I'll take my apology at anytime SSC .

I'll take my apology at anytime SSC .

 

Where did it say no other top picks had injuries??? The point I was making was Brown is terrible. That's why it said that first. I was just mentioning that Palmer has had two major injuries. You are making stuff up again.

 

Actually I'm glad you made that big highlighted post. It clearly says he has had things to overcome that SOME other top picks haven't. You are really reaching. The second pick you highlighted never even mentioed an injury. Reach some more.

With your first point you're arguing about something that I'm not even talking about. Do you think that if you take a QB #1 over all in the draft you should believe the guy is good enough to lead your franchise to the promise land? If so you agree with me, if not then I'd hate to have you making my draft choices. So in taking Palmer #1 overall the Bengals must have felt that he was able to eventually mature and become a top of the line QB. With a #1 pick at QB I want a Peyton Manning (though not many are that good) and not an average guy or a guy like JaMarcus Russell. I'll take my average QB late in round 1 or in round 2 or later.

 

I don't see how his career isn't a disappointment. The consensus is that he had two great years, but those were quite a few years back. He's 3 or 4 years removed from playing his best football and he's not even old yet. He should be in the middle or end of his prime. He's been in the league for 7 years and only two of his years have been really good ones. Sure maybe the talent wasn't as good last year to throw to but it's improved infinitely in his tenure. He's been to the playoffs twice and never won a playoff game. Compared to many other #1 pick QBs he's had a great career, but in the grand scheme of things he's been average. 2 very good years does not a career make especially when it's followed by years of being average. He's no bust but he's far from having been a great #1 pick. That could all change but the facts are the facts man.

 

This really is a pointless argument with you. Do you really not understand how bad this franchise was before Palmer? Do you not understand what other top QB's they had taken, that just sucked when they got here because of how bad this franchise was? When Palmer was drafted, yes people thought he could be a guy to turn this franchise around, and how has he not done that? He has turned this franchise around, so how does that make his career a disappointment so far?

 

If you ask people in 2003 when they drafted him, that before the 2010 season. The Bengals would have won two division titles, should have made another in 2006 if not for special teams, and having one year taken away because of injury. Mostly everyone would have taken that, and even just NFL guys, would even say that would be a very successful career to this point for him considering what he was coming to. I believe you even know this, you just choose to ignore this because you have argued against this for so long, you can't admit that you are wrong. There is no way you can call his career a disappointment. When any person would have taken this from him so far.

 

Now it is time for him to get the team over the next hump, and if he can't do that in his career. Then I can see where you can say it was a disappointment and he was just average for his career. In no way though has it been a disappointment, unless you choose to ignore how bad this franchise was before him. Your whole listing of other bad teams, does not even compare. Because even those teams were not as bad of a franchise and for as long as the Bengals were.

FWIW, my good friend who is an athletic trainer for the Bengals, swears up and down that Palmer is washed up and has been for quite some time.

 

I tend to disagree, but he does see him virtually every single day, so....:idunno:

 

I actually had a conversation with one of the Bengal receivers a few weeks about. We talked a lot about Palmer, and his elbow and his knee. He even said Palmer is fine and looks great. Asked then why has the passing game struggled some, he said a lot of it is because of the offensive coordinator. He even talked about just how predictable they are. It was really interesting hearing an actual player say that, since that is the same thing that most of us thought on here.

I actually had a conversation with one of the Bengal receivers a few weeks about. We talked a lot about Palmer, and his elbow and his knee. He even said Palmer is fine and looks great. Asked then why has the passing game struggled some, he said a lot of it is because of the offensive coordinator. He even talked about just how predictable they are. It was really interesting hearing an actual player say that, since that is the same thing that most of us thought on here.

 

I'm not discrediting what you're saying, but what is he supposed to say to a fan? Yeah, Carson's washed up?

Where did it say no other top picks had injuries??? The point I was making was Brown is terrible. That's why it said that first. I was just mentioning that Palmer has had two major injuries. You are making stuff up again.

 

Making stuff up? I just quoted you word for word. YOU said Palmer has had a worse situation that any other #1 pick. You said that. Where you get that I made something up I don't know but it's offensive. You said that crap, and obviously realized it was a ridiculous statement to make and now you're backtracking. The only person who has lied here is you because you refuse to admit what you said even though I just highlighted it and put it in 50 pt. font.

This really is a pointless argument with you. Do you really not understand how bad this franchise was before Palmer? Do you not understand what other top QB's they had taken, that just sucked when they got here because of how bad this franchise was? When Palmer was drafted, yes people thought he could be a guy to turn this franchise around, and how has he not done that? He has turned this franchise around, so how does that make his career a disappointment so far?

