What does this mean?

 

It means the winners get to decide what were the defining moments in a war. Or do you think every outcome that was written about went just as it said in your history book?

 

D-day is not the same for the winners and losers. Pearl Harbor would be looked at differently had the war gone a different direction. How does one trace back to the precise moment when a war action started? Isn't it usually a build up of things, set off by one moment? (That the winner gets to determine.)

 

When did the Iraq war conflict begin?

It means the winners get to decide what were the defining moments in a war. Or do you think every outcome that was written about went just as it said in your history book?

 

D-day is not the same for the winners and losers. Pearl Harbor would be looked at differently had the war gone a different direction. How does one trace back to the precise moment when a war action started? Isn't it usually a build up of things, set off by one moment? (That the winner gets to determine.)

 

When did the Iraq war conflict begin?

 

If we were at war with a country, I could see what you're saying. But we're at war with terrorism. Terrorism knows no boundaries, and the success can't be evaluated in a traditional fashion.

So we a fighting a boogeyman?

 

I don't buy it. That saves us face if we lose. Just like Vietnam. We need to get behind the war effort or get the heck out of there. Dippin' our toes in the sand doesn't cut it. And yes if we decide we are at war, mothers and children will be killed, because that is what happens in a war. That happens in terrorism too, but apparently just against the free. Let's shift the tables on them, and blow them to smithereens and then have 16 different factions take the glory for the killings. See how much sleep they get at night then.

I don't think that would accomplish what you hope it would.

I don't think that would accomplish what you hope it would.

 

I truly admire the Israeli's as their policy is you kill one of ours, we kill 10 of yours-how long do you want to play?

I truly admire the Israeli's as their policy is you kill one of ours, we kill 10 of yours-how long do you want to play?

 

And there are still acts of terroism in Israel.

And there are still acts of terroism in Israel.

 

And when they are found out-the terrorists are as good as dead. This makes all happy. The Isreali's take out vengeance, and the martyrs get to visit the virgins quickly.

I really think we are all being very naive if we think that there will not be another attack on our soil. Not if, but when. We had a group of Muslim terrorists broken up in Burlington, KY not so long ago. I wonder how people would feel if a right wing Christian extremist group that were followers of Tim McVeigh wanted to build a place to worship and praise Mr. McVeigh next to the site of the Oklahoma City bombing? Would everyone here say, ahhh......it's ok, it's there right to be there as long as the property is zoned for a place of worship. This country has become way to politically correct for me.

 

Surely you aren't saying that the bold is a comparison to the proposed Islamic cultural center?

If you take a trip back to World War II, most people were very much against the Japanese due to what happened at Pearl Harbor. Many people had a great deal of distrust in the Japanese - so much so that the United States forced many Japanese-Americans into internment camps in the west. The United States defeated the Japanese over the next four years in the war. After a while, the Japanese eventually became a close ally in trade (heavy) and politics (lighter). So mistreatment can certainly be overcome.

 

How does that apply to the Muslim situation? Well there was an attack. And many Americans are skeptical of Muslims, even Muslim-Americans. And while the United States government hasn't done anything like internment camps, it is apparent that many people have no problem limiting the rights of some American citizens just because they are different than the majority. One can only hope that over time Americans will come to realize that it wasn't all Muslims that attacked New York City and most Muslim-Americans just want to live their lives, practice their religion, and pursue their own happiness as American citizens. The same way it took a while for Americans to realize that it wasn't all Japanese (or Japanese-Americans) that bombed Pearl Harbor.

If you take a trip back to World War II, most people were very much against the Japanese due to what happened at Pearl Harbor. Many people had a great deal of distrust in the Japanese - so much so that the United States forced many Japanese-Americans into internment camps in the west. The United States defeated the Japanese over the next four years in the war. After a while, the Japanese eventually became a close ally in trade (heavy) and politics (lighter). So mistreatment can certainly be overcome.

 

How does that apply to the Muslim situation? Well there was an attack. And many Americans are skeptical of Muslims, even Muslim-Americans. And while the United States government hasn't done anything like internment camps, it is apparent that many people have no problem limiting the rights of some American citizens just because they are different than the majority. One can only hope that over time Americans will come to realize that it wasn't all Muslims that attacked New York City and most Muslim-Americans just want to live their lives, practice their religion, and pursue their own happiness as American citizens. The same way it took a while for Americans to realize that it wasn't all Japanese (or Japanese-Americans) that bombed Pearl Harbor.

