Maybe the lib's need some encouragement from Hilary to see it's not racist or unpatriotic :sssh:

 

 

In 2003, Hillary Clinton screeched "I am sick and tired of people who say that if you debate and you disagree with this administration somehow you're not patriotic. We should stand up and say we are Americans and we have a right to debate and disagree with any administration."

 

Scary but I agree with Hillary. I think the greatest leaders I know of are people that have great vision but listen to others to make sure there isn't a better way to achieve their goals.

I felt I used my words carefully in that I'm not assigning race as the cause for disagreement, but I think it plays strong in the sensitivities of many people and it effects the tone and direction of the discussion. I honestly feel that those who are racists pick up the fight quite readily, but I don't see this as the big fish problem, it is more how the underling racial fears (that I believe all people have, by a natural fear of the different) are boiled up and the direction and key opposition movement is to broil up fear.

 

It is not just the fact that fear is the game plan but fear of "Obama" is the target. This personalized fear I believe is amplified by the fact that Obama is a black man. Where he white I believe the attacks would be about incompetence and stupidity but because he is black these argument become "he is dangerous and out to hurt you".

 

I absolutely do not believe that the cause of opposition is primarily because he is a black man, but that he is a black man will play a significant part in the way his opposition frames him.

 

,

 

Astute.

Why is it race to you? Why not just fear of the policies he's pushing?

 

Honestly, I see people like Cynthia Tucker and Chris Matthews as the ones with the race problem. If one constantly thinks it must be race that cause people to disagree or dislike Obama's policies, they're the ones not ready for a black president IMO.

 

I find the entire premise that people who disagree with Obama or fear his policies must somehow have underlying racist motivations to be quite laughable. Does this mean there aren't racists who despise Obama because he is black? No. We just went through 8 years of a Republican president who was villified, maligned, denigrated, and disrespected by the media, leftist ideologues, political enemies, and various other "community" organizations on a daily basis.

 

We live in a very polarized political climate these days. When one party is in power, the other party is going to do everything in their power (and yes, this includes the voting citizen members of those parties) to crush the opposition by any means necessary, fair or unfair. Both sides engage in this behavior, IT"S JUST THE WAY IT IS.

 

So, now some would try to label those who oppose Obama as having some alterior (racist) motivation, when OF COURSE those who opposed the last president had purely the best of intentions. Yeah right.

I felt I used my words carefully in that I'm not assigning race as the cause for disagreement, but I think it plays strong in the sensitivities of many people and it effects the tone and direction of the discussion. I honestly feel that those who are racists pick up the fight quite readily, but I don't see this as the big fish problem, it is more how the underling racial fears (that I believe all people have, by a natural fear of the different) are boiled up and the direction and key opposition movement is to broil up fear.

 

It is not just the fact that fear is the game plan but fear of "Obama" is the target. This personalized fear I believe is amplified by the fact that Obama is a black man. Where he white I believe the attacks would be about incompetence and stupidity but because he is black these argument become "he is dangerous and out to hurt you".

 

I absolutely do not believe that the cause of opposition is primarily because he is a black man, but that he is a black man will play a significant part in the way his opposition frames him.

 

To your second point I actually agree that those most conscious of race serve in many ways to propagate its continuance. But I also feel that we as Americans have very poorly chosen our way to look at race (which we far to strictly view in terms of skin tone) as opposed to culture. Now could go on a huge soapbox thread but I will shortly summarize my belief that we unfortunalty tie our disagreements with culture into racial (or skin tone) terms and because of that we cannot have honest discussions about race in this country,

 

As will his supporters.

The rascism comes from the Obama supporters who wish to use this as a crutch or an excuse as many people who oppose his policies. Are there some who do not like him because of the color of his skin, yes, but the guessing by the reporter is very poor journalism.

 

And just for fun, look at the people protesting at the town halls and the ones that Fox brings on ... could they get any more southern republican??

 

 

The one guy mentioned in a Democrat ad who supposedly laid out the groundwork for the town hall disputes is an insurance agent in Connecticut. How is that any more southern republican?

 

Maybe the lib's need some encouragement from Hilary to see it's not racist or unpatriotic :sssh:

 

 

In 2003, Hillary Clinton screeched "I am sick and tired of people who say that if you debate and you disagree with this administration somehow you're not patriotic. We should stand up and say we are Americans and we have a right to debate and disagree with any administration."

 

:clap:

Maybe I'm different, but anything I've ever said/say/will say about President Barack Obama in regards to his policy was/is/will be effected whatsoever by his race.

Edited August 11, 200917 yr by cch5432
TTC is a jerk!

Maybe I'm different, but anything I've ever said about President Barack Obama in regards to his policy was effected whatsoever by his race.

 

hmmmmmm................ typo or admission?

