I agree that Jesus would focus on love but would also say go and sin no more.

 

I am attracted to women besides my wife. It's my nature. Should I ask Jesus why I was created to be horny? Because it is definitely a sin if I act on that impulse even if it is my nature.

 

I think the verse about taking up our cross daily and follow Him applies for me... that's the great part about the Bible - it is the believer who is to interpret what God is saying through the text. We will have to one day answer for how we live out what we interpret.

 

In my real life, I've decided that enough people are screaming the "go and sin no more" part so I've decided to stick to the love part.

Just my 2 cents but, my thought on the matter is: Given the historic societal views on homosexuality, who would "choose" to be gay?

 

I think this is a weak argument.

 

People choose all the time to do things that society has historically frowned on. Why do some husbands choose to commit adultery? Adultery harms their family,children, and reputation. Adultery has always been frowned upon by society.

 

Why do people choose to do drugs? It harms themselves, their families, and is frowned upon by society?

 

Why do I choose to be 20 pounds overweight. I am harming myself and it is frowned upon by society.

 

People decide for themselves to do things that society does not like all the time.

I think this is a weak argument.

 

People choose all the time to do things that society has historically frowned on. Why do some husbands choose to commit adultery? Adultery harms their family,children, and reputation. Adultery has always been frowned upon by society.

 

Why do people choose to do drugs? It harms themselves, their families, and is frowned upon by society?

 

Why do I choose to be 20 pounds overweight. I am harming myself and it is frowned upon by society.

 

People decide for themselves to do things that society does not like all the time.

 

Is it really that weak? I'm betting that you could possibly be attracted enough to a person of the opposite sex to be tempted into adultery, or at the very least, you might consider it . You may find the lure of cocaine too tempting to resist or may become addicted to it once you try it. You admittedly cannot control your urges to over eat to the point of hurting your body. But could you, as a heterosexual be tempted to indulge in a gay relationship if a gay co-worker or acquaintance started flirting with you? Even if you liked the individual, probably not, because that is not how you are wired. My initial post was not so much about the societal stigma as it was about the idea that being gay could possibly be a choice. I stick with the argument that it is not a choice, but is the way a person is born/wired.

I think this is a weak argument.

 

People choose all the time to do things that society has historically frowned on. Why do some husbands choose to commit adultery? Adultery harms their family,children, and reputation. Adultery has always been frowned upon by society.

 

Why do people choose to do drugs? It harms themselves, their families, and is frowned upon by society?

 

Why do I choose to be 20 pounds overweight. I am harming myself and it is frowned upon by society.

 

People decide for themselves to do things that society does not like all the time.

 

I can assure you with every fiber of my being that I never chose to be sexually attracted to men, and I never chose to not be sexually attracted to women.

 

I seriously have no reason to lie about this.

 

It was never that I was really straight and just for kicks chose to ever seek to engage in sexual activity with someone of my same sex. For those who are completely straight, this I would think would be completely understandable.

 

When millions of others worldwide express this same experience with their sexual orientation, I can completely identify with this, and have no reason to doubt them.

 

It is indeed a choice if I act on my attraction just as if I were straight, and without the presence of religious or societal moral teachings, there'd be no reason other than my own conscience regarding the circumstances that I would feel any need to abstain from following and acting out on my true nature.

 

Following religion and society's lack of understanding, I'd be lead to believe that I should either live my whole life as a celibate, or falsely attempt to live a heterosexual existence even when it goes against my nature.

 

I have no idea why I am this way, but reality would support the idea in the grand spectrum of sexual orientations, that homosexuality is indeed just as natural as anything no matter how much the argument is made that same sex relationships cannot produce offspring. If I have no sexual attraction to women, that too cannot produce offspring unless I take measures unnatural to myself to make it so.

 

When I was a teenager I experienced a deep emptiness inside longing for the human touch that I witnessed my straight friends freely experience in courting, kissing, cuddling, and holding hands, that was completely socially acceptable, and fearing that because of the way that I was wired I would live a life void of experiencing any of this no matter how much I deeply and naturally desired it.

