Is it too much of a stretch to think that this girl might actually be offended by this? .

She is probably also offended about the Georges, Hamiltons, Jacksons, etc in her wallet. "In God We Trust". She should probably just get rid of her cash like she wants to get rid of the "art".

So you think a public school should be able to hang a replica of Jesus on the cross in every classroom and since it "just hangs there" it would not be a violation of the Constitution?

 

Remove it. Move on. Educate the children and do not let this easy-to-fix problem turn into a distraction.

 

Well, its different for numerous reasons. 1. Your example includes Jesus Christ which is a specific reference to Christianity. 2. Your example includes every classroom when the issue at hand is only referring to an auditorium or hallway.

 

Now for the main points which will be the issue in court but before hand, the rules of the Establishment clause or 'Lemon Test': The statute must have a secular legislative purpose; second, its principal or primary effect must be one that neither advances nor inhibits religion; finally, the statute must not foster "an excessive government entanglement with religion."

 

3. The purpose of this 'prayer' will be considered secular because the main point or effect can be considered non faith based which means it falls in line with the Establishment Clause. 4. The primary purpose or effect of this 'prayer' is not to advance religion or to inhibit religion, which falls in line with the Establishment Clause because the main point of the 'prayer' is not religiously based and the religious aspect will be deemed as incidental. Lastly, the 'prayer' does not foster an excessive government entanglement with religion.

 

The example you gave obviously violates all these.

 

Look up the "Lemon Test" -which is what the courts use to sort out these types of things since Lemon v. Kurtzman (1971)- if you need more info.

Is it too much of a stretch to think that this girl might actually be offended by this? Seems like the easy route is to label it "wanting attention" and dismissing it from there. That way everyone is ok at the end of the day...

 

Too much or a stretch? No. Am I Accurate? Probably.

 

You may be right, this girl may of been legitimately offended. That wasn't the point I was trying to make. Clyde made a comment about the distraction that the Mural has on education. I simply believe she has made more of a distraction than that simple banner ever or could of made.

 

Also, if she gets offended by something as dumb as this, I seriously have sympathy for this girl every time she opens her wallet or finds loose change.

Is it too much of a stretch to think that this girl might actually be offended by this? Seems like the easy route is to label it "wanting attention" and dismissing it from there. That way everyone is ok at the end of the day...

 

Obviously only she knows if she's truly offended, we can only go by gut feel on how we all would react in a similar situation. The younger teenagers I know are not offended by anything not directly targeted at them. Therefore based on my experiences I have a hard time buying that she is truly offended. JMO. How about you? What's your gut feel on it?

While we're at it, let's forbid students to write the year/date "2011" on assignments/tests/homework. After all, it's 2011 because that's how many years we are removed from the birth of Christ. Seems like this Gregorian calendar is awfully slanted toward Christianity, therefore could be perceived as unconstitutional & should immediately be removed from the school system.

 

The French tried changing that one, it didn't work so well and I think the guy lost his head.

While we're at it, let's forbid students to write the year/date "2011" on assignments/tests/homework. After all, it's 2011 because that's how many years we are removed from the birth of Christ. Seems like this Gregorian calendar is awfully slanted toward Christianity, therefore could be perceived as unconstitutional & should immediately be removed from the school system.

Never thought of that, Randy. Thanks for the enlightenment.

Clyde's extremes remind me how tolerant we are when it comes to beliefs in science stuff like the big bang theory. This paragraph could be studied and benefit the educational process. Have an opinion based on study and research... not pretending things don't exist. And yes Clyde I believe that should go for a lot of things but you'll be able to lay out extremes that wouldn't be age appropriate.

 

I'm going to be honest. I am not sure what you're saying. Can you re-state it or simplify it for me?

Too much or a stretch? No. Am I Accurate? Probably.

 

You may be right, this girl may of been legitimately offended. That wasn't the point I was trying to make. Clyde made a comment about the distraction that the Mural has on education. I simply believe she has made more of a distraction than that simple banner ever or could of made.

 

Also, if she gets offended by something as dumb as this, I seriously have sympathy for this girl every time she opens her wallet or finds loose change.

 

I did not make a statement about the mural being a distraction.

 

I said that the uproar over something that is debatable as to it's place in a public school is a distraction.

 

This is not as cut-and-dry as the football game/prayer issue.

 

As I said in my first post I'm torn on this one. I lean towards having it removed because it smells like a prayer. If no one complains about it then I'm cool with leaving it. However, this mural(which I do not pass off as art) simply isn't worth the distraction and serves no educational value once it's been challenged in court.

 

If I am the man in charge I simply do not want to waste limited resources (time and money) defending something that does not help me do my #1 job which is to educate the children.

 

We can debate all day as to the legality of it. I am not an attorney so my arguments are going to be at a high level but in the end irrelevant to my main argument.

 

We spend too much time fighting to have prayer in school and we lose sight of the main purpose of the activities that are to take place within those walls.

Well, its different for numerous reasons. 1. Your example includes Jesus Christ which is a specific reference to Christianity. 2. Your example includes every classroom when the issue at hand is only referring to an auditorium or hallway.

 

.

 

All I can go off of is what you typed.

Obviously only she knows if she's truly offended, we can only go by gut feel on how we all would react in a similar situation. The younger teenagers I know are not offended by anything not directly targeted at them. Therefore based on my experiences I have a hard time buying that she is truly offended. JMO. How about you? What's your gut feel on it?

My gut says that it's a futile attempt to get into the mind of a 16 year old girl. But I'm willing to give her the benefit of the doubt. The mural is what's on trial here...not the girl's character.

Too much or a stretch? No. Am I Accurate? Probably.

 

You may be right, this girl may of been legitimately offended. That wasn't the point I was trying to make. Clyde made a comment about the distraction that the Mural has on education. I simply believe she has made more of a distraction than that simple banner ever or could of made.

 

Also, if she gets offended by something as dumb as this, I seriously have sympathy for this girl every time she opens her wallet or finds loose change.

Isn't it fair to say that the mural caused the girl's reaction? Without the mural would there have been a reaction?

Is it too much of a stretch to think that this girl might actually be offended by this? Seems like the easy route is to label it "wanting attention" and dismissing it from there. That way everyone is ok at the end of the day...

To completely honest it's much easier to believe she's looking for attention, which is what I think she's doing.

Bottom line... I probably need to look into private school for my kids.

yes I was a Christian at an earlier age than 10.

 

If she cant handle the heat then get out and dont fuss.