 

If you ask people in 2003 when they drafted him, that before the 2010 season. The Bengals would have won two division titles, should have made another in 2006 if not for special teams, and having one year taken away because of injury. Mostly everyone would have taken that, and even just NFL guys, would even say that would be a very successful career to this point for him considering what he was coming to. I believe you even know this, you just choose to ignore this because you have argued against this for so long, you can't admit that you are wrong. There is no way you can call his career a disappointment. When any person would have taken this from him so far.

 

Now it is time for him to get the team over the next hump, and if he can't do that in his career. Then I can see where you can say it was a disappointment and he was just average for his career. In no way though has it been a disappointment, unless you choose to ignore how bad this franchise was before him. Your whole listing of other bad teams, does not even compare. Because even those teams were not as bad of a franchise and for as long as the Bengals were.

 

FC you're love for the Bengals has blinded you. Only a Bengals fan would think like this. 7 years after drafting a QB #1 and greatly improving the talent on the team ANY team would hope to have at least a few playoff wins by now. I don't care how bad the Bengals were in the 90s because it's irrelevant. Do any of those players still play on the team?

 

But hey if you're happy that Carson Palmer is your QB more power to you. It's your team not mine. I wouldn't want him playing for the team I rooted for unless I was extremely desperate. Just because some one doesn't see it the way your extremely biased Bengal eyes do doesn't mean they're wrong. I've given you the reasons why I think Palmer is overrated by Bengals fans. Bengals fans have given their reasons why he's he's better than I give him credit for. You give reasons why he's struggled and I call them excuses. We're probably both right or both wrong.

I actually had a conversation with one of the Bengal receivers a few weeks about. We talked a lot about Palmer, and his elbow and his knee. He even said Palmer is fine and looks great. Asked then why has the passing game struggled some, he said a lot of it is because of the offensive coordinator. He even talked about just how predictable they are. It was really interesting hearing an actual player say that, since that is the same thing that most of us thought on here.

 

How is this even relevant? What was he going to say to you? Carson sucks?

Where did I say no other QB has had an injury?

 

When you said no other #1 pick has had to go through stuff as tough as Palmer.

 

Making stuff up? I just quoted you word for word. YOU said Palmer has had a worse situation that any other #1 pick. You said that. Where you get that I made something up I don't know but it's offensive. You said that crap, and obviously realized it was a ridiculous statement to make and now you're backtracking. The only person who has lied here is you because you refuse to admit what you said even though I just highlighted it and put it in 50 pt. font.

 

Look I'm done with you. I asked where I said no other QB has had an injury. I never said no other QB has had an injury. Never. Quit saying I said something I didn't. You then said I said it on a post again. I didn't. I clearly said he has had injuries but he has had to overcome SOME things that SOME other top picks haven't. Then the other post I said IMO he had a tougher situation than all the others b/c of Brown. Reading isn't your strong point I guess.

How is this even relevant? What was he going to say to you? Carson sucks?

 

So he puts down one of his bosses in his offensive coordinator instead, just to defend Carson. Good one Cats....

So he puts down one of his bosses in his offensive coordinator instead, just to defend Carson. Good one Cats....

 

Players are much more likely to throw a coach under the bus than a teammate....Also, if you don't mind me asking, which receiver was it?

FC you're love for the Bengals has blinded you. Only a Bengals fan would think like this. 7 years after drafting a QB #1 and greatly improving the talent on the team ANY team would hope to have at least a few playoff wins by now. I don't care how bad the Bengals were in the 90s because it's irrelevant. Do any of those players still play on the team?

 

But hey if you're happy that Carson Palmer is your QB more power to you. It's your team not mine. I wouldn't want him playing for the team I rooted for unless I was extremely desperate. Just because some one doesn't see it the way your extremely biased Bengal eyes do doesn't mean they're wrong. I've given you the reasons why I think Palmer is overrated by Bengals fans. Bengals fans have given their reasons why he's he's better than I give him credit for. You give reasons why he's struggled and I call them excuses. We're probably both right or both wrong.

 

So since someone doesn't have the same opinion as you, its because they are bias to their own team? You sure seem to act like that in everyone of your arguments on here. You do realize you can have bias to when you don't like a team? So I could say the same about you. You talk about facts, yet you choose to ignore reasons for those facts. You talk about how it has only been Bengal fans who thought he was good. Yet most NFL guys thought he was good too, and once was elite. Shoot a lot of NFL guys have even said if he has more talent around him that he would be one of the best again.

