No. Look at it this way. Catholic grade schools within the Archdiocese of Louisville are feeder schools to Catholic high schools in the Archdiocese. That means that if a kid in Hardin County wants to avoid the sanctions they have to either leave Catholic schools prior to the seventh grade or comute to Louisville for high school. Does that seem reasonable? The private schools put out a very reasonable proposal that said that we don't want to see our kids have to leave our grade schools in order to avoid these sanctions, therefore we'll offer to make the sanctions apply in only one direction. I can't come up with any reasonable explanation for turning that down except a desire to see kids forced to change schools prior to seventh grade.

Well my reply to that is why doesn't the church have a Catholic High School outside of Louisville to serve that need. It seems to me the church is knowingly pushing that kid to Louisville schools already if it is not providing a High School in that area. And if the kid goes to public schools then he has to sit a year, it is not that big a deal. It is a compromise and it works both ways, everyone will know the rules going into it so how does it hurt privates more than publics?

Well my reply to that is why doesn't the church have a Catholic High School outside of Louisville to serve that need. It seems to me the church is knowingly pushing that kid to Louisville schools already if it is not providing a High School in that area. And if the kid goes to public schools then he has to sit a year, it is not that big a deal. It is a compromise and it works both ways, everyone will know the rules going into it so how does it hurt privates more than publics?

 

There have been Catholic High Schools outside of Louisville but have closed due to lack of enrollment. The one that comes to mind immediately is Elizabethtown Catholic. The only Catholic High School outside of Louisville in the Archdiocese I can think of which is still surviving is Bethlehem High School in Bardstown KY. I imagine the only reason it has been able to stay afloat is due to the enormous contributions of Joe Paul Clayton a Bethlem alumnus.

Well my reply to that is why doesn't the church have a Catholic High School outside of Louisville to serve that need. It seems to me the church is knowingly pushing that kid to Louisville schools already if it is not providing a High School in that area. And if the kid goes to public schools then he has to sit a year, it is not that big a deal. It is a compromise and it works both ways, everyone will know the rules going into it so how does it hurt privates more than publics?

The simple answer to why the Church doesn't open a school in all parts of the Archdiocese is money. I think that the effect of forcing kids to sit out a year is to push kids away from private schools and to push kids away from athletic competition. The reason it hurts the private school kids more than the public school kids is that there are public schools in all parts of the state. The same is not true of private schools.

Well my reply to that is why doesn't the church have a Catholic High School outside of Louisville to serve that need. It seems to me the church is knowingly pushing that kid to Louisville schools already if it is not providing a High School in that area. And if the kid goes to public schools then he has to sit a year, it is not that big a deal. It is a compromise and it works both ways, everyone will know the rules going into it so how does it hurt privates more than publics?

 

 

Considering the declining enrollment in Catholic Grade Schools all across the state, there's really no way to financially justify a new Catholic High School in an underserved area. Several Hardin County Catholic Grade schools either closed or merged a few years ago. There have been 3 areas in Louisville that have closed schools/merged into new academies as their enrollments declined. Most recently, St. Barnabas (Hikes Lane), St. Bartholomew (Beuchel Bank Rd) and St. Pius (Goldsmith) petitioned the Archdiocese to merge. St. Barnabas has a waiting list for student entrollment at this time, but the future doesn't seem as rosy for any of the three parishes, as I understand it. Combining resources will increase the liklihood of the survival of Catholic grade school education in that area, which is heavily populated by Catholics, but those schools compete with St. Raphael and St. Martha for students. St. Raphael and St. Martha are much larger in terms of parish membership.

Considering the declining enrollment in Catholic Grade Schools all across the state, there's really no way to financially justify a new Catholic High School in an underserved area. Several Hardin County Catholic Grade schools either closed or merged a few years ago. There have been 3 areas in Louisville that have closed schools/merged into new academies as their enrollments declined. Most recently, St. Barnabas (Hikes Lane), St. Bartholomew (Beuchel Bank Rd) and St. Pius (Goldsmith) petitioned the Archdiocese to merge. St. Barnabas has a waiting list for student entrollment at this time, but the future doesn't seem as rosy for any of the three parishes, as I understand it. Combining resources will increase the liklihood of the survival of Catholic grade school education in that area, which is heavily populated by Catholics, but those schools compete with St. Raphael and St. Martha for students. St. Raphael and St. Martha are much larger in terms of parish membership.

Do you think the decline in Catholic grade schools is attributed to the rise in # of "Christian" grade schools that are not of the Catholic denomination?

 

It sure seems that "Christian" High schools other than of the Catholic denomination are becoming more prevalent around the state.

