I think you can be a good or great coach and still earn the lable of choker. Daughtery for all his faults instilled toughness in the UNC players Roy won it with. Roy is a great recruiter and a very good coach, but when it comes to the tourney he's a choker. If you have the best talent year in and year out you should have more than one title.

Again, he has not had the best talent year in/year out. It's happened once, 1997...

Again, he has not had the best talent year in/year out. It's happened once, 1997...

 

:thumb:

I think you can be a good or great coach and still earn the lable of choker. Daughtery for all his faults instilled toughness in the UNC players Roy won it with. Roy is a great recruiter and a very good coach, but when it comes to the tourney he's a choker. If you have the best talent year in and year out you should have more than one title.

 

That toughness you speak of was never evidenced until Williams came. They were cream puffs before. I don't like the Tar Heels but I respect them. Add to that I live down here among them and you remember those Doherty years as nothing short of weak.

 

I've already supplied a lot of evidence that shows he's not as BIG a choker as you seem to make him out to be. Can you show the actual data when he probably should have won the NCAA going into the tourney but failed. (Remember that 1997 is well documented already by me and Sticky Mitts)

Any top level coach, at a top level school, with top level players, that DOESN't win the title every year gets labled an under-achiever. Mike Krzyzewski, gets the same rap. Roy is a Top 5 coach for good reason, he need not answer to anyone. Here's to him losing every game the rest of the year :thumb:.

Just my opinion Roy is a choker. If he wins it this year I may change my opinion. They don't have to win every year just once every ten or so.

I still don't understand how a coach can choke when he's not the one out on the floor playing. It makes no sense.

Any top level coach, at a top level school, with top level players, that DOESN't win the title every year gets labled an under-achiever. Mike Krzyzewski, gets the same rap. Roy is a Top 5 coach for good reason, he need not answer to anyone. Here's to him losing every game the rest of the year :thumb:.

 

But we have that gimmi about 7 miles down the road...

Big difference: They had one year of learning under Roy Williams, Tubby's players were still fresh from learning from the grand master himself: Rick Pitino.

 

 

But Tubby's players were not the same kids that won the '96 title or were the '97 runnerup. Tubby won the '98 title with less talent than either the '96 or '97 team. One of the only teams in NCAA history with no all americans on the roster. The bigtime players were all gone, .. many to the NBA in '98.

 

As far as Roy Williams, he is a great coach. He was a consistent winner at Kansas and it shows how hard it is to win the big one. Coach K is a great coach, but the past several years, they have not been a contender. These things go in cycles. We will never see another UCLA run, ... ever.

You're right about UCLA things were much easier back then.

Yeah, he's one of the best recruiters, but with the talent he's had over the years it's a crime that he's only won 1 title.

Another good example of what you say is former North Carolina coach Dean Smith. He coached over 30 years and, other than UCLA, probably had more future NBA stars than anyone else during his tenure. Yet he was able to win just two national championships:

1982 (James Worthy is still sending Georgetown thank you cards for that famous pass),

and 1993 (more UNC thank you cards for Michigan's (in)ability to count their time outs).

So the Heels eeked out wins those two years.

 

IMO Dean Smith should have had several more titles. But he's looked at as one of the best coaches of all time, and is a HOF member. Maybe I'm being too critical but I was never overly impressed with him.

Any top level coach, at a top level school, with top level players, that DOESN't win the title every year gets labled an under-achiever. Mike Krzyzewski, gets the same rap. Roy is a Top 5 coach for good reason, he need not answer to anyone. Here's to him losing every game the rest of the year :thumb:.

 

Love it!!!

Coach K is a great coach, but the past several years, they have not been a contender.

How many is several? 5-7?

 

2001 - Champs

2004 - Final Four

I still don't understand how a coach can choke when he's not the one out on the floor playing. It makes no sense.

 

:laugh: I guess a coach has absolutley nothing to do with winning. They should just get the players there, play golf all day, and show up on game days.

But Tubby's players were not the same kids that won the '96 title or were the '97 runnerup. Tubby won the '98 title with less talent than either the '96 or '97 team. One of the only teams in NCAA history with no all americans on the roster. The bigtime players were all gone, .. many to the NBA in '98.

 

As far as Roy Williams, he is a great coach. He was a consistent winner at Kansas and it shows how hard it is to win the big one. Coach K is a great coach, but the past several years, they have not been a contender. These things go in cycles. We will never see another UCLA run, ... ever.

 

Jeff Shepard, Wayne Turner, Allen Edwards, Nazi Mohammed, Jamal Magloire, Scott Padgett, Cameron Mills (just off the top of my head), all had experience playing in the big game, and for the love of pete people,they were playing a bunch of 25 year old Mormons. The Washington Generals would have given them a better game.