I am not trying to paint it any way. Are you saying the kids are in this country legally? If so why the need for the Dream Act?

 

The fact is it doesn't matter if the kids willing did anything wrong. They are breaking our laws and they are in the country illegally.

 

I have changed my mind. I agree. Lock up the 2 year olds.

Then they should be compassionately deported with their parents.

 

I want to make sure I understand the situation. A family crosses the boarder illegally. The child is enrolled in our public school system. It is determined that this child and his/her parents are in this country illegally. At this point is there a reason the INS isn't knocking on thier door?

 

How has it been determined that his/her parents are here illegally? Maybe those that have enrolled children in schools can answer better than I can, but I don't believe that you have to provide proof of citizenship to enroll your children in school. I think all that you have to have is proof of residence (address). I don't deal with that part of the educational system.

I have changed my mind. I agree. Lock up the 2 year olds.

They finally broke you.

I understand the point many are making about the children not "voluntarily" committing the crime, but it doesn't change the fact that they are here against the laws of our country. An acceptable compromise to the individuals this act would help, IMO, would be to make them fill out the necessary paperwork and what nots to achieve legal immigrant status. If they are unable to pay any fees involved with the process then they are to return to Mexico/wherever they're from until they are able to complete the process legally. If they have the financial means of paying for the process, then they can stay. I would think the process for them would be pretty swift.

 

A compromise that I could probably accept, with a bit of tweaking. Fees and completion of paperwork might be problematic with small children.

 

Much better than "kick 'em all out", while ignoring the white elephant in the room. The parents are here (and I assume many of the older children as well) because companies pay them several times the hourly wage that they could receive in Mexico. With little or no repercussions. Nobody (well, almost nobody, from what I can tell) wants to punish the poor businesses that want to skirt the rules.

I have changed my mind. I agree. Lock up the 2 year olds.

 

I am having a hard time understanding the mind set of not deporting illegal because they have kids. Are you saying that illegals should get a pass if they have kids? Screw it, let's make all of them citizens. While we are at it lets open up the boards and let everyone. I know, there are some that can't afford to move to the US and that's just not fair. How about we build everyone in Mexico a house and schools. Then they won't have to come here. We can also create jobs for all of them so there will be no incentive to come here. How's that?

A compromise that I could probably accept, with a bit of tweaking. Fees and completion of paperwork might be problematic with small children.

 

Much better than "kick 'em all out", while ignoring the white elephant in the room. The parents are here (and I assume many of the older children as well) because companies pay them several times the hourly wage that they could receive in Mexico. With little or no repercussions. Nobody (well, almost nobody, from what I can tell) wants to punish the poor businesses that want to skirt the rules.

 

That simply isn't true. I have talked to no one nor have I seen anyone on here that said businesses shouldn't be punished. As a matter of fact that is one of the key elements to good immigration reform.

I am having a hard time understanding the mind set of not deporting illegal because they have kids. Are you saying that illegals should get a pass if they have kids? Screw it, let's make all of them citizens. While we are at it lets open up the boards and let everyone. I know, there are some that can't afford to move to the US and that's just not fair. How about we build everyone in Mexico a house and schools. Then they won't have to come here. We can also create jobs for all of them so there will be no incentive to come here. How's that?

 

Please reread each of my posts and the link in post 1. No where have I said that illegals shouldn't be deported simply because they have kids.

 

The DREAM Act is for those individuals that are 18 years of age or older that have graduated from a US high school. It makes no provisions for their parents nor siblings that are not HS graduates.

That simply isn't true. I have talked to no one nor have I seen anyone on here that said businesses shouldn't be punished. As a matter of fact that is one of the key elements to good immigration reform.

 

I hear of no disdain for the businesses. Aren't the owners criminals, too?

 

What type of punishment do you suggest for these businesses, as part of good immigration reform?

Please reread each of my posts and the link in post 1. No where have I said that illegals shouldn't be deported simply because they have kids.

 

The DREAM Act is for those individuals that are 18 years of age or older that have graduated from a US high school. It makes no provisions for their parents nor siblings that are not HS graduates.

 

Then I will ask, a kid in enrolled in your school that is here illegally. Should he/she and their family be deported?

I hear of no disdain for the businesses. Aren't the owners criminals, too?