Do you think the decline in Catholic grade schools is attributed to the rise in # of "Christian" grade schools that are not of the Catholic denomination?

 

It sure seems that "Christian" High schools other than of the Catholic denomination are becoming more prevalent around the state.

 

 

That may be one reason, but I think the bigger issue is the Eastward population shift and changing demographics in the Louisville Area. The problem began way back in the 70's when the population moved east from the westend, and several parish schools closed there. The Downtown & Westend areas are woefully hobbled from the perspective of the socio-economic issue of being able to afford tuition, uniforms, books, activity fees, etc. Next was the Rangeland/South Preston Highway/Newburg area. A few years ago, the PRP/Shively area was faced with the same issues. Next, the Iroquois Park area, but interestingly, this is an area with huge immigration settlements, and much promoted/implemented by Catholic Charities. St. John Vienny became a predominantly Vietnamese parish, and has sort of re-born it's memebership due to offering masses in that language. There's a large Hispanic population in that area, and spreading to the Hikes Point area. I honestly look for some parishes to begin offering more services in Spanish. I know there are many ways the Church is looking to expand the tradition of Catholic education to these populations in our area. I saw in The Record there was a scholarship program targeting Hispanic students, and the Archbishop's column each week is published in English and Spanish, side by side.

 

 

It's become a little less convenient to get to the schools, but the combination of resources at least keeps tuition in the most affordable range possible.

 

 

The next step though, is to find a way to help these families continue their child's education at the Secondary level.

Based upon what I feel is a morality/character issue being able to be taught in private schools that we 1)are not allowed to address in public schools; 2)don't have time to teach adequately because of all the tests from the politicians that we have to prepare for, I wish EVERY parent would enroll their child in a private school.

 

The demands on public schools limits our effectiveness. Plus, if a parent was interested enough in their child's education to seek out a private school then they would be INTERESTED in their child's education. We deal with too many parents that their children is a hindrance to their lifestyle.

Based upon what I feel is a morality/character issue being able to be taught in private schools that we 1)are not allowed to address in public schools; 2)don't have time to teach adequately because of all the tests from the politicians that we have to prepare for, I wish EVERY parent would enroll their child in a private school.

 

The demands on public schools limits our effectiveness. Plus, if a parent was interested enough in their child's education to seek out a private school then they would be INTERESTED in their child's education. We deal with too many parents that their children is a hindrance to their lifestyle.

 

Amen to this statement. And thus the basic reason why many private schools and their students excel at extracuricular activities. In general, the kids are number one in their parents' lives and thus receive the opportunity to participate in any extracuricular activity available and very often, the AAU, club teams, etc. The parents are willing to make financial commitment or at least the time commitment for their children to succeed.

I knew the answer when I asked that question, my point is this, the church is consolidating schools like crazy now and they don't seem to care how far kids have to go to get their education. So while sad, the kid in the situation in Hardin county has three options, stay in Catholic schools and go to Louisville, leave the Catholic school system before 7th grade, or sit one year. I am not saying the new rule is a good thing for everyone, but it is better to me then splitting the playoff nes paz.

Yeah but, like MOMMA says, if they are coming towards where I live, we are gonna have to build more churches out this way.

and they don't seem to care how far kids have to go to get their education.

 

To say that they don't care is going too far and I think you would admit to that. It is a matter of accepting economic reality. The neighborhood I grew up in (Hikes Point) was LOADED with kids in the 70's and 80's. As a result, there were five Catholic grade schools within a mile or so from each other. St's Martha, Barnabus, Pius, Bartholomew, and Ascension. Due to the large number of Hikes Point kids in those two decades, all five schools had somewhere between 300 - 500 kids in them. Today, you look around Hikes Point, there are not that many kids. Primarily retirees (those kids' parents who still live there) and singles. There simply is no need for five schools now. Most families are heading East to the newer neighborhoods. Merging these schools is not making it all that difficult for kids to get there. In 30 minutes, I could drive to all five parishes one by one easily. The public schools in Hikes Point may have to close/merge also. Their enrollments are low also.

 

The same is true along Dixie Hwy. Where Notre Dame Academy is the merger of St. Lawrence, Helens, Denis and I believe another parish in the Shively/Northern PRP area and St. Andrew's Academy which was the merger of OLOC, Sts' Clement, and few more which served the Valley Station/ South PRP area. Again, not that many kids in those neighborhoods. PRP and Butler High School are the only public HSs able to keep their enrollments up up in the SW end, the rest (Valley, Western, Doss, etc.) are all watching their enrollments decline.

