Strongly agree with the bolded. That's why I say the attitude about "drinking and driving" is beyond lax in this country. It won't be solved, in my opinion, until the drinking public all realize and follow the simple rule of if you have been drinking, you don't drive. Period.

 

I hate to say it, but if the drinking public hasn't figured that out yet, they never will. This needs to start way before people get old enough to start drinking. We have to stop glamorizing it and making reaching the age of 21 seem like a big party time.

More than enough to keep bars in business all over the country. Just head down to your local watering hole, Applebees, Hooters or any other restaurant that serves fun, food and drinks. I'm guessing the number driving home legally impaired outnumber those that are designated drivers, and I'd bet several of the DD's are probably somewhat impaired as well. Don't get me wrong, none of what I'm saying makes it right. You shouldn't drink and drive. But for whatever reason, we have created a culture that for most, know it's wrong but choose to do it anyway. And I don't think locking people up changes that. The solution to the problem is much tougher than just saying "harsher penalties". We as a society need to do a better job teaching youth about responsible alcohol use, and not as good a job in promoting booze as a "fun night on the town".

 

Definitely agree that the number of people that leave a bar/restaurant on any given night that are legally impaired far outweighs those that aren't. However, you'll (general you, not you specifically) never convince me there is anything wrong with going out to dinner and having a drink or two while there, and going home. Drinking and driving is not against the law. Drinking and driving over the legal limit is. There's a difference.

I couldn't disagree more with you more than blaming it on society.

 

What in Hades has happened to personal responsibility in this country!!! Society doesn't make the decision for an individual to drink and drive. The individual makes that choice. If they can't keep themselves from making the choice to drink and drive, I would suggest they seek help with their problem.

 

You can blame behavior on society all you want. It is a CHOICE.

 

Never said it wasn't a choice. It absolutely is, and there are plenty of people out there that exercise the choice not to do so. However, to think that what we learn from our parents, teachers, friends etc don't have some influence on our choices and behaviors, would be wrong. For example, the religion you choose to follow, what foods you eat, what side of the road you drive on, are choices that you make that are largely dictated by what part of the world you were born. In some cases even what is right and was is wrong is based on the society you live in. If, as a society don't do a good job of encouraging the right (or what we believe to be right) choices, how can you expect all the members to make the right choice?

 

So yes, there needs to be a sense of personal responsibility. I don't disagree with that. But just like it's tough to learn a new language as you get older, if we don't do a better job of teaching that to our youth, that sense of right and wrong will be tougher to learn.

Definitely agree that the number of people that leave a bar/restaurant on any given night that are legally impaired far outweighs those that aren't. However, you'll (general you, not you specifically) never convince me there is anything wrong with going out to dinner and having a drink or two while there, and going home. Drinking and driving is not against the law. Drinking and driving over the legal limit is. There's a difference.

 

agreed

Definitely agree that the number of people that leave a bar/restaurant on any given night that are legally impaired far outweighs those that aren't. However, you'll (general you, not you specifically) never convince me there is anything wrong with going out to dinner and having a drink or two while there, and going home. Drinking and driving is not against the law. Drinking and driving over the legal limit is. There's a difference.

 

How does one know when the difference is? I would submit they don't without testing themselves.

 

My question is, why would you even take the chance?

Never said it wasn't a choice. It absolutely is, and there are plenty of people out there that exercise the choice not to do so. However, to think that what we learn from our parents, teachers, friends etc don't have some influence on our choices and behaviors, would be wrong. For example, the religion you choose to follow, what foods you eat, what side of the road you drive on, are choices that you make that are largely dictated by what part of the world you were born. In some cases even what is right and was is wrong is based on the society you live in. If, as a society don't do a good job of encouraging the right (or what we believe to be right) choices, how can you expect all the members to make the right choice?

 

So yes, there needs to be a sense of personal responsibility. I don't disagree with that. But just like it's tough to learn a new language as you get older, if we don't do a better job of teaching that to our youth, that sense of right and wrong will be tougher to learn.

