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Aaron Harang


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Harang hasn't been the same since that ill-advised relief appearance on May 25th. A lot of people didn't think it was a big deal then:

 

Ding Ding we have a winner! :jump:

 

 

Harang would have thrown 60 in the pen anyway.

 

Guys, these are major league pitchers. They pitch on a daily basis and do bullpen work every day other than the day following their start.

 

Although 4 innings is a lot for Harang, he threw just over 60 pitches. Not a big deal, although the intensity level of those 60 pitches was obviously higher than what they would have been during a bullpen session.

 

Regarding Volquez: Once again, not a problem. Sure, it's not an ideal situation, but Volquez's arm looked good (he was hitting 96 regularly) and still did not throw too many pitches.

 

It's not that big of a deal Volquez will get regular rest and Harang is a work horse.....

 

 

Tue vs Pit: RHP Johnny Cueto (2-5, 5.56) vs RHP Ian Snell (2-3, 4.84)

Wed vs Pit: RHP Bronson Arroyo (3-4, 5.68) vs LHP Tom Gorzelanny (4-4, 6.31)

Thu vs Pit: RHP Aaron Harang (2-6, 3.32) vs LHP Zach Duke (2-4, 4.55)

Fri vs Atl: RHP Edinson Volquez (7-2, 1.31) vs LHP Tom Glavine (2-2, 4.76)

Sat vs Atl: RHP Matt Belisle (1-4, 7.28) vs RHP Jair Jurrjens (Monday)

Sun vs Atl: RHP Johnny Cueto vs RHP Tim Hudson (Tuesday)

 

If the Reds win, this isn't even being debated. Have NO problem at all with doing everything possible to try and win a ball game.

 

I don't see this as an issue. At all.

 

I realize people question his handling of pitchers in the past, fair or not. However, has Dusty abused any of his pitchers thus far this season? It doesn't seem that way to me. I'm only concerned about what he does in Cincinnati, so until it looks like he's damaging his pitchers here, I don't see why we need to make much ado about nothing.

 

Again, Harang would've had 60 in the pen anyways...

 

Harang threw 63 pitches 4 days before his start. Shouldn't have had anything to do with last nights preformance. He was just off. When he is bad, which he is every few starts, he is really off. This is the reason some do not consider him a true ace.

 

 

After his 4 inning relief appearance his ERA stood at 3.32. Since then here are his numbers:

 

15 1/3 IP, 30 H, 16 ER, 1 BB, 10 K, 4 HR with an ERA of 9.39 to raise his overall ERA to 4.31. His arm hasn't had any life at all. Do you all still think it wasn't a big deal to leave him out there to throw 63 pitches like that?

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I didn't chime in before, but no that's absolutely not the problem.

 

 

I don't think he just suddenly forgot how to pitch. His pitches haven't had nearly the same life as before. So you don't think that throwing 103 pitches on Thursday followed by his heavy bullpen session on Saturday along with 63 more pitches in the game on Sunday couldn't possibly have affected him? :rolleyes:

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I don't think he just suddenly forgot how to pitch. His pitches haven't had nearly the same life as before. So you don't think that throwing 103 pitches on Thursday followed by his heavy bullpen session on Saturday along with 63 more pitches in the game on Sunday couldn't possibly have affected him? :rolleyes:

 

 

Straight from the horses mouth.

 

 

"I don't know what's wrong," he said. "I don't have a feel for anything. I'm leaving pitches over the plate. It's not the normal me."

That relief appearance in San Diego came after first start of this bad run.

"This goes back before then," Harang said. "I think the first start after that it may have been fatigue. I counted them up. I threw well over 100 more pitches than normal that week. But this is something that started before San Diego."

Harang said he feels fine physically.

"I feel plenty strong," he said. "I don't have the touch. I'm hanging sliders. I'm missing when I try to go in. I'm missing when I try to go away. The ball ends up over the plate. I feel fine in my side (sessions). I feel fine warming up."

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Straight from the horses mouth.

 

 

"I don't know what's wrong," he said. "I don't have a feel for anything. I'm leaving pitches over the plate. It's not the normal me."

That relief appearance in San Diego came after first start of this bad run.

"This goes back before then," Harang said. "I think the first start after that it may have been fatigue. I counted them up. I threw well over 100 more pitches than normal that week. But this is something that started before San Diego."

Harang said he feels fine physically.

"I feel plenty strong," he said. "I don't have the touch. I'm hanging sliders. I'm missing when I try to go in. I'm missing when I try to go away. The ball ends up over the plate. I feel fine in my side (sessions). I feel fine warming up."

 

Yeah, I read that earlier. I think that quote is Harang taking another one for the team, just like he did in San Diego--it was either that or just come out and throw Dusty under the bus. He was nasty in that relief appearance, probably pitching a lot on the adrenaline of an extra-inning game but what he is describing is what happens when pitchers are fatigued.

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Yeah, I read that earlier. I think that quote is Harang taking another one for the team, just like he did in San Diego--it was either that or just come out and throw Dusty under the bus. He was nasty in that relief appearance, probably pitching a lot on the adrenaline of an extra-inning game but what he is describing is what happens when pitchers are fatigued.

 

Maybe so, but his string of bad starts started at Dodger Stadium before the San Diego series.

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I don't think he just suddenly forgot how to pitch. His pitches haven't had nearly the same life as before. So you don't think that throwing 103 pitches on Thursday followed by his heavy bullpen session on Saturday along with 63 more pitches in the game on Sunday couldn't possibly have affected him? :rolleyes:
Could have? Sure.

 

Thos this extent, no.

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His location and command, is not consistent. Harang is leaving pitches up and in the middle of the plate. Velocity has been down 4-6mph's and that results, in a lot of contact.

 

Looks a little more upright and shorter stride, than I recall. They'll break down some video and get it corrected.

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Harang's been worked awfully hard the last two seasons, with 466 innings in 2006 and 2007. It's the collective workload that often takes a toll a year or two down the road. Throw in the mess of the 18-inning game in San Diego, and you've got a pitcher that might be battling some serious arm fatigue.

 

It's also the main reason I suggested that the Reds look to see what Harang might get on the trade market because his value was never going to be as high as it is now. That window may be closing now.

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Harang's been worked awfully hard the last two seasons, with 466 innings in 2006 and 2007. It's the collective workload that often takes a toll a year or two down the road. Throw in the mess of the 18-inning game in San Diego, and you've got a pitcher that might be battling some serious arm fatigue.

 

It's also the main reason I suggested that the Reds look to see what Harang might get on the trade market because his value was never going to be as high as it is now. That window may be closing now.

 

If the Reds had somebody waiting in the wings to take his place then I would consider it if I were Jocketty, but assuming the Reds move Arroyo ( and I think they will) that would leave Volquez, Cueto, Bailey, and two youngsters in Thompson and Maloney. That's an awfully inexperienced and unproven staff. I think you have to keep a veteran like Harang around to help this staff mature.

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If the Reds had somebody waiting in the wings to take his place then I would consider it if I were Jocketty, but assuming the Reds move Arroyo ( and I think they will) that would leave Volquez, Cueto, Bailey, and two youngsters in Thompson and Maloney. That's an awfully inexperienced and unproven staff. I think you have to keep a veteran like Harang around to help this staff mature.
Why couldn't the Reds get a couple of good young arms for Harang to add to the mix? You can never have too much pitching.

 

I never said the move had to be made, but there is certainly nothing wrong with exploring what Harang might bring on the market.

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