 

Now you talk about how they improved the talent on the team? The only reason why they made the playoffs in 2005 was because of him and the offense. The only reason why they should have in 2006 was because him and the offense. No talent on that defense back then. 2007 did they add talent to make them better? Please show me how? They had a runningback who hit the wall, their 3rd reciever who met a lot to the offense in Chris Henry was suspended for 8 games. The offensive line had injuries to their tackles all year. Yet they added talent? How about you get your facts straight. 2008 he didn't even play. 2009 only one receiver, and yet he still led his team on game winning drives that helped win the division. So please tell me how did they keep adding talent to the roster before this season, especially on offense? Before this season, they kept losing talent not gaining it. How is that showing bias? That is just stating facts. Also another fact is almost anyone would have taken what Palmer has done for this franchise since they drafted him, if they asked them in 2003. Thats how bad this franchise was. So there is no way someone could have been disappointing up to this point, when you take everything in consideration, which you usually NEVER do. Now one thing we can agree on, it is time now for him to get this team over the hump. So we will see how things play out.

Look I'm done with you. I asked where I said no other QB has had an injury. I never said no other QB has had an injury. Never. Quit saying I said something I didn't. You then said I said it on a post again. I didn't. I clearly said he has had injuries but he has had to overcome SOME things that SOME other top picks haven't. Then the other post I said IMO he had a tougher situation than all the others b/c of Brown. Reading isn't your strong point I guess.

 

Yup I can't read. You can't admit what you said. I guess we're even.

 

So he puts down one of his bosses in his offensive coordinator instead, just to defend Carson. Good one Cats....

 

See UKMF's post. A savvy sports guy like yourself has certainly realized that coaches are more often to be the target of criticism than teammates of players. Not everyone is TO and throws their teammates under the bus especially to fans.

 

So since someone doesn't have the same opinion as you, its because they are bias to their own team? You sure seem to act like that in everyone of your arguments on here. You do realize you can have bias to when you don't like a team? So I could say the same about you. You talk about facts, yet you choose to ignore reasons for those facts. You talk about how it has only been Bengal fans who thought he was good. Yet most NFL guys thought he was good too, and once was elite. Shoot a lot of NFL guys have even said if he has more talent around him that he would be one of the best again.

 

Now you talk about how they improved the talent on the team? The only reason why they made the playoffs in 2005 was because of him and the offense. The only reason why they should have in 2006 was because him and the offense. No talent on that defense back then. 2007 did they add talent to make them better? Please show me how? They had a runningback who hit the wall, their 3rd reciever who met a lot to the offense in Chris Henry was suspended for 8 games. The offensive line had injuries to their tackles all year. Yet they added talent? How about you get your facts straight. 2008 he didn't even play. 2009 only one receiver, and yet he still led his team on game winning drives that helped win the division. So please tell me how did they keep adding talent to the roster before this season, especially on offense? Before this season, they kept losing talent not gaining it. How is that showing bias? That is just stating facts. Also another fact is almost anyone would have taken what Palmer has done for this franchise since they drafted him, if they asked them in 2003. Thats how bad this franchise was. So there is no way someone could have been disappointing up to this point, when you take everything in consideration, which you usually NEVER do. Now one thing we can agree on, it is time now for him to get this team over the hump. So we will see how things play out.

 

What team was more talented the 2009 Bengals or the 2003 Bengals? You are biased. I'm biased. Everyone is biased. Not exactly a novel concept.

 

I don't have a thing against the Bengals, I like alot of their players. Its the fans that kill me. But, don't worry if Carson shows out I'll be the first one on here saying I was wrong. But I'm not going to give him credit for yards, I don't give Schaub much love and I won't Carson or anyone else either. I want to see him make plays like Big Ben does or other top QBs.

 

I would expect you to do the same thing if Caron doesn't play well and gets exposed like I think he will. No more excuses.

Yup I can't read. You can't admit what you said. I guess we're even.

 

 

Just let it go. You were wrong. I asked where I said no other QB was ever hurt? Until you can use the biggest font available to show where I said that YOU ARE WRONG.

Just let it go. You were wrong. I asked where I said no other QB was ever hurt? Until you can use the biggest font available to show where I said that YOU ARE WRONG.

 

Whatever man it's pointless arguing with you. You aren't even comprehending what you said, let alone what I said.

 

As for saying No other QB ever got hurt I don't remember you saying that. It was implied though when you say Carson has had it rougher than any other #1 pick and you mention injuries as an excuse for why he hasn't been as good as what was once thought.

 

As for what I'm arguing about with you, you said Carson came into the worst situation of all #1 pick QBs. Then I called you out on that, and you said you didn't say it. I put it in huge red font. Maybe you're the one with a reading problem because you've been talking about something that I didn't even mention other than sarcastically asking if any other #1 picks had ever had injuries about 50 post ago. Look at the first thing you quoted when we started going down this road and then come back.