 

IMHO, the problem is that personal responsibility is not taught enough. I agree that children need to be taught right from wrong. I also think they need to be taught that there a consequences when you do something wrong.

How does one know when the difference is? I would submit they don't without testing themselves.

 

My question is, why would you even take the chance?

 

I can say with 100% certainty I know that after two drinks (excluding liquor) I'm under the limit. Don't know about 3, thus if I have more than 2, I don't drive.

 

As to your second question, because if I want to go out to dinner and have a drink, I'm going to and I'm not going to feel the least bit bad or guilty about it. I'm doing absolutely nothing wrong.

 

Definitely agree that the number of people that leave a bar/restaurant on any given night that are legally impaired far outweighs those that aren't. However, you'll (general you, not you specifically) never convince me there is anything wrong with going out to dinner and having a drink or two while there, and going home. Drinking and driving is not against the law. Drinking and driving over the legal limit is. There's a difference.

 

Well technically drinking to the point of intoxication and driving is illegal. Some people could be intoxicated and still be under.08

I can say with 100% certainty I know that after two drinks (excluding liquor) I'm under the limit. Don't know about 3, thus if I have more than 2, I don't drive.

 

As to your second question, because if I want to go out to dinner and have a drink, I'm going to and I'm not going to feel the least bit bad or guilty about it. I'm doing absolutely nothing wrong.

 

Have you tested yourself? Just curious.

If we are arguing now about people having a drink at dinner and driving we might as well shut down a huge part of economy. That my friends would be much worse for this country. Like it or not that is a simple fact and that is why we have loaded parking lots at every restaurant that serves alcohol most nights of the week.

Have you tested yourself? Just curious.

 

Tested myself, nope.

 

When I was 21 I was taking a friend home from the bar around 2 am. I had 2 drinks. Got pulled over for "following too closely". Cop asked if I had been drinking, told him I had 2 drinks, he made me take a FST, passed all of them, made me take a breathalyzer, and angrily let me go on my way when it came back well under the limit.

Tested myself, nope.

 

When I was 21 I was taking a friend home from the bar around 2 am. I had 2 drinks. Got pulled over for "following too closely". Cop asked if I had been drinking, told him I had 2 drinks, he made me take a FST, passed all of them, made me take a breathalyzer, and angrily let me go on my way when it came back well under the limit.

 

I bet he was ticked. Nothing worse than not getting to do a lot of paper work to take someone to jail. I bet he lost sleep over you being well under the limit that night.

I bet he was ticked. Nothing worse than not getting to do a lot of paper work to take someone to jail. I bet he lost sleep over you being well under the limit that night.

 

Well, he sure didn't seem happy about it. He looked at the result, showed it to me, threw the disposable mouthpiece on the ground, walked back to his car calling over his shoulder that I was "free to go".

If we are arguing now about people having a drink at dinner and driving we might as well shut down a huge part of economy. That my friends would be much worse for this country. Like it or not that is a simple fact and that is why we have loaded parking lots at every restaurant that serves alcohol most nights of the week.

 

This is what I am talking about when I say it's a culture and mindset. Right or wrong, woven into the fabric of America is lots of alcohol advertising, restaurants and bars with large parking lots encouraging consumers to drive up and consume, and sprawling suburbs with big subdivisions and strict zoning laws such that drinking establishments cannot be placed within reasonable walking distance. It's the way we have defined our economy. Try as we might, unless we change our culture, which shapes our economy, drunk driving and the resulting casualties will not go away.

Tested myself, nope.

 

When I was 21 I was taking a friend home from the bar around 2 am. I had 2 drinks. Got pulled over for "following too closely". Cop asked if I had been drinking, told him I had 2 drinks, he made me take a FST, passed all of them, made me take a breathalyzer, and angrily let me go on my way when it came back well under the limit.

 

How many years ago was that? Your metabolism may have changed. LOL