, despite finishing with a better regular season record than the Tigers did in Miles title season.

 

Considering how little control a coach actually has over the title process, I think too much emphasis is placed on it.

Les Miles over Richt? Really? I wouldn't.

 

If you want to talk about underachieving, look at Miles. LSU is and has been absolutely loaded with talent...if you look at recruiting over the past decade, there was a stretch when the Tigers were second only to USC in the amount of talent they stockpiled. Miles gets a pass because of the championship, but they lost two games during that season...to teams that were clearly inferior. It just so happened that he had the not good, but great, fortune of playing in a year when everybody lost, most more than once and managed to get to the big game with two losses. And, the icing on the cake was that tOSU was the lamb sent for the slaughter, so they got a free pass in the big game.

 

There's a lot of luck that goes into winning a BCS Title...LSU loses two games and gets Ohio State in the big game. Auburn goes undefeated and doesn't get an opportunity. Miles is a great coach. Tuberville gets fired. Richt has never had the opportunity to play in the big game either, despite finishing with a better regular season record than the Tigers did in Miles title season.

 

Considering how little control a coach actually has over the title process, I think too much emphasis is placed on it.

Hmmm, you do make a compelling argument.

Coker and Zook maintained their teams... really?

 

Overrated coach? Nobody talks about Richt.

 

He has the most wins of any SEC team in a decade dominated by SEC football, now that is impressive. The ONLY thing he is missing is a national championship. 6-2 in Bowls and that includes 2-1 in BCS Bowls. He lacks the title, but he is very consistent unlike a lot of top programs in the SEC this decade.

 

Oh no Coker and Zook didn't maintain their teams. But Coker did win a MNC.

 

:thumb:

 

He's a great coach, IMO. Florida State sure hasn't been the same since he bolted for Georgia...although that would speak more to his ability as offensive coordinator. But, look at their offensive production under Richt in the 90's and what it has been since. Per wikipedia...

 

Under Richt’s direction, Florida State had some of college football's most explosive offenses; in his seven years as offensive coordinator, the Seminoles ranked in the nation’s top five scoring offenses on five occasions, were top twelve in total offense five times, and top twelve in passing offense five times. The 2000 Seminoles offense finished the regular season ranked first nationally in total offense (549.0 yards per game), first in passing offense (384.0 ypg), and third in scoring offense (42.4 points per game).

 

While an assistant coach at Florida State, Richt coached two Heisman Trophy winners, quarterbacks Charlie Ward and Chris Weinke, and was part of two national championships (1993 and 1999).

 

 

The struggles offensively for FSU began almost immediately upon his departure and haven't been fixed yet (although Ponder has looked better this year). They haven't had a good QB in a long time. The 'Noles used to always have a good QB and some studs at WR.

 

So what you're saying is that Richt is a good OC? Let's be honest the fast break offense, like Spurrier's Fun-and-Gun what a little ahead of its time. Watching Georgia's offense now is nothing like those days. UGA is boring.

 

I still say Richt is garbage. He has an easy program to win with. He never overachieves, something that every other coach in the SEC besides Chizick and really Les Miles have done.

Oh no Coker and Zook didn't maintain their teams. But Coker did win a MNC.

 

 

 

So what you're saying is that Richt is a good OC? Let's be honest the fast break offense, like Spurrier's Fun-and-Gun what a little ahead of its time. Watching Georgia's offense now is nothing like those days. UGA is boring.

 

I still say Richt is garbage. He has an easy program to win with. He never overachieves, something that every other coach in the SEC besides Chizick and really Les Miles have done.

 

Oh come on don't call Les Miles an underachiever after the 5wide argument, you can do better than that.

 

How many SEC schools have undergone a coaching change while Richt has been there? That right there is a good point to make.

Mark Richt is a good coach, but IMO he's a bottom half of the conference coach. I'd take these coaches over him:

-Saban

-Meyer

-Kiffin and company.

-Petrino

-Les Miles

-Rich Brooks

 

And I'd take them in a heartbeat. I'd possibly take this Steve Spurrier and Nutt over him as well. Outside of UF, Bama, and LSU he has more talent than any other team, but you couldn't tell it. They win year in and year out, but there always seems to be a few losses.

 

He just wasn't lucky enough to get to play for a BCS Title in one of multiple loss seasons. In '07 when LSU won the title, Georgia finished in a three way tie for the SEC East championship and was shut out of the SEC Title game, while the Vols got served up to Les Miles. Georgia finished #2 in the polls that year.

