Pete Rose is not the greatest hitter ever. He has the most hits ever. Let's not confuse the two.

Pete Rose is not the greatest hitter ever. He has the most hits ever. Let's not confuse the two.

 

Agree. He was a great hitter longer than everyone else but not the greatest hitter ever, IMO.

Pete Rose is not the greatest hitter ever. He has the most hits ever. Let's not confuse the two.

I'd like to hear your statistical take on that analysis.

Agree. He was a great hitter longer than everyone else but not the greatest hitter ever, IMO.

 

Simple math:

 

great hitter longer than everyone else = greatest hitter ever

Simple math:

 

great hitter longer than everyone else = greatest hitter ever

 

I think Tony Gwynn is a better hitter.

I think Tony Gwynn is a better hitter.

I think Ted Williams and Rod Carew are also better hitters. But there has to be a line that when you continue at his level for as long as he did, he has to be in the discussion.

I think Ted Williams and Rod Carew are also better hitters. But there has to be a line that when you continue at his level for as long as he did, he has to be in the discussion.

 

I don't disagree. He is in the discussion.

 

But, when you have 2,000 more plate appearances than anyone else that has ever played and are that good, you are bound to have more hits. Again, I think Pete's great because he was as good as he was for a LOT longer than anyone else. I just don't think he is the greatest hitter ever.

I don't disagree. He is in the discussion.

 

But, when you have 2,000 more plate appearances than anyone else that has ever played and are that good, you are bound to have more hits. Again, I think Pete's great because he was as good as he was for a LOT longer than anyone else. I just don't think he is the greatest hitter ever.

 

I agree with you. It's difficult to quantify statistically IMO. (shocker)

I think Tony Gwynn is a better hitter.

 

In modern history, I often hear Gwynn and George Brett as the best hitters in the peak of their careers. Gwynn and Brett's peak just didn't last for over a decade like Rose's did LOL.

Drive, heart, and determination can get a a guy a lot. But a lifetime average of .303? That's a special talent for putting bat to ball. The guy could play.

 

Numerous Rose doubters always point out his .303 lifetime average as justification for him not being in consideration as one of the greatest hitters ever. Didn't the last five or so years of his career drag his average down? In other words, had he retired earlier, when most major leaguers retire, wouldn't his lifetime batting average be even more impressive?

When people try to quantify the value of a batter they will always be wrong. For years avg. was the accepted measure, then OBP, and then ops. None have or will ever measure the intangibles that make a 'great hitter.' A single is not just a single in this game and there is no way to measure the difference. Great hitters often hit a single to right with a runner on, moving the lead runner to third. Statistically, that's a hit, a single, a hit with runner on base or whatever, but the value is not truly measured unless you dig hard. Guys like Pete hit to right when needed.

 

I remember listening to Joe Morgan on the star of the game radio show after a big game crediting Pete with having 'shown him all of the pitchers stuff' having led off the game with a thirteen pitch at bat and then later having led off an inning against a reliever with an 11 pitch at bat. The first at bat leading to a walk and the latter a single. Joe had followed each w/ a home run.

 

I remember Pete explaining the obligation of a lead off hitter having a long at bat if a pitcher ran out a ground ball for the second out of an inning (pitchers used to do that). Going down 0-2 is not good for the avg. but sometimes it's what your team needs.

 

I could go on and on about situational hitting. Point is that nobody ever understood it, or did it better than Pete. Those are the things that made him better than a lot of others that had statistical advantages.

Agree. He was a great hitter longer than everyone else but not the greatest hitter ever, IMO.

 

Agree, most prolific certainly but there are several who were better hitters.

I appreciate the skills of great hitters like Gwynn, Brett, and Ted Williams. But look at it the other way. What could Rose have done in his career to be better than he was? I say, nothing.

I appreciate the skills of great hitters like Gwynn, Brett, and Ted Williams. But look at it the other way. What could Rose have done in his career to be better than he was? I say, nothing.

 

I saw that. You can't slip that stuff past me.

I saw that. You can't slip that stuff past me.

 

Touche