To be fair, just because a kid plays for Our Lady of Lourdes or Holy Spirit doesn't mean he will be going to Trinity either.

No it certainly doesn't. I'm a perfect example of it, played at Margret Mary then played at Manual. But there was no question that coaches intended on players ending up at T or X. In west end schools I'm sure De Sales and Holy Cross had a similar impact.

Basketball is nothing like football. In basketball, individual talent can win out. In basketball, precision in execution is not critical to offensive success. In basketball, there isn't the possible advantage of specialization for offense and defense.

 

In basketball, you have five guys on the floor and maybe ten others on the bench. In football, you have 11 on the field and maybe 89 on the sidelines. Stop bringing up basketball.

 

Well, shouldn't we be able to find "individual talent" with such a larger population? Afterall, your argument is that it's a numbers game. I think finding one amazing basketball player out of 1,400 would be easier than finding one out of 800. Do numbers help? Certainly, but they aren't the end-all be all either as evidenced by the number of titles won by the private schools before they were the size they currently are and when public schools were much larger on average than they currently are.

 

 

Why is Woodford so successful in wrestling year in, year out? Tradition, coaching and a fantastic feeder system. Kids growing up in that community see a winning program that they want to be a part of, so they start training at a young age with the knowledge of those who came before them and the desire to uphold that tradition. With great coaching starting at a young age, the kids are ready to become champions. Same could be said for PRP with baseball or Ballard with basketball or Paducah Tilghman with track or Daviess County with XC.

Manual itself is unique in that it has NO feeder school at all. There is no local district to assume or develop talent in anyway.

 

While it may not be the official feeder, Meyzeek sends a large majority of their AP students onto Manual.

Emulating is exactly what being proposed. Emulating the numerical advantage that they have.

 

The only fault I have with them is how they so easily find fault with programs whom they have distinct advantages over.

You're too focused on the numbers game. The idea is to emulate what these schools are obviously doing to make themselves winners. And it has nothing to do with numbers. I don't care if you have a million students to pick from. If you have a lousy program, none of them are going to want to come out, and those that do will be totally ineffective. It's time we get over the "numerical advantage" syndrome.

You're too focused on the numbers game. The idea is to emulate what these schools are obviously doing tto make them winners. And it has nothing to do with numbers. I don't care if you have a million students to pick from. If you have a lousy program, none of them are going to want to come out, and those that do will be totally ineffective. It's time we get over the "numerical advantage" syndrome.

The rest of 6A are not lousy programs. They are good program with a SERIOUS numerical disadvantage, if the numbers more equitable X and T wouldn't dominate as much as they do.

The rest of 6A are not lousy programs. They are good program with a SERIOUS numerical disadvantage, if the numbers more equitable X and T wouldn't dominate as much as they do.

It's not the number in the pool; it's what you do with them.

Some facts to chew over my friend. The biggest school that you have to face has a 37% advantage over you. Most 6A schools have to overcome a bigger gap than you do (even though you play two classes up) in order to face T and X.

You would have to add the population of boys at Highlands to Eastern High School to equal the number at Trinity. Your telling me adding the Highlands football team to Eastern wouldn't make them better?

 

Highlands has a great program, for reasons that I'm not aware of. What I am aware of is that if Male, Manual, Ballard, PRP, and Eastern had as much depth as Trinity and St X they would be significantly more competitive.

 

My favorite post of this whole thread. Highlands has a great program, for reasons that I'm not aware of." Says it all.

My favorite post of this whole thread. Highlands has a great program, for reasons that I'm not aware of." Says it all.

:thumb:

Here IMO, is the crux of the issue. The feeder programs. I'm willing to bet, that if you look at the consitently sucessful football programs around the state, you will find that the feeder programs a more established and overall a bit better than others. My thought is these feeder programs are below middle school level. The Catholic schools in Louisville do it, Highlands in NKY does it, Lexington Catholic and Lexington Christian combined have one. I think this is where the ground can be made up, if the commitment is in place. Is funding an issue, probably, and I don't know if that is the only one. But lets say that the funding is there for the High Schools to create a feeder program, such as the ones others have done. Wouldn't some of the kids that go to play in the Catholic feeder program(because it's the only one) now have another choice, and now choose, as an example: Manuels feeder program, because big brother , or a cousin plays there, and little Johnny wants to be like him? Just some thoughts. I don't really know that much about Jeff. Co.

