bulldog77

Well, that's it then. ALL urban schools must play in their own league. Only large county schools, no privates, no independents, and definitely no urban schools should be allowed to play for a state title. Don't you all see where this is all headed? THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS A LEVEL PLAYING FIELD IN OPEN, NON-CLASSED COMPETITION! It just does not and just can not exist! The best possible scenario is classification based on enrolllment and skewing the single-sex schools up in class to match the sex enrollments of their competition. Otherwise we've all heard the ridiculous rhetoric 1000 times. "We want that single state champion because it's tradition! But, uh, kick out the privates and handicap the urbans and uh, those independent school districts, kick them out too." Gimme a break.

I love this stuff. Proponents of staying the same for staying the same's sake love to use terms like "watered down" and always seem to know the wants and desires of all the high school kids in the state. I'm amazed by that. I know the wants and desires of the kids in my small class A school and Rupp arena is a distant and unattainable dream. The large school kids may well have the dream of playing for the "one true championship" ONLY because THAT"S ALL THERE IS RIGHT NOW!!

Precisely! And very well said. The problem with 90% of the arguments against classification so far in this thread is that they are all based on opinion and hearsay rather than facts. Trinity hasn't won one is, so far, the only "fact" I can recall. Someone said football is king now and has taken over basketball, yet we have classes in football. Apparently basketball is perceived to be on the downturn as well as baseball and they DON'T have classes. Is there something there?

While I understand completely I do not totally agree with you. You are talking about circumstances that don't exist in every case. You're also talking about programs that usually have a larger enrollment.

And THAT is reason to say everything is nice and dandy? If we're going to make arbitrary comparisons, then lets do that, Bellevue has never won a state championship, Male has. Deming has never won one, Lafayette has. Gimme a break. The concept of the small mountain town team coming in and pulling off the giant upset is long, long past us all. Our history is rich with those stories but those kinds of situations just simply no longer exist. We have always prided ourselves on having good basketball in our state and that includes keeping up with the newest trends. Why can we not see the forest for the trees when it comes to this issue?

hssb This might be one of the classiest, most well thought-out and interesting posts I've ever read on this board in my several years here. I appreciate your upbeat and positive comments and I applaud them. Some of the Holmes kids face issues that 95% of us can't imagine and will NEVER be subjected to and are judged way, way too harshly at times. You truly are a FAN of high school sports and you just proved it to me. Congrats to the Bulldogs. Take pride in your accomplishments, you beat two very talented and well-coached teams to get to the next step in your dreams. Play with poise and maturity and the big prize could be yours.

I cannot disagree more. #1 Having "one true champion" does absolutely NOTHING for the development of the game or the popularity of the championships. It is SOLELY a "feel good" situation for those who consistently have the best opportunities to play in the state tournament. #2 There is NO proof that there would be less interest in the tournament. Quite frankly, more schools with more of an opportunity SHOULD lead to more attendance. #3 Check again. Small schools (real small independent especially public ones)have a miniscule chance of winning the state tournament, or, in most cases, even getting to it. #4 Doing something just because "that's the way it has always been" is without a doubt the WORST reason for continuing to do it that way. #5 No, no member of the KHSAA (member schools) has made a proposal to change, and that is a shame.

Wisconsin UCLA Ohio State Vanderbilt

Agreed. I already deal with some younger players choosing NOT to participate in freshman because they want to play with the local teams. This ruling does affect smaller schools if they are trying to field freshman teams using 8th and sometimes 7th graders to help fill the rosters.

I heard the same thing but wasn't sure if that ruling was being enacted or just discussed.

Case BL-8-4- Can participants in sports other than football and basketball play for outside leagues and/or teams? There are no restrictions on the student-athletes in sports other than football and basketball as it relates to outside competition during the season. No member of the coaching staff at the high school level may be involved in the coaching of any student representative of that school in outside competition. For example, the baseball coach may not coach the baseball team in the local Babe Ruth league during the school year or dead period. In addition, the girls’ coach in a particular school could not coach the boys’ team in a particular school and vice-versa. Here is the actual rule from the KHSAA handbook. It looks to me that it applies across the board to all athletes in baseball. Therefore it is at the discretion of the individual program as to if they allow their athletes to participate on outside teams.

Agree, agree, agree. I'm searching right now to see if there is a ruling I'm not aware of, but I THINK the outside participation rules only apply to Varsity and maybe JV teams. Not certain about that though and will look thouroughly. Kids get better by playing. Setting rules as to which team comes first and which practices come first are obviously important, but I personally believe kids need to play as much as possible. Yes, there are some problems with "daddy ball" in some cases, but I think in the long run, playing is better than not playing enough.

Unless I'm mistaken, doesn't EVERY team lose their final game except one?

Metro areas generally produce the most competitive regions simply because of numbers. Other smaller, less populated areas may produce strong individual programs but fewer region-wide. As far as regions, it would be tough to pick against the 11th and then add in the 6th and 7th. I feel the 9th is underappreciated and is usually very competitive but falters in state tournament play for the reasons NYRangers suggests. There will always be great teams from the mountains and the West just fewer of them.

These type of threads are never productive. You want to talk about the best coaches, go right ahead. Calling someone the worst just give a dais to persons with personal vendettas, petty gripes and self promoting rants. I strongly urge someone to shut this down and start over without the obvious worst references. This is cheap.

The Tigers will be better but still a little on the young side. The Varsity looks to have 5 seniors, 7 Juniors, 5 Sophs and 3 Frosh on the roster. They are markedly improved over two years ago and have taken great strides since last season. Pitching is deep but very young with only two seniors taking the hill this season. Schedule is full of teams outside the region and they will be taking to the road to play in two tournaments out of town. Spring Break they will be in Berea during the early half of the week and later will take a trip to Corbin for a two day tourney. There will be both a JV and Freshman team even though most of the frosh will play both. 37 kids in the program this year bodes well for the future.

Holmes Bulldogs Leo Foster Ross Backus Gary Sargent Dean Abner Richie Williams Gary Kavanaugh Mark Moeves Mike Powers George Keller Roger McElfresh Bob Barton Robbie Hartman I'll think about this some more. I know I'm missing some obvious ones.

Just some hard throwers that come to mind are: Matt Nichols, Dixie Kyle York, Ludlow Brian Weiss, Ryle Muench, Brossart I know there are more but I'm drawing a blank today for some reason.

By the way, just for the sake of argument, how long did Mr. Turner coach at holmes?

We agree. Not surprised.

Okay Rm while I have never considered you a member of the leftwing attack commandos, and never will, I respect your opinions, I believe what you are saying here deserves a response. Is attacking Bono or Gore or any of the leftist elite any more of a "sin" than the generalizations and stereotyping of Republicans that has long been the hallmark of the Democratic Party? Rich fat cat businessmen, bigots, haters, or worse, rightist extremists, backwrd thinking religious zealots! As a Republican who is not rich, not a businessman, not right-wing extremist, not a bigot, works in Social work, believes and works for conservation and land preservation, has worked for River restoration etc. and had ALOT of other like-minded Republican brethren do it with me, I really have no sympathy for your statement. I believe the Harris Poll Group did the study, I'll check my source to make sure, but the study concluded that there are MORE per-capita millionaires who profess to be members of the Democratic Party than those who profess to be Republicans. The study went on to say that more persons listed on the Fotune 500's membership of Boards of Directors are card carrying Democrats than Republicans. My point (sorry for going the long way round the barn) is that you can't have it both ways. Dem leadership wants to use the Republican stereotype as ammunition every time a social issue comes down the road but whenever the tables are turned theywant to cry foul! I know you're not a Democratic Party Hack but the whole premise of your statement has long been a frustration of mine.

Actually I read this somewhere along the line. Gas emissions from Cows and other herd type animals contribute far more to the greenhouse gases than any other source. Now, I wouldn't stake the old farm on this as accurate info, but I have seen and read it several times.

Cow Farts

Excellent question and one I was wondering the moment I saw the score last night.

I love it when talent meets a challenge head on. Lickert is a strong willed coach and doesn't back off. He'll need every bit of that but if he shows those kids he really does care about them as people AND football players, he'll get them out. The rest is all coaching and we all know he can do that. Make all of us old Bulldogs proud, Congrats Steve!!