According to this source, fraud in government programs is 20 - 25%. Of those that collect w/o legal fraud, how many could be working?

 

On average, 2 to 25 cents of every $1 spent on four government assistance programs is lost to fraud, Sen. Ron Johnson says | PolitiFact Wisconsin

 

I'm not arguing that fraud doesn't exist. In fact that was the first sentence in my post. My point was most (which is supported by the star you posted) are not scamming the system. And they don't deserve to be looked down upon or villianized, and are not necessarily lazy, shiftless or living the good life due to handouts. and a good chunk of those receiving assistance do happen to work, mostly in jobs that most here on BGP would never dream of working...jobs like flipping burgers or other minimum wage jobs---jobs that so many say don't deserve to make a decent wage, because they don't require any "real skills". soblets shut off the 80+% off the working poor because of those scofflaws that are scamming the system.

I'm sure all don't want the majority punished but those that are abusing the system do need to be weeded out and cut off. The problem I see is that many are willing to ignore those that are abusing the system.

 

Definitely agree we need to find the ones abusing the system and cut them off. The issue is how do we do that. Cutting everybody off certainly isn't the answer.

What is your solution? Taking away assistance from 4/5 people because the other one is committing fraud?

 

As to how many could be working, you're assuming all of them aren't working just because they choose not to. I've learned recently that it's not as easy to get a job as many think. Especially when you lose a job you've had for several years and can only find a job making a fraction of the salary you're used to.

 

I hinted at the solution here :

 

"Where does charity end, and dependence begin? Who is better suited to make this judgement, federal government, or, say The Catholic Church?"

Definitely agree we need to find the ones abusing the system and cut them off. The issue is how do we do that. Cutting everybody off certainly isn't the answer.

 

This.

 

Diligence in fraud prevention, audit of beneficiaries of support, and a process for handling those committing fraud.

I hinted at the solution here :

 

"Where does charity end, and dependence begin? Who is better suited to make this judgement, federal government, or, say The Catholic Church?"

 

The Catholic Church is incapable of handling this and does not want to handle this on everyone in need. No church is.

I hinted at the solution here :

 

"Where does charity end, and dependence begin? Who is better suited to make this judgement, federal government, or, say The Catholic Church?"

 

Im sorry, I don't follow.

I'm sure all don't want the majority punished but those that are abusing the system do need to be weeded out and cut off. The problem I see is that many are willing to ignore those that are abusing the system.

 

The system needs to be revised, also. Many elderly need assistance but are unable to get it because they own their own home. How ridiculous. They've worked hard all their life and paid for their home but because their SS isn't enough to live on, they are punished. It's things like this that drive me nuts about government programs.

 

I completely agree. I have no problem with pursuing those who are scamming. It's just that too often, we talk down, and vilify those who aren't. Lots of those people work really hard, in crappy jobs---jobs that are often made fun of, or are labeled as worthless and not deserving of decent wages. All while we complain every chance we get because they don't serve us our burger and fries fast enough, or don't get us checked out as soon as we'd like.

I hinted at the solution here :

 

"Where does charity end, and dependence begin? Who is better suited to make this judgement, federal government, or, say The Catholic Church?"

 

What makes the Church better qualified to make those decisions?

Im sorry, I don't follow.

 

https://object.cato.org/pubs/pas/PA694.pdf

 

Outcome-Based Evaluation: Faith-Based Social Service Organizationsand Stewardship | The Heritage Foundation

 

Federal spending to alleviate poverty is corrupt, inefficient, ineffective and a proven failure. Yet, we continue to invest in failure.

 

Faith based organizations, spend money much more efficiently and achieve better results than government social programs. Results meaning steering people towards independent living.

https://object.cato.org/pubs/pas/PA694.pdf

 

Outcome-Based Evaluation: Faith-Based Social Service Organizationsand Stewardship | The Heritage Foundation

 

Federal spending to alleviate poverty is corrupt, inefficient, ineffective and a proven failure. Yet, we continue to invest in failure.

 

Faith based organizations, spend money much more efficiently and achieve better results than government social programs.

 

You think there aren't corrupt people stealing money in churches?

You think there aren't corrupt people stealing money in churches?

 

Accountability, efficiency and results are all much better in faith based organizations.

Definitely agree we need to find the ones abusing the system and cut them off. The issue is how do we do that. Cutting everybody off certainly isn't the answer.

 

I agree but we need to quit ignoring the ones that are abusing the system.

I agree but we need to quit ignoring the ones that are abusing the system.

 

I don't think it is a matter of ignoring fraud, it is a matter of being too incompetent to identify fraud.

Accountability, efficiency and results are all much better in faith based organizations.

 

I don't trust the Catholic Church any more than I trust the government. There are people out for their own personal gain in both groups and I see no reason to believe putting something like this into the religious forum is a good idea.

I don't think it is a matter of ignoring fraud, it is a matter of being too incompetent to identify fraud.

 

I disagree.

 

It takes more effort than they are willing to give to weed it out.