KHSAA Ruling Based On Bylaws - By Wilson Sears

[Zanny]

LMB, Winston was at Catholic all 4 years of HS. You heard wrong...

[Log Mountain Boy]

LMB, Winston was at Catholic all 4 years of HS. You heard wrong...

 

I apologize. I heard that the other day. It may have been on BGP. I had heard he transferred to LexCath after his sophomore year. Thanks for clearing that up.:thumb:

[ladiesbballcoach]

I don't think what Mr. Euton did was a lack of common sense. I think it was a lack knowing the rules. I don't know why any parent would say something that they understood would be damaging to their child.

 

I know you don't want these 2 kids in this particular situation to be allowed to play and thats fine, you can think what you want. But I have also brought up other situations, like the 2 sisters and one was eligible and the other was not (I understand tere was a reason), but I believe that was a huge mistake by the KHSAA.

 

I have NO CARE if these two boys play or not. NONE! Won't affect my life one iota if they do or do not.

 

But, if the rules says they should not play, I would expect that the KHSAA should not let them play.

 

That is MY ONLY CONCERN.

[ladiesbballcoach]

With the rules being this fluid as is now it becomes a judgement call in a lot of situations and I think they are making the wrong judements too many times.

 

As for Lexington Catholic, they get transfers a lot and they are being ruled eligible. They got Sanford from Lafayette last year and Winston Guy after his sophomore year (I believe, thats what I had heard) and they got a good guard from Bryan Station coming this year. I don't know what his status is. I don't see anyone upset because these guys are getting to play. I sure am not upset about it.

 

IYHO, they are making the wrong judgements.

 

And as we saw later in the thread, your judgement was wrong on the status of one of the kids.

[Bluegrasscard]

I apologize. I heard that the other day. It may have been on BGP. I had heard he transferred to LexCath after his sophomore year. Thanks for clearing that up.:thumb:

 

Also, his father coaches LC middle and has for at least the last 4 years and is very good with kids.

 

Thanks for the apology but it is distrubing that such blatently untrue stories are propagated so easily out in the state.

[Log Mountain Boy]

Also, his father coaches LC middle and has for at least the last 4 years and is very good with kids.

 

Thanks for the apology but it is distrubing that such blatently untrue stories are propagated so easily out in the state.

 

Thats the reason why I worded it the way I did. I had heard this, but I hadn't really confirmed it with anyone.

[Log Mountain Boy]

IYHO, they are making the wrong judgements.

 

And as we saw later in the thread, your judgement was wrong on the status of one of the kids.

 

As you can see I didn't say it in a way that made it sound like it was definite. I had heard this and now I know it is not true. It has nothing to do with judgement. It has to do with fact or fiction.

 

I think that the KHSAA is making a lot of wrong decisions. Like the decision to tell a kid 1 day he is eligible and then tell him the next that he is not eligible. There are transfers all over the state this off season and I would say most are for athletic reasons to an extent. But I would also say in most situations there are other reasons to move besides athletics.

[Jumper_Dad]

Sears comes offer very condescending, here is an example:

 

Third, although many believe these by-laws are somewhat ambiguous and often unenforceable, neither the board of control, the state board nor the infinitely wise Legislative Research Commission has elected to change them — only to often suggest their lack of consistency.

 

 

When I read that I took it that he was trying to make a point that the rules are a mess and no one is willing to fix them, just complain about them.

 

Do most of you think the by-laws are what we need or does there need to be some kind of even handed reform?

 

As far as Euton or anyone else transferring, I look at it this way. If you are moving to a new community and your child is really advanced in science or music, and there was a magnet school that catered to children like that, then I think we would each seek out that school for our child. If my child was a star athlete and I was moving to an area with a variety of communities and schools to choose from then I would pick the one that would best benefit my child. Just as being in advanced classes challenges a student to be their best, so would going against the best in practice everyday. I think it is very naive of the KSHAA to think otherwise and to act shocked when someone speaks the truth about it. If their is a legitimate move made, then parents and students should be free to pick the school they want for what ever reason they want as long as there are no inducements to do so.

 

Since my name alone will give all of you a reason to slam me, thinking I have been drinking Sears' purple Kool-aid, I 'll leave this thread to you guys and leave you with a piece of news that most of you will love. As of July 1, 2008, Wilson Sears is RETIRED!!!

[KNIGHTRIDER]

When I read that I took it that he was trying to make a point that the rules are a mess and no one is willing to fix them, just complain about them.

 

Do most of you think the by-laws are what we need or does there need to be some kind of even handed reform?

