Another religious act that I have always been fascinated with. I attended a Southern Baptist Church for most of my youth and early adult years. We were taught that this was a no-no. In my late twenties and early thirties, I mostly attended a Nazarene Church. They , too, frown upon this act. The female pastor that we had for revivals numerous times told me that speaking in tongues was not something that came from God. She said it was people getting caught up in the emotion of a service. I must say that this is pretty much what I have observed as well.

I have also been invited to church services where this strange act was smiled upon and even encouraged. It usually occurs when emotions really get stirred, either by a preacher or by the music. From what I observed, when the music died down, so did the act of speaking in tongues. Not once in my experience have there ever been an interpreter present to tell the congregation what was said. Also, when I took History of Religions classes in college, the professor(a Southern Baptist) showed us films of snake-handling churches in eastern KY and WV. Those who handling the serpents were dancing around in circles and their eyes were glazed over in a trance-like state and they were apparently speaking in tongues. From everything I have ever witnessed, this act appears to have a psychological reason. The power of suggestion combined with a belief and a "want to" is very strong.

 

Something else that I have noticed over the years is that there seems to be a strong positive correlation between education level and those who engage in this. More educated church-goers seem to shun this behavior while those with less formal education tend to be more accepting of this act. The same is true of rituals such as snake-handling or drinking of poison. I have some former students that attend a Holiness church and they will often invite me. I have gone on a number of occasions. These are really good, very sincere, people who attend this church but most of them probably have an eighth grade or less education.

 

Do you have strong views either way of speaking in "tongues"? Of course, being a non-believer, I am convinced that this is all psychological. There is no evidence that it has any divine basis. I have always been interested in what makes people do things like enter a trance-like state and speak in tongues, handle snakes, drink poison, etc.... All because they think it pleasures their God. The psychology of the religious mind . Just fascinating.

I think it's psychological, too.

Our pastor spoke about this a little while back (non-denominational independent Christian). He kind of laughed about "speaking in tongues" and...if I remember correctly, stated biblically that the "speaking in tongues" was essentially a one time biblical act on the day of Pentacost given by the holy spirit, and that it really doesn't speak to it's use after that (again going by memory here). Now, Paul evidently mentions speaking in Tongues at some point, but says if it does happen there has to be someone there that can interpret...which evidently there almost never is at these places that supposedly speak in "tongues". Which means it's just jibberish. Long story short, our pastor doesn't believe in it and doesn't think there is biblical scripture that supports modern day speaking in tongue.

Our pastor spoke about this a little while back (non-denominational independent Christian). He kind of laughed about "speaking in tongues" and...if I remember correctly, stated biblically that the "speaking in tongues" was essentially a one time biblical act on the day of Pentacost given by the holy spirit, and that it really doesn't speak to it's use after that (again going by memory here). Now, Paul evidently mentions speaking in Tongues at some point, but says if it does happen there has to be someone there that can interpret...which evidently there almost never is at these places that supposedly speak in "tongues". Which means it's just jibberish. Long story short, our pastor doesn't believe in it and doesn't think there is biblical scripture that supports modern day speaking in tongue.

 

I know that some do it for show and it's just fake, but I truly believe that many people who do this are very sincere. I have noticed a number of people that go into a trance-like state when they begin to speak in tongues.. Like I say, for some it's total fakery and just for show but others are sincere and are convinced it has a divine purpose. Same for snake-handlers. I've always been curious as to the psychology of it.

I know that some do it for show and it's just fake, but I truly believe that many people who do this are very sincere. I have noticed a number of people that go into a trance-like state when they begin to speak in tongues.. Like I say, for some it's total fakery and just for show but others are sincere and are convinced it has a divine purpose. Same for snake-handlers. I've always been curious as to the psychology of it.

 

Never witnessed it myself so I can't speak about it from that standpoint. Have talked to those that have seen it first hand though that aren't "believers" in it, and they say it can be pretty freaky.

 

I suppose if God WANTED someone to speak in tongue and deliver a message, he would/could do it and the situation would have all the variables needed. But I do find it odd...no I guess more coincidental...that this phenomena seems to happen among a very small percentage of Christians/branches that believe it does happen, and it seems to never happen at those churches/branches that don't think it does.