 

Great post. I think that Americans are good at heart and do already realize this, or will come to.

Osama Bin Laden was right about one thing about Americans-our attention spans are short.

If you take a trip back to World War II, most people were very much against the Japanese due to what happened at Pearl Harbor. Many people had a great deal of distrust in the Japanese - so much so that the United States forced many Japanese-Americans into internment camps in the west. The United States defeated the Japanese over the next four years in the war. After a while, the Japanese eventually became a close ally in trade (heavy) and politics (lighter). So mistreatment can certainly be overcome.

 

How does that apply to the Muslim situation? Well there was an attack. And many Americans are skeptical of Muslims, even Muslim-Americans. And while the United States government hasn't done anything like internment camps, it is apparent that many people have no problem limiting the rights of some American citizens just because they are different than the majority. One can only hope that over time Americans will come to realize that it wasn't all Muslims that attacked New York City and most Muslim-Americans just want to live their lives, practice their religion, and pursue their own happiness as American citizens. The same way it took a while for Americans to realize that it wasn't all Japanese (or Japanese-Americans) that bombed Pearl Harbor.

 

I think that it is definitely a great analogy, but as rockmom and others have pointed out it gets very great when we are taking about the Nation of Islam vs. the actual Nation of Japan. I obviously wasn't around back then, but I feel as though the internment camps were somewhat justified back then. That certainly wouldn't fly now, obviously. Just everything gets really gray because we are not talking about a country, I feel like.

Surely you aren't saying that the bold is a comparison to the proposed Islamic cultural center?

 

Please explain the difference to me? I'm curious.

So we a fighting a boogeyman?

 

I don't buy it. That saves us face if we lose. Just like Vietnam. We need to get behind the war effort or get the heck out of there. Dippin' our toes in the sand doesn't cut it.

It's not that simplistic anymore. As the political structure of the world has changed, so has the very concept of war. No longer are the days when your ten thousand lined up across from my ten thousand and started shooting. The enemy doesn't wear a uniform or fly his colors anymore; he blends in with innocent people and attacks from the shadows. We aren't fighting a country, so much as an ideology, which makes The War on Terror the most difficult we've ever faced. That being said, the 9/11 attacks should never be construed as justification to randomly fear or persecute Muslim people.

 

Although I do believe in developing profiles to stop potential terrorists (and race enters into it), it's impossible to tell a terrorist by the way a person looks, or where they pray. Just as in Hitler's Germany, Muslim people are not universally evil, nor do they support the atrocities committed in their name. I know several German people, and they will tell you that the vast majority of the population had no idea what was going on in the death camps. They may have bought into some of Hitler's racist propaganda, but their Nazi party allegiance was based on post-World War I nationalistic fervor, and not an adherence to Hitler's genocidal doctrine.

It's not that simplistic anymore. As the political structure of the world has changed, so has the very concept of war. No longer are the days when your ten thousand lined up across from my ten thousand and started shooting. The enemy doesn't wear a uniform or fly his colors anymore; he blends in with innocent people and attacks from the shadows. We aren't fighting a country, so much as an ideology, which makes The War on Terror the most difficult we've ever faced. That being said, the 9/11 attacks should never be construed as justification to randomly fear or persecute Muslim people.

 

Although I do believe in developing profiles to stop potential terrorists (and race enters into it), it's impossible to tell a terrorist by the way a person looks, or where they pray. Just as in Hitler's Germany, Muslim people are not universally evil, nor do they support the atrocities committed in their name. I know several German people, and they will tell you that the vast majority of the population had no idea what was going on in the death camps. They may have bought into some of Hitler's racist propaganda, but their Nazi party allegiance was based on post-World War I nationalistic fervor, and not an adherence to Hitler's genocidal doctrine.

 

Agree with some of what you have said. The military part. That is why you don't "declare" war-you have covert operations and kill at will.

As to the German part, I have never believed that the vast majority had no idea what was going on. They chose not to know, or that is their story after they lost.

Once again, all on this board seem to cherish freedom, as I do, but freedom without the ability to defend it is worthless.