 

It never seemed logical to me that just because others didn't understand that I would have to deny myself the human experience that was natural to me, and find it completely disturbing when the influences of society and religion are so strong with some that they live their lives conflicted by their true nature, and what they've been indoctrinated to believe.

 

I completely know the difference between sex for the sake of sexual pleasure, and love and tenderness, and that they can be one in the same, or completely separate.

 

No doubt I could love a woman if we're simply talking love, but to provide for that woman the complete experience of love including physical expressions of that love, I would not be able to, and as a result that woman would be neglected of what she could experience with a straight man who could provide for her the whole true experience.

 

Science can study this until they are blue in the face, and religion can stick to their convictions 'til the end of time, but the only conclusive evidence that I need is what I've naturally experienced inside of me my whole life, and I don't have time to wait around for red and green lights from the outside world to finally validate or invalidate me.

 

It's my life and I'm going to live it while I'm still alive, and the only sin in this matter that I see is if I weren't being true to myself while allowing the misunderstandings of society and religion to dictate my life, and add for me unnecessary internal conflict.

 

If after all that I've said, and what millions of other homosexuals have said to convey that having same sex attractions is not a choice, then I honestly don't know what else could be said that might convince those who still insist that it is.

 

I just got around to actually watching this video. Some of the questions were good, some were not. I would love to sit down and have him ask me these questions face to face, it would be a fun conversation.

I believe he would say STOP SINNING.

Bazinga!

 

I lied

 

I chose to be gay...

 

1. To be different.

 

2. To be socially ostracized

 

3. To shock family and friends.

 

4. To just for kicks deny myself of my true heterosexuality.

 

5. To make social interaction for myself uncomfortable and awkward.

 

6. To make my working career with co-workers uncomfortable and awkward.

 

7. To possibly jeopardize my job depending on the attitude of the employer.

 

8. To possibly jeopardize where I can live, if renting, depending on the attitude of property owner.

 

9. To not always have the luxury of being real like straight people can be, and always keeping my private life a big secret so that I don't jeopardize where I live in case I'd have neighbors who didn't approve, and possibly bring me awkward conditions related to their gossiping.

 

10. To be discriminated against.

 

11. To chance being gay bashed or bullied.

 

12. To ensure that I raise no family to enjoy holidays with so that I can just watch straight families from the sidelines at their cookouts etc...

 

13. To be excluded from being in the wedding parties of childhood friends because for them it would make things uncomfortable and awkward.

 

14. To at times be in other's company where my life is sophomorically the punch line of their jokes.

 

15. To have others ponder about me, like they wouldn't even consider pondering about their straight acquaintances, what I do in my private intimate moments.

 

16. To feel stifled and always choose my words carefully depending on who I'm around for not feeling as free as straight people take for granted being, while they rarely have to consider weird reactions to common everyday comments.

 

17. To have straight people ask me who is the man and who is the woman in this relationship.

 

18. To purposely make others uncomfortable if when in public I show any outward expressions of affection to my partner in the form of a kiss or a hug, a caress, or the holding of a hand while always having to be conscious and on guard that in certain environments these actions could bring us ridicule, or possibly worse.

 

19. To always carefully calculate how I might answer personal questions posed by others who don't really know me to keep theirs and my discomfort at a minimal level depending on their capacity to understand.

 

20. To sin against God

 

Granted in today's world, if I choose, I can be as open as I want to be, and still may or maybe not be confronted with these uncomfortable issues depending on the audience, however remember that when I first "chose" to be gay it was back in the 1970's and all of these aforementioned obstacles were very real, and I simply just thought that it would be fun to complicate and cramp my life to have to face them, and I'm here to tell you just what a joy and a hoot it's been.

My rapid heart beat, and pubescent penis with a mind of its own that never stood up to say hello to girls, and never has, but without doubt did to men, didn't get this memo.

 

 

Love it !!! :thumb:

I can assure you with every fiber of my being that I never chose to be sexually attracted to men, and I never chose to not be sexually attracted to women.

 

I seriously have no reason to lie about this.