 

As far as Euton or anyone else transferring, I look at it this way. If you are moving to a new community and your child is really advanced in science or music, and there was a magnet school that catered to children like that, then I think we would each seek out that school for our child. If my child was a star athlete and I was moving to an area with a variety of communities and schools to choose from then I would pick the one that would best benefit my child. Just as being in advanced classes challenges a student to be their best, so would going against the best in practice everyday. I think it is very naive of the KSHAA to think otherwise and to act shocked when someone speaks the truth about it. If their is a legitimate move made, then parents and students should be free to pick the school they want for what ever reason they want as long as there are no inducements to do so.

 

Since my name alone will give all of you a reason to slam me, thinking I have been drinking Sears' purple Kool-aid, I 'll leave this thread to you guys and leave you with a piece of news that most of you will love. As of July 1, 2008, Wilson Sears is RETIRED!!!

 

The only "mal-lox moment" Sears is suffering occurs when the higher ups disagree with HIS vision of what the rules should be...he's been lead dog in any attempt to rid the state of high school parochial competition ONLY because he and his "PS puritans" can't find a way to compete with them. He really demonstrated his total lack of class when the higher review boards in the process rejected his concept of "fairness" in the doomed prop 2.. The news of his impending retirement is some of the best news Kentucky's prep athletics has to look forward to for 08-09.

[The Professor]

I agree.

The inconsistencies come when you look at when Ms. DeVries/the KHSAA choose to enforce the rules and when they choose to grant exceptions.

That has been a big problem with the KHSAA for a long, long time. Whether they intend it to look that way or not, they give the impression that sometimes it's who you are, big school vs small, or who has the most political power or money when a decision is made. They're obviously trying to correct some of that now, but it's been too long in coming.

[Plato]

That has been a big problem with the KHSAA for a long, long time. Whether they intend it to look that way or not, they give the impression that sometimes it's who you are, big school vs small, or who has the most political power or money when a decision is made. They're obviously trying to correct some of that now, but it's been too long in coming.

 

I have to disagree that they are trying to correct the problem now. The two most high profile transfers in the state are ineligible in spite of legitimate moves. Two kids leave JBS for Knox Central and are eligible because JBS may or may not close its doors. There are many many examples where kids in very similar situations are ruled differently by the KHSAA.

It's been a problem for a long, long time and it continues to be a big problem imo.

[HDE]

I think the KHSAA has done much better in dealing with transfers in recent years.

 

I've told there are very unusual circumstances with the JBS-Knott Central situation, but I still thought the players would/should be ineligible unless the school closed.

[leatherneck]

I apologize. I heard that the other day. It may have been on BGP. I had heard he transferred to LexCath after his sophomore year. Thanks for clearing that up.:thumb:

 

And that's the danger of believing what you hear. I've been absolutely amazed at the incorrect information people receive on numerous athletically related issues. It really is surprising how much mis information is out there. Thank goodness that this site is present to correct a lot of that mis-information. I wouldn't hold the rest of the transfer info that you received about LexCath too highly either. Trust me when I say this: from what I've been told by people "in the know" is that the mentality on the KHSAA is (and has been for several years) to not approve transfers unless there is a compelling case for it.

[Bluegrasscard]

I have to disagree that they are trying to correct the problem now. The two most high profile transfers in the state are ineligible in spite of legitimate moves. Two kids leave JBS for Knox Central and are eligible because JBS may or may not close its doors. There are many many examples where kids in very similar situations are ruled differently by the KHSAA.

It's been a problem for a long, long time and it continues to be a big problem imo.

 

Going back to Wilson Sears claim that you must know the background of certain situations to understand and appreciate the apparently arbitrary rulings. He is correct apparently. It seems the formal Bylaws are so full of holes that they now rely more on precident setting 'Case Situations' than the actual formal Bylaws.

 

Quote from article from HL:

 

Bylaw 6-16 states that students cannot transfer for “athletic advantage,” which includes “seeking a superior athletic team.”

 

The problem - There is no Bylaw 6-16. There is a Case BL-6-16.

 

Bylaw 6 says nothing about “athletic advantage" or “seeking a superior athletic team". Nada. It is completely silent on the issue.

 

Somewhere, somehow someone elected to ADD (not merely interpret) to the bylaw. Who, when, why how, was it voted on by the members?

 

The existence of these 'Case Situations' is a serious problem with the KHSAA bylaws. Mr Wilson is correct in that you can apparently only appreciate the rulings if you know the situations behind the Case Situations.

 

What is really needed is a rewrite of the bylaws that incorporates the case situations.

[Ram]

I was under the impression that the case situations were as binding as the Bylaws themselves. Aren't they written to give a better understanding of the Bylaws? And based on previous rulings?