I thought that too; but reading the way they state the rule on their site, it says "between any TWO teams involved in the tie." It doesn't say you can't use any team involved in the tie. Of course, just because it doesn't say it, doesn't mean it isn't true.

We've been involved in a couple of these scenarios before and you couldn't count them then. I admit, the wording is a bit muddy.

 

I think all past tie breaker calculations are posted on the KHSAA website, so we could check them out for sure.

Here's how the KHSAA Handbook stated the tie-breaker procedure. I interpret it to mean you can use your opponents, as long as you don't count their wins against teams involved in the tie. See what you guys think:

 

b) TIE-BREAKER (more than two teams). Should three or more

teams tie for the a district position based upon the win-loss

record, the position shall be determined by the following:

 

i) If one of the teams has defeated each of the other teams

tied in games contested between them, that team shall be

declared to hold the highest position, and the winner of the

game between the remaining teams (if less than four) shall

be declared the second highest position. In the event of

more than three teams being tied, where one has defeated

each of the tied teams, that team shall be declared the

highest position, and the tie-breaking procedure shall be

re-applied for the remaining tied teams.

 

ii) If the tie remains, each team tied for the position shall

receive one point for each game won by any four of their

defeated opponents in all games, except for the games

played between any two of the tied teams. All games played

shall be counted in applying the tie-breaking procedure,

including out of state games, with the exception that a

defeated school may be counted only once in the procedure

regardless of the number of games played against that

particular school. Teams awarded forfeit victories (whether

or not a forfeit fee is paid) may count the defeated opponents

of the forfeiting team, provided the game was not replaced

on the schedule.

 

iii) If the tie remains after application of provision (ii), an

additional defeated opponent’s wins will be added to the

point total for each team until the tie is broken and the

winner of the tied position declared, or until all games are

exhausted.

 

iv) If the tie for the position involves only three teams, and the

application of (ii) and (iii) results in one team being declared

the winner of the tied position based on point totals, the

highest point total from the application of (ii) and (iii)

between the two remaining tied teams shall be declared to

hold the next position.

Depending on how this rules question shakes out:

 

Ashland currently has either 17 or 19 points.

 

Bryan Station currently has either 8 or 13 points.

 

Woodford County currently has either 8 or 10 points.

So Ashland would be the 2 seed reguardless of next weeks outcome?

It still makes no sense to me. I think they wrote the thing incorrectly. Here's the way I interpret the rule. If one team wins against the other two, they are the top seed, and the other two are based on head to head competition. If no one team is undefeated against the others then it goes to the total wins count against (4) teams not involved in the tie. We need some BGP lawyers to visit this thread. I think rule ii should read like this:

 

ii) If the tie remains, each team tied for the position shall

receive one point for each game won by any four of their

defeated opponents in all games, except for the games

played between any two (I think they mean 3) of the tied teams. All games played

shall be counted in applying the tie-breaking procedure,

including out of state games, with the exception that a

defeated school may be counted only once in the procedure

regardless of the number of games played against that

particular school. Teams awarded forfeit victories (whether

or not a forfeit fee is paid) may count the defeated opponents

of the forfeiting team, provided the game was not replaced

on the schedule.

So Ashland would be the 2 seed reguardless of next weeks outcome?

We can't say that for sure just yet. There are a lot of games yet to be played. Station and Woodford both have the chance to add two more defeated opponents. So that could shake things up considerably.

 

However, if Ashland wins next week, everything is settled. Ashland would be in first place with Johnson second, Woodford County third and Bryan Station fourth.

We can't say that for sure just yet. There are a lot of games yet to be played. Station and Woodford both have the chance to add two more defeated opponents. So that could shake things up considerably.

 

However, if Ashland wins next week, everything is settled. Ashland would be in first place with Johnson second, Woodford County third and Bryan Station fourth.

 

But simple wouldnt be as much fun now would it?

ii) If the tie remains, each team tied for the position shall receive one point for each game won by any four of their

defeated opponents in all games, except for the games played between any two (I think they mean 3) of the tied teams.

But if a team involved in the tie can't be used as one of your four teams, it should say that too.

 

I agree, the rule seems to have been written by the consensus of a fifth grade English class.

But simple wouldnt be as much fun now would it?

It would be a lot easier on my OCD...and my Advil bottle.

I think this will answer our question. Look at this link, it is a table of the tie-breakers from 2007. According to this, you cannot use wins against the other teams involved in a 3 way tie in any way. You have to use 4 wins against other schools, which can include district wins and out of state wins as the case may be.

 

http://www.khsaa.org/football/2007/threewayties.pdf

I think this will answer our question. Look at this link, it is a table of the tie-breakers from 2007. According to this, you cannot use wins against the other teams involved in a 3 way tie in any way. You have to use 4 wins against other schools, which can include district wins and out of state wins as the case may be.

 

http://www.khsaa.org/football/2007/threewayties.pdf

Looks like you're right. But what I don't get about that chart is why they list each of the three teams' own number of wins in the first column. Does that figure in somehow?

Based on Watusi's latest evidence, the court rules the current District 6 point totals to be:

 

Ashland - 17

 

Bryan Station - 8

 

Woodford County - 8

By my unofficial calculation I can say that Bryan Station is mathmatically eleiminated from the #2 position. Woodford County could still get it; but they need to win their last two games and hope their defeated opponents all do well. Here's the current situation, with potential points in parentheses.

 

Ashland

Pikeville – 4 (5)

Russell – 6 (7)

Montgomery County – 2 (4)

Boyd County – 5 (7)

Greenup County – 2 (4)

17 (23)

 

Bryan Station

Paul Dunbar – 1 (2)

Western – 5 (7)

Montgomery County - 2 (4)

Tates Creek* – 2 (3)

Fleming County* – 1 (2)

8 (16)

 

Woodford County

Bardstown – 1 (4)

Montgomery County - 2 (4)

Franklin County – 4 (5)

West Jessamine – 1 (3)

Whitley County* – 7 (8)

Meade County* – 4 (5)

8 (22)

With the Cov. Cath victory over Holmes today, these are the final standings for District 5:

 

1. Highlands

2. Covington Catholic

3. Dixie Heights

4. Holmes

Woodford County picked up an extra point yesterday, courtesy of the Bardstown Tigers. That puts them at nine (tie-breaker) points, with Ashland at 17 and Bryan Station at eight.

 

At this point, I would predict that Ashland gets second, Woodford County holds onto their third position, and Bryan Station ends up in the fourth spot. But it's still early, and a lot can happen. Of course, Ashland could render the whole (3-way tie) discussion moot by defeating Johnson Central Friday night.

 

Ashland

Pikeville – 4 (5)

Russell – 6 (7)

Montgomery County – 2 (4)

Boyd County – 5 (7)

Greenup County – 2 (4)

17 (23)

 

Bryan Station

Paul Dunbar – 1 (2)

Western – 5 (7)

Montgomery County - 2 (4)

Tates Creek* – 2 (3)

Fleming County* – 1 (2)

8 (16)

 

Woodford County

Bardstown – 2 (4)

Montgomery County - 2 (4)

Franklin County – 4 (5)

West Jessamine – 1 (3)

Whitley County* – 7 (8)

Meade County* – 4 (5)

9 (22)