Oh no Coker and Zook didn't maintain their teams. But Coker did win a MNC.

 

 

 

So what you're saying is that Richt is a good OC? Let's be honest the fast break offense, like Spurrier's Fun-and-Gun what a little ahead of its time. Watching Georgia's offense now is nothing like those days. UGA is boring.

 

I still say Richt is garbage. He has an easy program to win with. He never overachieves, something that every other coach in the SEC besides Chizick and really Les Miles have done.

 

Garbage? You're a hoot. :lol:

 

There's no way Richt could overachieve. You've pegged Georgia as a continuous title contender. He can only maintain or disappoint.

 

I'm curious to know how Urban Meyer and Nick Saban have overachieved. Apparently, winning big at Florida and Alabama is unheard of.

 

Richt isn't lucky. That's what he isn't. He doesn't get to play for BCS Titles with two losses...he gets shafted out of a shot at the title because of some dumb tie-breaker rule in 2007. He's like Tuberville. Guy goes undefeated in the SEC and doesn't even get to play for the title. Auburn was stupid for messing up a good thing. They had a good coach and wouldn't leave him alone. Now they'll suffer the consequences.

According to Rivals, UGA hasn't finished outside of the top 10 in recruiting dating back to 2002...I can't say about anything before that. Richt has been incredibly consistent with his recruiting, and his teams have been consistently good since he's been there.

 

From '02 through '09, Georgia's average class rank by rivals was 6.4. LSU's was 8, Florida's was 7.6. My guess is that speaks to the consistency produced by continuity on the coaching staff...these other schools had coaching changes and consequently some years where the recruiting slipped a bit. However, if you look at elite recruits...over that same span, despite having the highest average ranking and never finishing outside the top 10, UGA brought in 9 5-star recruits. LSU had 16. Florida had 22.

 

For comparison's sake, Southern Cal had 31 5-star recruits during that span. In fact, over 70% of their commitments are 4-star or higher.

I like Mark Richt as a coach and even more from what I have read about his character and integrity.

Oh come on don't call Les Miles an underachiever after the 5wide argument, you can do better than that.

 

How many SEC schools have undergone a coaching change while Richt has been there? That right there is a good point to make.

 

Les Miles or Richt? I'm not following what you're saying there. Every school that has made a coaching change got a better coach then the one they had before, with the exception of Auburn, IMO. So the coaching change thing really doesn't work for me either.

 

He just wasn't lucky enough to get to play for a BCS Title in one of multiple loss seasons. In '07 when LSU won the title, Georgia finished in a three way tie for the SEC East championship and was shut out of the SEC Title game, while the Vols got served up to Les Miles. Georgia finished #2 in the polls that year.

 

Luck has nothing to do with it. Had they taken care of business early in the season two years ago they would have had a shot.

 

Garbage? You're a hoot. :lol:

 

There's no way Richt could overachieve. You've pegged Georgia as a continuous title contender. He can only maintain or disappoint.

 

I'm curious to know how Urban Meyer and Nick Saban have overachieved. Apparently, winning big at Florida and Alabama is unheard of.

 

Richt isn't lucky. That's what he isn't. He doesn't get to play for BCS Titles with two losses...he gets shafted out of a shot at the title because of some dumb tie-breaker rule in 2007. He's like Tuberville. Guy goes undefeated in the SEC and doesn't even get to play for the title. Auburn was stupid for messing up a good thing. They had a good coach and wouldn't leave him alone. Now they'll suffer the consequences.

 

Saban is has took another coaches recruits and taken Alabama to new heights. No argument there any way you slice it or try to slant it.

 

Urban took a team that was winning 8 or 9 games a year and turned them back into a Top Level program. I would say that his teams at Bowling Green and Utah greatly overachieved and I'd hope you would too. So once again no argument there any way you slice it.

 

As for Richt in 2007, the team team that beat them, UT, got to play for the SEC Title. What's wrong with that?

 

Tubs and Richt don't belong in the same sentence to me. Tubs was undervalued his entire time at Auburn.

 

According to Rivals, UGA hasn't finished outside of the top 10 in recruiting dating back to 2002...I can't say about anything before that. Richt has been incredibly consistent with his recruiting, and his teams have been consistently good since he's been there.

 

From '02 through '09, Georgia's average class rank by rivals was 6.4. LSU's was 8, Florida's was 7.6. My guess is that speaks to the consistency produced by continuity on the coaching staff...these other schools had coaching changes and consequently some years where the recruiting slipped a bit. However, if you look at elite recruits...over that same span, despite having the highest average ranking and never finishing outside the top 10, UGA brought in 9 5-star recruits. LSU had 16. Florida had 22.

