February 26, 201016 yr There were 2 parts that both agreed upon, according to the news this morning. For the life of me, I can't remember which two. But, if they DID agree on 2 parts, then why the push to completely scratch it? Because these 2 items may cover 50 pages or maybe 100. That then leaves over 2000 pages that is not wanted by a majority of the American people. A majority of Americans want some changes. These 2 items may be part of the changes they seek, but they do not want the other 2000 pages of government interference in their lives.
February 27, 201016 yr Author Of course costs will go up. The question is whether they will go up as fast as they would without the bill. My small business was just notified of a 35 percent rate increase for next year. The existing system is broken and getting worse. The enate bill is not perfect, but with the elimination of a few provisions it will be a big improvement over the existing system. I would be very happy to see the congress add a few of the republican ideas i.e. tort reform. Include some of those ideas in the fix up bill. Name one government program that is run more efficiently/cost effectively than its private sector counterpart. I'll save you some time. There is not one. So to answer your question, yes the government "plan" will be much more costly over time than any private sector option.
February 27, 201016 yr Name one government program that is run more efficiently/cost effectively than its private sector counterpart. I'll save you some time. There is not one. So to answer your question, yes the government "plan" will be much more costly over time than any private sector option. The government won't be running anything if the Senate bill is accepted. It's a fairly modest proposal, all things considered. There's no doubt the summit was political gamesmanship. Republican opposition has been the same thing: deny Obama this accomplishment and it makes their electoral future much brighter. But, Obama outmaneuvered the Republicans on this one.
February 27, 201016 yr Name one government program that is run more efficiently/cost effectively than its private sector counterpart. I'll save you some time. There is not one. So to answer your question, yes the government "plan" will be much more costly over time than any private sector option. We have been through this before: Fire Protection Police Protection National Military State Military Transportation infrastructure Public Educations (despite all of the falsehoods spread about it) Public Universities FDA NIH OSHA Justice System and the list goes on and on and on
February 28, 201016 yr But, Obama outmaneuvered the Republicans on this one. I'm curious to know why you believe this.
February 28, 201016 yr We have been through this before: Fire Protection Police Protection National Military State Military Transportation infrastructure Public Educations (despite all of the falsehoods spread about it) Public Universities FDA NIH OSHA Justice System and the list goes on and on and on Add Medicare to the list.
February 28, 201016 yr We have been through this before: Fire Protection Police Protection National Military State Military Transportation infrastructure Public Educations (despite all of the falsehoods spread about it) Public Universities FDA NIH OSHA Justice System and the list goes on and on and on The comparsion was between private and government -run entities. All these you listed are govenment-run, with only education having a private counterpart. And as far as public education goes it is so-so. There is a lot of bloated waste in public education. Government wastes a lot. For example many government-run agencies get rid of a lot money or use up materials at year's end or they see the next years funding reduced. My son and about 6 other guys shot off 60,000 rounds of ammo late last year just for this reason. Their base did not want to see their allotment go down. Its wrong, but it is the way the system works. Just ask Rangel the "Tax Cheat" who is in charge of doling out everyone's money but his own.
February 28, 201016 yr Author The government won't be running anything if the Senate bill is accepted. It's a fairly modest proposal, all things considered. There's no doubt the summit was political gamesmanship. Republican opposition has been the same thing: deny Obama this accomplishment and it makes their electoral future much brighter. But, Obama outmaneuvered the Republicans on this one. The only thing that he has done is that he tried to give his peeps a get out of jail free card when they pull the reconcilliation sham. That way when they are campaigning in the fall, they will say, look we tried to "work" with Republicans through the "summit" and they would not play ball... Hardly outmaneuvering as I am betting the people will not buy it in November.