I felt I used my words carefully in that I'm not assigning race as the cause for disagreement, but I think it plays strong in the sensitivities of many people and it effects the tone and direction of the discussion. I honestly feel that those who are racists pick up the fight quite readily, but I don't see this as the big fish problem, it is more how the underling racial fears (that I believe all people have, by a natural fear of the different) are boiled up and the direction and key opposition movement is to broil up fear.

 

It is not just the fact that fear is the game plan but fear of "Obama" is the target. This personalized fear I believe is amplified by the fact that Obama is a black man. Where he white I believe the attacks would be about incompetence and stupidity but because he is black these argument become "he is dangerous and out to hurt you".

 

I absolutely do not believe that the cause of opposition is primarily because he is a black man, but that he is a black man will play a significant part in the way his opposition frames him.

 

To your second point I actually agree that those most conscious of race serve in many ways to propagate its continuance. But I also feel that we as Americans have very poorly chosen our way to look at race (which we far to strictly view in terms of skin tone) as opposed to culture. Now could go on a huge soapbox thread but I will shortly summarize my belief that we unfortunalty tie our disagreements with culture into racial (or skin tone) terms and because of that we cannot have honest discussions about race in this country,

 

RRR, I am a republican and I oppose Obama's liberal agenda and I make no bones about it. I am not a racist and I love all people but to say there are possible racial overtones to opposing Obama or any part of the political left is absurd. I agree with several of his ideas but the continual barrage of mismanaged overspending in the name of common good is scary! Let's face it, if we ran our household budget in the same manner, we'd be out of a home, car and all other things very quickly. This is why people fear Obama and the left wing machine, not his skin color.

 

BTW, if you disagree with my viewpoint, can I assume you are anti-chiropractic?

RRR- while I rarely agree with you, I normally enjoy your posts and debating with you. This, however, is an absurd claim.

 

It seems that most people live with the mentality that everyone is a racist. I assume that people aren't racist until I see otherwise, and I would never label entire groups of people (besides the obvious groups that exist and promote racism, such as the KKK) as more racist than others. I see no reason why those who oppose the proposed health care reform are inherently more racist then others.

5432, If it isn't about racism back it up. I've got to tell you down there in Georgia, wasn't it, where the swastika was painted on an office or office building of a black democratic senator or something. I will find more about it just heard it while driving. But if it's not racism and strictly policy then here you go:

 

I was a private practice physician for over 22 years. In all my years of practice, I can count on the fingers of one hand the times when I had a challenge to a test or procedure that needed to be done for a patient on Medicare or Medicaid. These are both government-run national health care programs. For some reason, it appears as though seniors who use Medicare for their health care needs seem unaware that it is a national, government-run program.

 

 

 

During those same years, I had to continually fight with insurance bureaucrats so that my patients could get the care they needed. Besides fighting for getting procedures and care covered, which was a daily battle, I often simply did not get paid. The only bureaucrats continually inserting themselves into the doctor-patient relationship are those working for the insurance companies, not the government.

 

In an editorial last Sunday, the C-J states that “the media need to step up and shine the light on what health reform is and what it isn't.” Please do take your own advice. It is time for some articles that explain what Medicare is. It is time for an in-depth look at what single-payer health care means. It is time that the American public gets some clear information about various national health care models from other Western democracies. Citizens are operating in an information vacuum where anecdotes and lies pass for truth. The press let down the American public in the ramp-up to the war in Iraq. Don't fail us this time.

 

EDWARD J. RYAN

 

Floyds Knobs, Ind. 47119

5432, If it isn't about racism back it up. I've got to tell you down there in Georgia, wasn't it, where the swastika was painted on an office or office building of a black democratic senator or something. I will find more about it just heard it while driving.

What you are stating appears to clearly be an act of racism. I'm talking about the rallies regarding healthcare- they are not a result of racism, but rather an opposition to the reforms that they (correctly or incorrectly) think are going on.

 

As for "back it up", like I said I don't assume all to be racists. The one who simply says, "the health care reform protests are a result of racism" is the one who has the burden of proof, IMO. It is absurd to assume that health care reform protestors, as a whole, are inherently more racist than other demographics.

5432, If it isn't about racism back it up. I've got to tell you down there in Georgia, wasn't it, where the swastika was painted on an office or office building of a black democratic senator or something. I will find more about it just heard it while driving. But if it's not racism and strictly policy then here you go:

How do you know it wasn't a plant? This is politics you know. Both sides are very dirty.

What you are stating appears to clearly be an act of racism. I'm talking about the rallies regarding healthcare- they are not a result of racism, but rather an opposition to the reforms that they (correctly or incorrectly) think are going on.

 

As for "back it up", like I said I don't assume all to be racists. The one who simply says, "the health care reform protests are a result of racism" is the one who has the burden of proof, IMO. It is absurd to assume that health care reform protestors, as a whole, are inherently more racist than other demographics.

 

The man had just had the health care forum in Georgia

The man had just had the health care forum in Georgia

 

OK. The person who did that is a vandal and a racist. It does not mean that all health care reform protestors are racist.