 

For comparison's sake, Southern Cal had 31 5-star recruits during that span. In fact, over 70% of their commitments are 4-star or higher.

 

Like I said, UGA always has talent. 4 and 5 stars aren't everything, and a really good coach would have a title to show by now at UGA for all the talent he had. Recruiting a coaching are two different things.

 

I like Mark Richt as a coach and even more from what I have read about his character and integrity.

 

Richt is a good guy no doubt.

 

Richt made his coaching name off being at FSU in the 90's. I don't see how his tenure at UGA has been that impressive. He wins, but I think many would have the same record or better in the same time span had they have been at UGA. Richt excelled when the SEC was down, there is no way around that, IMO. Maybe we can find some UGA fans and see what they say?

3XCats, the problem with your argument is that there are no facts behind any of it. The only thing against Richt right now is that he hasn't won a national championship. You say he underachieves every year, but only have one year as an example. He is an extremely consistent recruiter and extremely consistent winner in a conference that has dominated the decade. Saying, "Any other coach could do it at Georgia" has no merit because has shown, not anybody could do it at Florida or Miami and Georgia is not as elite as those two programs. I'm sorry, but the facts outweigh your opinion in this one by a landslide.

3XCats, the problem with your argument is that there are no facts behind any of it. The only thing against Richt right now is that he hasn't won a national championship. You say he underachieves every year, but only have one year as an example. He is an extremely consistent recruiter and extremely consistent winner in a conference that has dominated the decade. Saying, "Any other coach could do it at Georgia" has no merit because has shown, not anybody could do it at Florida or Miami and Georgia is not as elite as those two programs. I'm sorry, but the facts outweigh your opinion in this one by a landslide.

 

I think it's more stats than fact, IMO. I think that his resume looks good on paper, I just don't think he gets the job done consistently when you actually look at it. To me, I think he has had the benefit of having alot of talent mixed with a league that was down. I rarely look only at stats, they just don't tell the whole story, IMO. I think this is especially true in coaching. I'm always going to go with the guys who have proven to be huge difference makers. I just never feel like UGA has the advantage in the coaching department, whenever they match up with a good team.

 

Would you at least agree that he is the worst coach at a Major Program? I'm not counting teams like UK or Indiana, teams that are lower level in a BCS conference. I think he has to be the worst at a top 20 type of program in the country.

I think it's more stats than fact, IMO. I think that his resume looks good on paper, I just don't think he gets the job done consistently when you actually look at it. To me, I think he has had the benefit of having alot of talent mixed with a league that was down. I rarely look only at stats, they just don't tell the whole story, IMO. I think this is especially true in coaching. I'm always going to go with the guys who have proven to be huge difference makers. I just never feel like UGA has the advantage in the coaching department, whenever they match up with a good team.

 

Would you at least agree that he is the worst coach at a Major Program? I'm not counting teams like UK or Indiana, teams that are lower level in a BCS conference. I think he has to be the worst at a top 20 type of program in the country.

There you go with these unproven points again. Your whole argument is based on theory and opinion instead of anything that has evidence to it. The conference as a whole has absolutely not been down this decade. Many of the top programs have gone through ups and downs (except Georgia :lol:), but the SEC is pretty much always at the top How many titles has the SEC claimed?

 

Your last paragraph is absurd. I've stated my claim that I like him and think he is a really good coach, but you think I'm going to agree with you that he is the worst coach at a Top 20 program :idunno: :lol: :lol:

There you go with these unproven points again. Your whole argument is based on theory and opinion instead of anything that has evidence to it. The conference as a whole has absolutely not been down this decade. Many of the top programs have gone through ups and downs (except Georgia :lol:), but the SEC is pretty much always at the top How many titles has the SEC claimed?

 

Your last paragraph is absurd. I've stated my claim that I like him and think he is a really good coach, but you think I'm going to agree with you that he is the worst coach at a Top 20 program :idunno: :lol: :lol:

 

OK, fine. The SEC not being down in the early part of the 2000's is a joke. When the Conferences two top programs aren't winning to their normal standards, a conference is much weaker. Bama and UF haven't been at this level for the entire decade.

 

This is a pathetic argument really. We arguing over a guy that is pretty irrelevant on the National Level. UGA isn't a title contender and won't be a serious one under Richt. Drink the Kool-Aid if you want. Richt is a 2nd tier coach, like it or not. :deadhorse: