If Romney wins the nomination, this will be one of the lowest turnouts in terms of percentage of the electorate in a long time, if not ever.

 

I think it will be no matter what. Neither side is generating a lot of exceitement. Unless a major issue gets brought into the fray people will stay home.

Faith in common sense. What did you base your statement on?

Facts, polling data, etc.

Why do you leave out civil liberties? Do you think Romney would be better in that regard? It seems conservatives a generally in favor of a strong and intrusive government on that side of the ledger. It would seem that it would be a coin flip between the two for a libertarian. Considering how rare it is for a candidate to actually implement what they campaigned on and how slippery Romney is I don't think fmkyw's position is the least bit outrageous.

Thanks man! This is what I'm getting at. Neither one of them is really all that close and I think it depends on which side I want less intrusion on.

 

One of my main problems with libertarians is the vast majority who self-identify usually vote for someone from the big two that most often isn't close to their beliefs.

Well a prime example was Iowa. Romney won that state when everyone said the evangelical voters won't vote for him. It's a small concern. I don't see it making the impact you're suggesting when the economy is currently tanked.

...and he still didn't even get a third of the votes. Right now the evangelical voters are being split among other candidates. He will be in big trouble if some of the other guys start to drop out quick.

By individual liberty you mean to be able to MARRY whomever you like - to serve in the military if you wish regardless of your orientation. You mean the liberty of a woman to CHOOSE, with the advice of her doctor what to do with her body.

 

Or are libertarians only concerned about economic freedom?

 

^Ace, I really don't get you. Where do you come up with this stuff? Libertarians believe in individual liberties in all aspects (i.e. both financially and socially).

 

Libertarians believe in people being able to marry whomever they choose, they could not care any less about one's sexual orientation, and they definitely aren't looking for an overturn of RvW.

 

As to Marvel's post, I believe he was posting under the assumption that the majority of voters are more concerned about economic/fiscal issues than social issues. I would agree with that.

I think he is alluding to the fact that marvel only seems concerned with "economic liberties" (which I don't think Romney is all that close either) and is overlooking many other common libertarian issues that Romney doesn't side with...

My point was that Obama falls much more in line with the stuff that I mentioned than any of the Republicans do. So who is the more libertarian of the bunch? I understand what a libertarian believes. The issue is that folks want to believe that Republicans are closer to that than Dems are and that is simply not the case. It is always on an issue by issue basis.

Exactly and to think it's outrageous for a libertarian to choose Obama over Romney is silly. No one of the big two is generally that close overall to being a libertarian. Also, the GOP tends to spend a lot of money on it's "pet projects" so I'd argue they aren't that close economically either.

I don't think it matters who the nominee is. Americans in general are sick of everything about politics. People are staying home regardless IMO.

 

In other words, just another election.

 

I think it will be no matter what. Neither side is generating a lot of exceitement. Unless a major issue gets brought into the fray people will stay home.

 

No, I'm thinking even much more so than normal. I think an overwhelming majority of the hardcore religious right will be sitting out because of Romney's Mormonism, and a lot of non-idealogues who supported Obama last time will also be sitting out.

No, I'm thinking even much more so than normal. I think an overwhelming majority of the hardcore religious right will be sitting out because of Romney's Mormonism, and a lot of non-idealogues who supported Obama last time will also be sitting out.

 

Exactly my thoughts. UKMustangfan must not have dealt with much in regards to being looked at oddly, or obsessively questioned for not being an evangelical type. I have dealt with it far more than I would have liked as has Jim and I suspect formerkywrestler as well. Based on conversations I have had with many of them I have no doubt that a large segment of that population would stay home as opposed to voting for a Mormon.

No, I'm thinking even much more so than normal. I think an overwhelming majority of the hardcore religious right will be sitting out because of Romney's Mormonism, and a lot of non-idealogues who supported Obama last time will also be sitting out.

 

Pretty accurate analysis

Why do you leave out civil liberties? Do you think Romney would be better in that regard? It seems conservatives a generally in favor of a strong and intrusive government on that side of the ledger. It would seem that it would be a coin flip between the two for a libertarian. Considering how rare it is for a candidate to actually implement what they campaigned on and how slippery Romney is I don't think fmkyw's position is the least bit outrageous.

 

Because fiscal issues are what people are more concerned with. Thats what they will be basing their votes on. Thats why I was focusing on fiscal issues.

And its debateable as to which side of the aisle implements policies that impact peoples civil liberties.

 

On a side note, I would say that most Presidents in the past have gave us a huge portion of what they campaigned for. Since the 80's, which past presidents haven't gave us what they campaigned on? Obama ended the Iraq war, delivered his new health care. Reagan signed historixc tax reform. One of George W. Bush's promises was education reform. Although people may not of liked it, he did campaign on this. Under Clinton, the US was in good economic shape.

I think he is alluding to the fact that marvel only seems concerned with "economic liberties".

 

 

I'm concerned as to whether or not I as well as my entire generation is going to have a job when we graduate college. Like the vast majority of Americans, my main concern in the election is economic policies.

I'm concerned as to whether or not I as well as my entire generation is going to have a job when we graduate college. Like the vast majority of Americans, my main concern in the election is economic policies.

This is a whole different subject, one which I will address in another thread if you so choose. But for a little preview, I will tell you that I don't have much pity.

Because fiscal issues are what people are more concerned with. Thats what they will be basing their votes on. Thats why I was focusing on fiscal issues.

And its debateable as to which side of the aisle implements policies that impact peoples civil liberties.

 

On a side note, I would say that most Presidents in the past have gave us a huge portion of what they campaigned for. Since the 80's, which past presidents haven't gave us what they campaigned on? Obama ended the Iraq war, delivered his new health care. Reagan signed historixc tax reform. One of George W. Bush's promises was education reform. Although people may not of liked it, he did campaign on this. Under Clinton, the US was in good economic shape.

But your original assertion had nothing to do with what people will be basing their vote on. It was that it is somehow more outrageous for a libertarian to vote for Obama over Romney. Which you haven't really backed up.

I was surprised by a report that Romney is the first non incumbent Republican to win both Iowa and New Hampshire. I wouldn't have thought that it was rare, let alone the first time.

But your original assertion had nothing to do with what people will be basing their vote on. It was that it is somehow more outrageous for a libertarian to vote for Obama over Romney. Which you haven't really backed up.

 

I was answering Habibs question about why I left out civil liberties. Read the post if you have too.