 

Bingo!

 

This is where the difference is made - without a doubt.

 

The schools with a related MS, Elementary program have kids coming in as freshmen who know the basics and know the commitment upfront.

I do not know for sure but I would guess that most schools that do not have related programs are having to teach a lot of basics to the freshman and sophomores. Also, students AND PARENTS know the commitment coming in - practice or game EVERYDAY, not just once or twice a week. I bet the 'quit rate' is much higher if the new players and their parents are not prepared or have not had to 'test the waters' of this sport.

 

Also, the feeder programs keep kids interested who might give up on football before they even get to HS, or might have not tried the sport before going to HS. I am sure one of the biggest 'recuiting challenges' (sorry to refer that inflamitory term) is to recuit the football capable talent that is in a schools own existing student population. This is a hard sport to drop and pick back up a year or 2 later. It is also hard to start after you are already in HS.

Highlands has a great program, for reasons that I'm not aware of.

 

I will share an outsider experience on this.

 

When attending a Saturday morning JV game there was flag football going on on a field outside the main stadium, and there where older youth teams preparing for games on the main field. It seemed good portion of the community was their supporting not only the HS team but youth teams.

 

Also, it was pointed out that one of the JV players was a '4th generation Highlander football player'. So I guess that means the great granddad, granddad and dad were all Highlander players. When people can reference pride and heritage like that - it is impressive.

My favorite post of this whole thread. Highlands has a great program, for reasons that I'm not aware of." Says it all.

Since Highlands isn't the issue, and succeeds for DIFFERENT reasons than X and T, I don't find it to be telling of the thread at all.

Not quite. Schools like Michigan, Penn St., Texas, Wisconsin, Purdue all have 40,000+ students and are known to be some of the best universities in the country, as well as some of the largest. Large schools do not necessiarly equal poor education levels and small schools don't always equate to a strong education.

 

So you would put those universities on the same level as Yale, Penn, Harvard, MIT, etc.? I'm pretty sure that it has been quite thoroughly proven that smaller is, in fact, better. That's not to say that you CAN'T get a quality education from a bigger school, or that you CAN'T get a poor one from a small school. But in a quick examination across the country, smaller usually means more rigid admissions, higher cost, lower faculty to student ratio, and in the end........a better education.

 

I think they taught me in HS sometime that statements like always and never are the giveaways to true/false questions. While we can't say always or never here, we can say that most of the time this is the case.

Since Highlands isn't the issue, and succeeds for DIFFERENT reasons than X and T, I don't find it to be telling of the thread at all.

 

What are the 'different' reasons?

Many of the advantages listed for X and T are not applicable to Highlands, such as their Catholic football tradition. Just as Highlands' high talent level relative to their opponents is not a reason that X and T go deep in the state tournament. There are differences, and there are similarities, but as this thread is about 6-A I just don't see where it's useful to examine Highlands; it certainly doesn't remove the cornerstone of RRR's arguments to choose not to address them.

But the point some have brought up is that years ago, the numbers advantage wasn't what it was and in some cases, the private schools were at a disadvantage, but they still won a large majority of the titles. Also, why does this numbers advantage not translate to a sport like basketball? St. X used to have a very competitive basketball team, but apparently now that we're larger than all JCPS schools by such a wide margin, we can't field a successful team (compared to our football team for example).

 

I'll step up and knock this one out of the park.

 

First, basketball isn't a numbers game. It is very difficult to beat teams because you have a bunch of hardworking average players. All it takes is one very good player on the other team to beat your team.

 

In more team (read number) oriented sports, swimming and diving, cross country, etc. X and T have had much more frequent success.