 

With that said, if someone thinks the Holy Sprit has a hold of them and they jump up and start hollering something that sounds like it came from some long extinct Egyptian dialect, then more power to them I guess.

Speaking in Tongues:

 

Behavior...nothing more.

 

Learned behavior from years of steady indoctrination.

 

The youngins of the bunch subconsciously learn early through positive reinforcement that it will get them attention, and a pat on the back, which is a great motivator in life in a multitude of areas, and not just religious.

 

They see the adults become the center of attention making them aspire to ultimately grab that same attention to be considered ever so faithful, if not the most faithful.

 

If thou speaketh in tongues, thou is viewed as one of the most faithful.

 

The behavior is passed this way from generation to generation.

 

Unspoken, and never admitted is that there is also an underlying competition taking place making folks want to show that they are the most faithful of the whole bunch, again for the attention, accolades, and the pat on the back for that sense that one has achieved greatness within their community.

 

Preachers, though many sincerely aim at guiding and helping others, quite often are drawn to this profession primarily for the attention.

 

As a child in Catholic school we were required to attend mass daily, and I recall volunteering to read the readings during special services that gave the kids from time to time an opportunity to become more involved with the services. This got me high marks from nuns as well as my parents, and admittedly deep down that was the sort of attention I was aiming for.

Sure seems that in the context of the verse and considering the time in which this message was delivered to a very diverse crowd, it makes more sense that the author is referring to being able to speak in another's native tongue (read language). Would make more sense considering the gospel in Yiddish would make no sense to me that there would be one who could be empowered to deliver it in my native tongue. I am no believer in the gibberish and eye rolling I've only seen once in my lifetime then was told that there needs to be someone who could interpret said gibberish. Perhaps I'm wrong.

[video=youtube;ctyDL-6f90w]

I forgot to add in my last post that I posted it primarily for attention, and to see if I could get a few "Likes"... (rolling fingers)

 

... Where they at?

I forgot to add in my last post that I posted it primarily for attention, and to see if I could get a few "Likes"... (rolling fingers)

 

... Where they at?

 

Got one!

Got one!

 

Now that's what I'm talkin' about... :thumb:

 

I've been validated with positive reinforcement that encourages and motivates me to continue to post ridiculously long posts, and pretend as if I'm of sound mind, and have level headed views on any, and every topic discussed weather I actually do or not, and sometimes even to expand and ramble well beyond the initial intent of the topic at hand.

 

Now to expand on the topic of human behavior and conditioning that I initiated in my first post in this thread...

 

As a human it's not uncommon to seek attention, but it is rather unusual for one to admit it like I'm doing here. Typically no one is particularly concerned when others seek it unless it's done in an obvious relentless overkill fashion that screams "Hey look at me, aren't I amazing?"

 

People however generally prefer to view those, for example, who do nice things for their fellow humans as a good genuine person, and would be disappointed if they got the impression that the deed was done solely for attention, but quite often this is the motivator while often most don't normally recognize this real true root of the act of kindness.

 

It's not a bad thing actually, but when one gets a pat on the back for doing something good, it's likely that this will motivate them to continue to perform good deeds in the future. The good feeling that one achieves from being appreciated reinforces this behavior, and increases the chance that one will repeat a similar type behavior again.

 

If one wishes to reinforce a certain behavior in someone else, one of the best ways to ensure this is to compliment them, or reward them each and every time they display the behavior, to help to lock it in, much like you would do when training your dog to do tricks, or to behave in the desired way that you wish for your dog to behave.

 

 

Also, to add to the illusion that I'm so swell and know all, I want to point out that some children who do not get attention in their lives from parents and others for good deeds done will at times be conditioned to learn that the only way to get any kind of attention is to act up, or do bad, harmful, or undesired things.

 

On the surface, one might wonder why anyone would want to bring scorn and possible punishment to themselves, but if it's the only thing they've ever subconsciously learned as a way of getting recognized, then it's the avenue they will opt for to get the desired, or at the least, any kind of attention.