 

What type of punishment do you suggest for these businesses, as part of good immigration reform?

 

Then you haven't been reading any of the immigration threads. It has been said many times that heavy heavy fines should be imposed on businesses that hire illegal workers. And yes, they are criminals and should be fined and face possible jail time.

 

I am in the small minority that believes the INS should do everything with it's power to deport any and all illegals. I have heard many say that it is silly to think that is possible but have yet to see why it's impossible.

 

As far as the Dream Act, I am not saying I blame the 18 that just graduated high school for his/her parents dragging him/her here. At this point there isn't anything that can be done and I wouldn't have a problem with some sort of process for them to become legal citizens. However it cannot be an open ended thing. It then only becomes more of an incentive for parents to come here illegally. If you pass somethink like this it only covers any child currently enrolled in school only if they graduate. If they drop out or their families get deported before then oh well.

Hey, remember, I was the one that LOVED President Bush's "guest worked" plan. Couple that with the DREAM Act and we would already be reaping the benefits if it had been passed with Bush. Guest workers would continue to work the jobs that they do now, PAY taxes and those kids that have done nothing wrong (seriously, they haven't, regardless of how anyone wants to paint it otherwise) can choose to attain legal status through the provisions of the DREAM Act. Afterward, we have college or military educated additions to our citizenry.

Look, I understand your point, but the fact remains that the flood gates would open under this. That's the problem with it.

If they weren't from poor families, they wouldn't be here illegally to begin with. If they could work a job in Mexico (which for many of these kids, will be a country that they don't know) where they could save up $7000 - $10,000, they probably wouldn't need to come to our country illegally for work.

 

I should add that it is not a swift and easy process, as it is now. I know of one individual who, through donations of individuals, obtained the money to come legally. The mountains of paperwork that he had to provide, in addition to the cash, were considerable. In addition, he had to go back to Mexico (had to live in Juarez, with his American wife) for a time.

 

I do like, UKMF, that you are willing to try something besides "send 'em all back and good riddance."

 

I have no knowledge of the income levels of those that would be affected by this act, or the costs of the legal immigration process, however, if these young adults are over the age of 18 and have a high school degree, wouldn't it be assumed that they are either working and in school or solely working? I'm not saying a one-time all inclusive payment would be necessary, but a monthly payment plan along with the proper paperwork, and taxed wages wouldn't be asking too much IMO. I'd also make it a one strike and you're out policy. If they a miss a payment, they're out until they can afford the process.

Some pretty good ideas... But before I would consider ANY amnesty legislation the feds, with military help if needed, would have to prove that they can and will shut down the border..

Any provisions to control the border?? Whats to keep thousands more from crossing illegally to take advantage of any amnesty offered??

Any provisions to control the border?? Whats to keep thousands more from crossing illegally to take advantage of any amnesty offered??

Like I said....floodgates....

Then you haven't been reading any of the immigration threads. It has been said many times that heavy heavy fines should be imposed on businesses that hire illegal workers. And yes, they are criminals and should be fined and face possible jail time.

 

I am in the small minority that believes the INS should do everything with it's power to deport any and all illegals. I have heard many say that it is silly to think that is possible but have yet to see why it's impossible.

 

As far as the Dream Act, I am not saying I blame the 18 that just graduated high school for his/her parents dragging him/her here. At this point there isn't anything that can be done and I wouldn't have a problem with some sort of process for them to become legal citizens. However it cannot be an open ended thing. It then only becomes more of an incentive for parents to come here illegally. If you pass somethink like this it only covers any child currently enrolled in school only if they graduate. If they drop out or their families get deported before then oh well.

 

I've read TONS of immigration threads on here. Sometimes the business issue is mentioned, but there is no disdain for the business owner, only the illegal immigrant.

 

I think that there might be some areas in which we agree. I, too, don't think that the DREAM Act needs to become an open ended thing. I think that it should be part of immigration reform, the first step, IMO, being to secure our borders. Then, figure out what to do with the individuals that are here and made the choice to be. The greatest consideration, IMO, should be to those individuals that did NOT make the choice to come illegally, but have been "of good moral character" (as addressed in by the DREAM Act) and have graduated high school. If they are willing to serve in the military or work to put themselves through school (I like the idea of 4 years of military service or a qualifying college degree), then I think that we should make provisions for that.