Do you think the decline in Catholic grade schools is attributed to the rise in # of "Christian" grade schools that are not of the Catholic denomination?

 

It sure seems that "Christian" High schools other than of the Catholic denomination are becoming more prevalent around the state.

 

I would say the primary reason is due to quickly rising cost of Catholic education as a result to the larger portion of lay teachers versus clergy teaching in those schools. 40+ years ago, Catholic Schools were primarily taught by priests and nuns who worked almost for free. All the parishes/high schools had to do was maintain and convent or rectory for them to live in and feed them and give them a small amount of spending money. It is MUCH cheaper to provide room and board for a few dozen nuns/priests than it is to pay the payrolls of a few dozen lay teachers.

 

I don't believe the increasing number of non-Catholic Christian Schools has much to do with it. 30 plus years ago, very few Protestants would even consider going to Catholic schools. They were probably 98% Catholic then due to the tension that existed between Catholics and Protestants until the past 20 - 40 years. Today there is a better understanding between Catholics and Protestants and (in areas where a non-Catholic Christian School) a larger percentage of Protestants go Catholic schools. I attended Trinity in the early 90's with numerous Baptists, Methodists, Presbyterians, Episcopalians, non-denominationals, etc. despite the fact that Christian Academy wasn't to far from Trinity. No they were not all athletes . Trinity just has a strong academic reputation and they wanted a part of it.

 

I would say the ever growing non-Catholic Christian Schools are taking students from Public Schools more than anything. I guess more Protestants are seeing the benefits that Catholics have been receiving for 150 years from sending their kids to religious based schools and want the same for their children so they are sending them to their own religious based schools rather than the public schools they attended as children. I don't know this for a fact, but I would bet if you asked the students at Louisville and Lexington Christian Academy where their parents went to school, most would answer a public school.

 

A few years ago, I read the Southern Baptist Convention considered asking Southern Baptist parents to pull their kids out of the Public Schools and send them to religious schools if it were at all financially possible. The article continued that what is so amazing about this is the fact that decades ago, the Southern Baptist Convention was strong supporter of public education.

 

It appears religious Protestants are seeing society being more secular and want to try to indoctrinate their kids through religious based schools to supplement what they are receiving at home. Catholic schools systems started a 150 years ago in Louisville because Jews, Catholics, and Blacks were prohibited from attending the preferred public schools which were restricted to WASP's. Bishop Spalding said the heck with you guys, we will start our own school system. And that school system continues to this day.

I can't come up with any reasonable explanation for turning that down except a desire to see kids forced to change schools prior to seventh grade.

The reasonable explanation "might" be that when all is said and done the public schools want the situation to be fair, if they allow for different sets of rules then it would make all thier effort look like a sham, and public opinon on there actions will be negative.

 

I think people are wrong to assume that the public side (which I still disagree with) is intended on destroying the private, rather than creating equality.

 

The situation is PublicVsPrivate not GoodVsEvil. If the sides fail to respect (whether they agree is different matter) the other side's arguements as legimate, than there is no ground to find.

The reasonable explanation "might" be that when all is said and done the public schools want the situation to be fair, if they allow for different sets of rules then it would make all thier effort look like a sham, and public opinon on there actions will be negative.

 

I think people are wrong to assume that the public side (which I still disagree with) is intended on destroying the private, rather than creating equality.

 

The situation is PublicVsPrivate not GoodVsEvil. If the sides fail to respect (whether they agree is different matter) the other side's arguements as legimate, than there is no ground to find.

I am a strong supporter of public schools. The are an important part of a strong state. I also think that most of the people involved in the public/private debate from the public side are well intentioned, even if I think they are wrong. There are some however, and I include Sears and Sexton among them that are just flat out against private education.

I am one of the parents that you speak of going to public school in Lexington and then switching my son to private school. I see on this site all the time that athletics are why kids go to privates. In our situation the Fayette County School Board redistricted the area we lived in and the High School my son would have attended after redistricting did not suit me. This happened as my son entered 3rd grade so moving to private school was only choice( my father and many of his friends whom were retired Fayette Co administrators advised me LCA would be a good choice ). Athletics are not the only reason people have moved schools and many of the kids that transfer don't even realize they are good at a sport when they transferred to a school. What happens to the student that is in one High School district for his entire life and in the 8th grade his school board decides for him that he will go to a specific school that he does not want to attend? Go to a private school and lose 2 years of eligibility or go to a school that is not academically or athletically where he wants to be. On that note check out the growth rate at LCA and Lexington Catholic in about 1996 when Fayette co. redistricted all schools.