February 28, 201016 yr Author The comparsion was between private and government -run entities. All these you listed are govenment-run, with only education having a private counterpart. And as far as public education goes it is so-so. There is a lot of bloated waste in public education. Government wastes a lot. For example many government-run agencies get rid of a lot money or use up materials at year's end or they see the next years funding reduced. My son and about 6 other guys shot off 60,000 rounds of ammo late last year just for this reason. Their base did not want to see their allotment go down. Its wrong, but it is the way the system works. Just ask Rangel the "Tax Cheat" who is in charge of doling out everyone's money but his own. :thumb: Glad you brought up medicare. Why do you go look up what the original cost projections were for medicare when it was created and what they thought it would cost 10 years out and what it really cost...
February 28, 201016 yr I'm curious to know why you believe this. I think the Republicans were put in a no-win situation with the summit. They couldn't turn it down, but they couldn't win it either. Democrats don't need Republican votes at this point, and I think the summit helped deflect some criticism from that side. While Republicans like Paul Ryan made effective points, the end result was that they were participatory and Democrats teased out concessions of agreement on pieces of the bill, which is what they were looking for.
February 28, 201016 yr The only thing that he has done is that he tried to give his peeps a get out of jail free card when they pull the reconcilliation sham. That way when they are campaigning in the fall, they will say, look we tried to "work" with Republicans through the "summit" and they would not play ball... Hardly outmaneuvering as I am betting the people will not buy it in November. They won't buy what? Most people don't understand what a filibuster is, what a cloture vote is, or how reconciliation works, which makes criticizing it ineffective. I'm sure Democrats will suffer losses in November, but Obama will be strong in 2012.
February 28, 201016 yr Author They won't buy what? Most people don't understand what a filibuster is, what a cloture vote is, or how reconciliation works, which makes criticizing it ineffective. I'm sure Democrats will suffer losses in November, but Obama will be strong in 2012. They do not have to understand it, the court of public opinion and people already have shown through polling that it is a bad idea. It comes off as changing the rules after the game has been played. Reconciliation was never meant to be used like this and everyone knows it. IMO it will cost the dems more in November than they would have lost if they do no use it. If they do this, then cloture is going to go out the window and I do not want to hear any grousing about it by the left after they lose the house and the senate when they have now opened the can of worms for the right to do it as well. It is bad policy for America. Cloture is there for a reason and needs to be respected.
February 28, 201016 yr They do not have to understand it, the court of public opinion and people already have shown through polling that it is a bad idea. It comes off as changing the rules after the game has been played. Reconciliation was never meant to be used like this and everyone knows it. IMO it will cost the dems more in November than they would have lost if they do no use it. If they do this, then cloture is going to go out the window and I do not want to hear any grousing about it by the left after they lose the house and the senate when they have now opened the can of worms for the right to do it as well. It is bad policy for America. Cloture is there for a reason and needs to be respected. It's a very difficult argument to make to the public that the Democrats cheated because they amended a bill with a majority of senators, that's how people understand the institution to work. Reconciliation has been done plenty of times before as well, mostly by Republicans, which further weakens their argument to the public that the Democrats are acting outside of the rules. The majority party is going to lose seats as long as the economy is struggling, but if they pass this bill Democrats will be able to hang their hats on it for some time to come, which is precisely why Republicans have been so obstinate.
February 28, 201016 yr It's a very difficult argument to make to the public that the Democrats cheated because they amended a bill with a majority of senators, that's how people understand the institution to work. Reconciliation has been done plenty of times before as well, mostly by Republicans, which further weakens their argument to the public that the Democrats are acting outside of the rules. The majority party is going to lose seats as long as the economy is struggling, but if they pass this bill Democrats will be able to hang their hats on it for some time to come, which is precisely why Republicans have been so obstinate. Personally I think the Republicans have been so obstinate because it's a bad bill and it's bad for this country.
February 28, 201016 yr The majority party is going to lose seats as long as the economy is struggling, but if they pass this bill Democrats will be able to hang their hats on it for some time to come, which is precisely why Republicans have been so obstinate.I disagree, if they pass this bill in it's current form their hats aren't what's going to be hung.
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