 

It was never that I was really straight and just for kicks chose to ever seek to engage in sexual activity with someone of my same sex. For those who are completely straight, this I would think would be completely understandable.

 

When millions of others worldwide express this same experience with their sexual orientation, I can completely identify with this, and have no reason to doubt them.

 

It is indeed a choice if I act on my attraction just as if I were straight, and without the presence of religious or societal moral teachings, there'd be no reason other than my own conscience regarding the circumstances that I would feel any need to abstain from following and acting out on my true nature.

 

Following religion and society's lack of understanding, I'd be lead to believe that I should either live my whole life as a celibate, or falsely attempt to live a heterosexual existence even when it goes against my nature.

 

I have no idea why I am this way, but reality would support the idea in the grand spectrum of sexual orientations, that homosexuality is indeed just as natural as anything no matter how much the argument is made that same sex relationships cannot produce offspring. If I have no sexual attraction to women, that too cannot produce offspring unless I take measures unnatural to myself to make it so.

 

When I was a teenager I experienced a deep emptiness inside longing for the human touch that I witnessed my straight friends freely experience in courting, kissing, cuddling, and holding hands, that was completely socially acceptable, and fearing that because of the way that I was wired I would live a life void of experiencing any of this no matter how much I deeply and naturally desired it.

 

It never seemed logical to me that just because others didn't understand that I would have to deny myself the human experience that was natural to me, and find it completely disturbing when the influences of society and religion are so strong with some that they live their lives conflicted by their true nature, and what they've been indoctrinated to believe.

 

I completely know the difference between sex for the sake of sexual pleasure, and love and tenderness, and that they can be one in the same, or completely separate.

 

No doubt I could love a woman if we're simply talking love, but to provide for that woman the complete experience of love including physical expressions of that love, I would not be able to, and as a result that woman would be neglected of what she could experience with a straight man who could provide for her the whole true experience.

 

Science can study this until they are blue in the face, and religion can stick to their convictions 'til the end of time, but the only conclusive evidence that I need is what I've naturally experienced inside of me my whole life, and I don't have time to wait around for red and green lights from the outside world to finally validate or invalidate me.

 

It's my life and I'm going to live it while I'm still alive, and the only sin in this matter that I see is if I weren't being true to myself while allowing the misunderstandings of society and religion to dictate my life, and add for me unnecessary internal conflict.

 

If after all that I've said, and what millions of other homosexuals have said to convey that having same sex attractions is not a choice, then I honestly don't know what else could be said that might convince those who still insist that it is.

 

Nothing... absolutely nothing. They've been hopelessly indoctrinated into thinking that a someone named "God" made you and since God believes homosexuality is wrong, he would have never made you a homosexual man. So you must have chosen that vile lifestyle. In actuality, NONE of that is true. Not one scintilla of it.

My rapid heart beat, and pubescent penis with a mind of its own that never stood up to say hello to girls, and never has, but without doubt did to men, didn't get this memo.

 

Well, that is one thing gay and straight men have in common. Their penises have minds of their own and they NEVER listen!

I think natures screams out loud by observing it " I have a creator"

 

Because you want it to scream that.

Nothing... absolutely nothing. They've been hopelessly indoctrinated into thinking that a someone named "God" made you and since God believes homosexuality is wrong, he would have never made you a homosexual man. So you must have chosen that vile lifestyle. In actuality, NONE of that is true. Not one scintilla of it.

 

Word

@Science Friction With all due respect I do not believe I have been hopelessly indoctrinated by anything. I have spent an inordinate amount of time reading, studying, asking, writing, speaking, listening, absorbing, and meditating about my faith. I know exactly why I believe what I believe and I think that allows me to participate in discussions such as these without getting myself rattled or setting off the fumes of whomever I am discussing it with.

Because you want it to scream that.

 

I don't want to argue with ya SF , its really no fun. I'm far more open minded than you ever dreamed I'd be and still yet somehow , I believe in God and the Bible . And if you truly deeply investigated true Christianity , you might to . And as I've already said here its clear to me - 100% , people are born same sex attracted .