Isn't the inauguration a public, taxpayer funded event? And isn't there a prayer offered, often times in the name of Jesus?

Isn't the inauguration a public, taxpayer funded event? And isn't there a prayer offered, often times in the name of Jesus?

 

The Supreme Court session that banned prayer in public schools opened with the invocation:

"Oyez! Oyez! Oyez! All persons having business before the Honorable, the Supreme Court of the United States, are admonished to draw near and give their attention, for the Court is now sitting. God save the United States and this Honorable Court!"

The Supreme Court session that banned prayer in public schools opened with the invocation:

"Oyez! Oyez! Oyez! All persons having business before the Honorable, the Supreme Court of the United States, are admonished to draw near and give their attention, for the Court is now sitting. God save the United States and this Honorable Court!"

 

I wasn't aware of that. Learn something every day.

My question is simple....Would you feel differently if it were a Muslim wanting to pray?

 

Everyone is entitled to pray during the ceremony. Just not aloud and on display. The Bible tells us not to make a show of it anyways, so I'm not sure what your issue is mtn ref?

 

 

Great question. Looking forward to the backpedaling... I mean the answer to that one.

If they did a Muslim prayer I would not care, I would sit there quietly and be respectful to those and what they believe in. Does it affect me, NO, I am not one of Islam, so it means nothing to me.

 

But I have enough respect for the others that have a long standing tradition of their prayer that I wouldn't go cry to the courts about my rights being violated.

 

And CLYDE, as for me saying you are a Christian, I was not taking a pop shot at you. You stated you were a Christian in another post and I was mearly asking you as a Christian do you feel that it is a dumb mater to begin with in the first place.

Rick Warren gave the prayer at Obama's 2008 inaugural, praying in the name of Jesus and to "Almighty God, our Father." Not sure why the Constitution, as some of you persist, forbids a graduate to use the phrase "bow our heads" or the word "prayer" & yet that same Constitution allows for the President-Elect to invite a Christian minister to publicly pray to "God, our Father" & in the name of Jesus.

If they did a Muslim prayer I would not care, I would sit there quietly and be respectful to those and what they believe in. Does it affect me, NO, I am not one of Islam, so it means nothing to me.

 

But I have enough respect for the others that have a long standing tradition of their prayer that I wouldn't go cry to the courts about my rights being violated.

 

And CLYDE, as for me saying you are a Christian, I was not taking a pop shot at you. You stated you were a Christian in another post and I was mearly asking you as a Christian do you feel that it is a dumb mater to begin with in the first place.

 

Even as a Christian, I do not think it is a "dumb matter." I think we're simply following the law of the land which I fully respect.

 

Again, if the act of praying is so important to you and these people at the event why can you not simply bow your head and pray silently? God will know. You'll get full credit.

Rick Warren gave the prayer at Obama's 2008 inaugural, praying in the name of Jesus and to "Almighty God, our Father." Not sure why the Constitution, as some of you persist, forbids a graduate to use the phrase "bow our heads" or the word "prayer" & yet that same Constitution allows for the President-Elect to invite a Christian minister to pray to "God, our Father" & in the name of Jesus.

 

My guess (and I do not know the legal rulings intimately) is that it has something to do with cumpulsory education vs freely attending a public inauguration. That's probably oversimplifying it but I bet it's the core of the argument.

My guess (and I do not know the legal rulings intimately) is that it has something to do with cumpulsory education vs freely attending a public inauguration. That's probably oversimplifying it but I bet it's the core of the argument.

 

I would think that this judge probably looked to Santa Fe School District as precedent. That decision was the case about a prayer over the PA system prior to high school football games. The court ruled there that such speech is no longer private, but public speech, and that a listener would unquestionably perceive prayer over a public address system as stamped with the school's "seal of approval."

 

Rehnquist - along with Scalia and Thomas - dissented in that case. There was primarily a game of semantics being played between the opinion and the dissent, with Rehnquist believing that the prayer was private speech, chosen by the speaker and not the school.

My guess (and I do not know the legal rulings intimately) is that it has something to do with cumpulsory education vs freely attending a public inauguration. That's probably oversimplifying it but I bet it's the core of the argument.

 

But aren't both events government sponsored?

I'll take the bait...

 

EVERYBODY is entitled to pray however they feel they should given their particular belief system. This is not a violation of their freedom of religion.

 

EVERYBODY is permitted to pray out loud in their church, in their house, on the sidewalk, in a public park, on the radio, etc... Constitutionally, there can not be the appearance of an establishment of a particular religion at a taxpayer funded event such as graduation. In the grand scheme of things, one prayer at graduation is probably not that big of a deal. While I won't go as far as to say that this is "just stupid" these particular arguments are arguably frivolous. All of us can argue all day as to how far is too far, but per the supreme law of the land, this activity of a violation. Additionally, the Supreme Court has interpreted this conduct the same way for years.

 

This particular situation has been beaten to death, the situation is pretty simple. You can't have your cake and eat it too. Subsidized education? Even if the class is 100% Christian, technically, absolutely no favoritism towards any particular faith. Answer, fork out the dough for a private school, or pray all you want quietly. I would also argue that this protection should be even heightened with a school setting given the threat of publicly funded indoctrination.

 

I'm a proud Christian, and a Catholic one at that. In my opinion, society in general has seen a decline of values. We have also seen an increase in Christians picking and choosing which parts of the Bible/their religion they wish to follow and disregarding the rest. Unfortunately, this has been mirrored in society by people using the Constitution when it helps their argument, and disregarding it when things aren't how they wish them to be. If the Constitution means anything, it offers protections when they may be unpopular.

 

If you're really worried about the decline of values and Christianity, attack the man who sits in the front pew on Sunday, yet hits his wife on Tuesday, or the parent who spends their paycheck at the liquor store instead of putting food on the table. Otherwise, we're left with talking points with such blatant holes in them, that frankly they come across as ridiculous.

 

Somebody paid attention during the ConLaw. Very well said.

But aren't both events government sponsored?

 

Paid by taxpayers also I am sure.

But aren't both events government sponsored?

 

Don't know.

Even as a Christian, I do not think it is a "dumb matter." I think we're simply following the law of the land which I fully respect.

 

Again, if the act of praying is so important to you and these people at the event why can you not simply bow your head and pray silently? God will know. You'll get full credit.

 

 

Why should Christians have to be the ones to remain silent. I know all about God knowing that in our heart we are praying, but in a sense of we are trying to just do it silently as not to make some mad, isn't that denying GOD.

 

Clyde I know we never agree, but maybe one day I can keep on and change your mind.

 

IMO some laws are dumb. This is one of them.

Why should Christians have to be the ones to remain silent. I know all about God knowing that in our heart we are praying, but in a sense of we are trying to just do it silently as not to make some mad, isn't that denying GOD.

 

No.

 

 

IMO some laws are dumb. This is one of them.

 

Irrelevant to the argument. It IS the law and it's not anti-Christian.