2 hours ago, okie1 said:

Administrative bloat!...too many high paying jobs to people who don't have direct contact/impact with students.  

Ding ding ding

We have a winner!

1 hour ago, Footballfan24 said:

The difference in pay for teachers in negligible in the grand scheme. There some well paid teachers in the privates.  There are also some well paid administrators in the privates.  I think X and T are close to $16k for tuition, are donors giving that much per kid to make up the difference? I am sure there are donors who want to give to their public schools but they don't. Not all charitable people went to private school. Would you give money to an organization who has routinely demonstrated that they cannot manage it?

 

I wouldn't agree with this statement on a universal level.  Generally speaking, private school teachers make less than public school teachers and the benefits comparison isn't close, which is why you see more people sticking it out in the public school system.

I have often thought that percentage based stipends would work best for teachers in the building. With so many paraprofessionals it almost seems like a mute point unless the schools base it on their non school job which seems crazy to me. I was looking at Sumner County TN pay scales and appreciate the system they have in place for their coaching stipends. I don't know if JCPS is similar or not. Coaches do not do it for the pay, but I do think they need to be compensated enough to be able to afford to coach and not have that second job instead. I added that pdf for that TN district I was looking at. 

 

ex. HC is 18% of their salary. ($60k salary would be a $10,800 stipend)

assistant Coach is 8%($60k would be $4,800)

Also says based on the size of the school determines the number of paid assistants 

1A-5 Assistants

2A/3A- 6

4A/5A-7

6A-8

 

SCS_Coaching_Supplements_24-25.pdf

1 minute ago, AppalachianTactician said:

I have often thought that percentage based stipends would work best for teachers in the building. With so many paraprofessionals it almost seems like a mute point unless the schools base it on their non school job which seems crazy to me. I was looking at Sumner County TN pay scales and appreciate the system they have in place for their coaching stipends. I don't know if JCPS is similar or not. Coaches do not do it for the pay, but I do think they need to be compensated enough to be able to afford to coach and not have that second job instead. I added that pdf for that TN district I was looking at. 

SCS_Coaching_Supplements_24-25.pdf 157.88 kB · 2 downloads

JCPS does flat rates based on years experience. Once a coach reaches 4-5 years, they max out on what they earn coaches. 
 

I could imagine attracting MUCH bette candidates if coaches were offered 18% of their teacher salary. 

2 hours ago, Footballfan24 said:

The difference in pay for teachers in negligible in the grand scheme. There some well paid teachers in the privates.  There are also some well paid administrators in the privates.  I think X and T are close to $16k for tuition, are donors giving that much per kid to make up the difference? I am sure there are donors who want to give to their public schools but they don't. Not all charitable people went to private school. Would you give money to an organization who has routinely demonstrated that they cannot manage it?

12 minutes ago, DanvilleFan said:

I wouldn't agree with this statement on a universal level.  Generally speaking, private school teachers make less than public school teachers and the benefits comparison isn't close, which is why you see more people sticking it out in the public school system.

DanvilleFan is absolutely correct about that. Calling the difference in pay between public and private schools "negligible" is completely false. In the Diocese of Covington a first year teacher with Rank 1 certification starts off making just under $42K, and after fifty years of teaching (FIFTY) they are making $57.2K a year. Then in Kenton County Schools, for example, a first year teacher with Rank 1 certification starts off making $58.4K, and after thirty years of teaching they are making $93.9K.

First year teachers make 40% more in local public schools than they do in the Catholic schools in the Diocese of Covington, and 30-year teachers make 70% more in local public schools than they do in Catholic schools in the Diocese of Covington. Those percentages definitely are NOT "negligible" according to any scheme you're reviewing them by.

11 minutes ago, AppalachianTactician said:

I have often thought that percentage based stipends would work best for teachers in the building. With so many paraprofessionals it almost seems like a mute point unless the schools base it on their non school job which seems crazy to me. I was looking at Sumner County TN pay scales and appreciate the system they have in place for their coaching stipends. I don't know if JCPS is similar or not. Coaches do not do it for the pay, but I do think they need to be compensated enough to be able to afford to coach and not have that second job instead. I added that pdf for that TN district I was looking at. 

 

ex. HC is 18% of their salary. ($60k salary would be a $10,800 stipend)

assistant Coach is 8%($60k would be $4,800)

Also says based on the size of the school determines the number of paid assistants 

1A-5 Assistants

2A/3A- 6

4A/5A-7

6A-8

 

SCS_Coaching_Supplements_24-25.pdf 157.88 kB · 2 downloads

Index pay is great, but most districts have done away with it for coaches...but some have kept for Administrators.  Good thing about index pay is you get a raise every year as a coach.  It may be little but most teachers get a slight pay raise each year which would give you a slight coaching raise as well.

10 minutes ago, Colonels_Wear_Blue said:

DanvilleFan is absolutely correct about that. Calling the difference in pay between public and private schools "negligible" is completely false. In the Diocese of Covington a first year teacher with Rank 1 certification starts off making just under $42K, and after fifty years of teaching (FIFTY) they are making $57.2K a year. Then in Kenton County Schools, for example, a first year teacher with Rank 1 certification starts off making $58.4K, and after thirty years of teaching they are making $93.9K.

First year teachers make 40% more in local public schools than they do in the Catholic schools in the Diocese of Covington, and 30-year teachers make 70% more in local public schools than they do in Catholic schools in the Diocese of Covington. Those percentages definitely are NOT "negligible" according to any scheme you're reviewing them by.

Thanks for putting info about Kenton Co info in a thread about Louisville coaching, but whatever. Nothing in Kenton Co is relative to anything about this thread.  The salaries for X and T are not that far off from JCPS. The fact that you actually get to teach instead of manage behavior and deal with the other headaches that comes with public schools probably makes up for the percentage in difference which is in the single digits.

4 minutes ago, Footballfan24 said:

Thanks for putting info about Kenton Co info in a thread about Louisville coaching, but whatever. Nothing in Kenton Co is relative to anything about this thread.  The salaries for X and T are not that far off from JCPS. The fact that you actually get to teach instead of manage behavior and deal with the other headaches that comes with public schools probably makes up for the percentage in difference which is in the single digits.

One of my good friends is a department head at one of the schools you mentioned (just trying to help protect his anonymity a little here), and his wife has taught in two different public school systems local to Louisville. He jokes about how even as a department head, he's never made anywhere near what his wife has made.

The Archdiocese doesn't publicly publish an annual payscale, nor do Trinity or St. X, but recruitment agencies like ZipRecruiter and Indeed poll the entities listing jobs with them along with people applying for jobs, and they put out their own approximated payscales. Looking at those as sources, they list full-time teaching jobs in the Archdiocese of Louisville between $45K and $66K. JCPS does publish their payscale. First year teachers with Rank 1 certification in JCPS currently start at $62.8K and after twenty-five years of teaching they max out at $97K.

So using those figures, first year teachers make approximately 40% more in JCPS than they do in the Catholic schools in the Archdiocese of Louisville. With the info available it's hard to compare apples-to-apples for teachers with 25 years of experience, but you can compare top-level pay between the two school systems, and the highest paid teachers in JCPS make 47% more than the teachers drawing top-level pay in schools from the Archdiocese.

So 40%-47% different...is that really "not that far off" in your book?

9 minutes ago, Colonels_Wear_Blue said:

One of my good friends is a department head at one of the schools you mentioned (just trying to help protect his anonymity a little here), and his wife has taught in two different public school systems local to Louisville. He jokes about how even as a department head, he's never made anywhere near what his wife has made.

The Archdiocese doesn't publicly publish an annual payscale, nor do Trinity or St. X, but recruitment agencies like ZipRecruiter and Indeed poll the entities listing jobs with them along with people applying for jobs, and they put out their own approximated payscales. Looking at those as sources, they list full-time teaching jobs in the Archdiocese of Louisville between $45K and $66K. JCPS does publish their payscale. First year teachers with Rank 1 certification in JCPS currently start at $62.8K and after twenty-five years of teaching they max out at $97K.

So using those figures, first year teachers make approximately 40% more in JCPS than they do in the Catholic schools in the Archdiocese of Louisville. With the info available it's hard to compare apples-to-apples for teachers with 25 years of experience, but you can compare top-level pay between the two school systems, and the highest paid teachers in JCPS make 47% more than the teachers drawing top-level pay in schools from the Archdiocese.

So 40%-47% different...is that really "not that far off" in your book?

I see your point but very few teachers come in with a Rank 1. It’s likely a better comparison to use 1st year teachers as Rank III + 15 or Rank II. So to be fair, an average entry level teacher in JCPS is making $53k

Regardless, yes the public school teachers in Louisville are paid more than the parochial. Seems like JCPS has essentially thrown higher salaries at the problems created by lack of accountability for students and parents. 

11 minutes ago, LionJay2025 said:

I see your point but very few teachers come in with a Rank 1. It’s likely a better comparison to use 1st year teachers as Rank III + 15 or Rank II. So to be fair, an average entry level teacher in JCPS is making $53k

Regardless, yes the public school teachers in Louisville are paid more than the parochial. Seems like JCPS has essentially thrown higher salaries at the problems created by lack of accountability for students and parents. 

Agreed. Most of the teachers I know (including a few family members) hired into their school districts with Rank 3 and then worked to have be Rank 1 certified within their first couple years of teaching.

1 hour ago, DanvilleFan said:

I wouldn't agree with this statement on a universal level.  Generally speaking, private school teachers make less than public school teachers and the benefits comparison isn't close, which is why you see more people sticking it out in the public school system.

I did a short teaching stint in JCPS trade program and the pay was great but the behavior of kids and lack of interest from kids was eye opening and wasn't for me. You definitely have to pay more to keep teachers from leaving. 

32 minutes ago, Tigerpride94 said:

I did a short teaching stint in JCPS trade program and the pay was great but the behavior of kids and lack of interest from kids was eye opening and wasn't for me. You definitely have to pay more to keep teachers from leaving. 

I hate to be this way but we have to "fail" kids that don't pass instead of passing them along.  After long enough, and it has been long enough, the system goes down the drain and the kids are the victims.  All because the "adults" in charge refuse to hold students accountable for bad grades and unacceptable behaviors. 

I was reading an article yesterday about remedial math in college being too tough for students that had 4.0 GPAs in high school, lol.

2 hours ago, theguru said:

I hate to be this way but we have to "fail" kids that don't pass instead of passing them along.  After long enough, and it has been long enough, the system goes down the drain and the kids are the victims.  All because the "adults" in charge refuse to hold students accountable for bad grades and unacceptable behaviors. 

I was reading an article yesterday about remedial math in college being too tough for students that had 4.0 GPAs in high school, lol.

Blame the present accountability system for this as those metrics on discipline/graduation get districts punished so it encourages what you say.  That's why it bothers me these days when people champion graduation rates rising.  So much of that inflated and the testing data does not show that graduates are coming out with more knowledge or skills than before.

2 minutes ago, DanvilleFan said:

Blame the present accountability system for this as those metrics on discipline/graduation get districts punished so it encourages what you say.  That's why it bothers me these days when people champion graduation rates rising.  So much of that inflated and the testing data does not show that graduates are coming out with more knowledge or skills than before.

Unfortunately many schools/school systems are corrupt and this is just one of the many bad outcomes of the corruption. 

The other difference that is costly is JCPS has to pay into pension system whereas privates are usually 401k type retirement. When I was in fire dept the city paid around 50% of my salary to the pension system. Not sure what JCPS pays into it but probably not far off from that.