 

As an extension of this, kids that learn to act in a bratty fashion for attention also tend to perform badly in an outward fashion around their peers to give the impression that they are fearless and bold. When friends respond by laughing, applauding, or acting amazed, they are again actually helping to condition and reinforce the behavior.

 

It's obvious that I've gone overboard here, so in reality the length of my post will likely make some not even bother tackling it, and consider it to be a grand waste of their time, so if I wanted multitudes of praise for what I have said, it's likely that from this post I will not get it, firstly because it will likely be bypassed by most, and secondly the content is truly getting miles away from digging my teeth into the topic of "speaking in tongues", and since my first post on that topic was all that was necessary in giving my take on it, everything else that I've said beyond that is merely and example of unnecessary nonsense of overkill proportions.

I know that some do it for show and it's just fake, but I truly believe that many people who do this are very sincere. I have noticed a number of people that go into a trance-like state when they begin to speak in tongues.. Like I say, for some it's total fakery and just for show but others are sincere and are convinced it has a divine purpose. Same for snake-handlers. I've always been curious as to the psychology of it.

 

Science Friction, it appears I may have judged you too harshly in another thread (though your post did deserve it). You seem rather even-handed here.

 

This is an extremely interesting topic. I see validity in yours and others explanations of the phenomena. B-B-Fan makes sense with how children are influenced towards the experience and may do this because it is expected.

 

However, I also think these explanations are not true of every case of it. In churches that emphasize that speaking in tongues is either a sign that one is saved or the sign that one is filled with the Holy Spirit, the pressure to behave in this way is bound to produce inauthentic expressions of it (even though the person may be sincere, as you note). The one occasion I saw on TV where the minister was teaching people to roll their tongue and just "let it go" was a particularly grievous example of the inauthentic variety.

 

As a Bible believing Christian, that grieves me. I also think that emphasizing tongues as a sign of either salvation or being filled with the Spirit is wrong-headed and a misinterpretation of Scripture. It is also a misinterpretation to say, in my view, that tongues was only for the Day of Pentecost. Otherwise Paul would not have mentioned its practice in 1 Corinthians 12-14 and there would have been no need for him to regulate its practice. In short, I think it is a gift of the Spirit that is still for today, but that it is only one among many and is not to receive the spotlight.

 

Given that I believe in God, I believe in the supernatural and think there may be something more to it than just a psychological inducement. But I am also pretty certain that in many cases, that is all it is. And no, I have not had the experience and do not claim the gift. I am content to utilize whatever gifts the Spirit of God has given me and leave that choice up to His wisdom.

 

I am afraid I cannot clear up "the psychology" of it to anyone's satisfaction here. I am more comfortable talking about the Scriptural teaching on it than its psychology. But I do know very sincere people who practice it in privacy and feel no compulsion to do so publicly or for approval. It isn't a focal point of any worship experience, unlike say the snake healers you saw. In fact, many people would never know those individuals "have the gift of tongues." I would add that the people I have been around are quite educated and rational people.

Sure seems that in the context of the verse and considering the time in which this message was delivered to a very diverse crowd, it makes more sense that the author is referring to being able to speak in another's native tongue (read language). Would make more sense considering the gospel in Yiddish would make no sense to me that there would be one who could be empowered to deliver it in my native tongue. I am no believer in the gibberish and eye rolling I've only seen once in my lifetime then was told that there needs to be someone who could interpret said gibberish. Perhaps I'm wrong.

 

This only explains the occurrence on the Day of Pentecost not later references to the phenomena outside of the Book of Acts. I think you are correct about that occurrence. The people in the upper room came out and began to speak in a language they had not learned but was known by the people of the various nations that had gathered in Jerusalem. This ability to speak a language they had not learned gathered for them a large audience to hear the sermon given by Peter.

Science Friction after reading alot of your posts( you are quite smart, thats probably one compliment you thought you would never get from me) and while you have covered a variety of topics, I think you could easily flip to the dark side that is a devout Christian. God is working on you my friend and I am not sure you even see that.

I have a lot of Christian friends and I don't their sincerity one bit, not even a little. I doubt what they believe but I believe whole-heartedly in their sincerity. Same for some on here.