I'd hate to close my own thread because people are sliding towards Rule 2, but my hand is hovering near the buton.

And yet, numbers are stuborn things. Why not just admit that you were trying to minimize Senator Obama, whether what you said was true or not.

I apologize for giving the impression that I was trying to minimize Obama's experience. Senator Obama has, in fact, a full one-half of one term in the US Senate under his belt.

 

Just to avoid further confusion, let me be more precise. As of May 10, 2008, Senator Obama has been in the US Senate for 55.83% of one term.

 

I will also concede that running for office is a valuable skill for any politician so the fact that Obama has been officially running for the presidency since February 10, 2007, and had been in the Senate for only 36.67% of a term before formally claiming himself a candidate, should not be held against him. So, I even understated Senator Obama's US Senate experience in my follow-up post by 3.33% of a term. I am sorry for throwing around numbers so carelessly.

 

The point that I was trying to make is that Senator McCain has approximately 800% more Congressional experience than Senator Obama.

 

However, an Obama presidency could potentially have one thing going for it that a McCain presidency would not...beginner's luck.

 

I just think that having a green (in the inexperience, not environmental sense) president in office with a Congress dominated by liberal Democrats is a recipe for disaster. The last time that it happened, the result was the Islamic Republic of Iran.

If the Democrats didn't have their own similar situations, I'd agree with your sentiment, but they do, so I don't.

 

While I do think we should hold elected officials to somewhat of a higher standard, I think we all need to keep in mind that elected officials are "people too", not much different than any other group or segment of society. There are lawyers, doctors, accountants, business executives, salesmen, and blue collar workers that all have affairs and drive while intoxicated. Frankly if we have expectations that all elected officials are "saints", frankly we have unrealistic expecations. I'm not condoning this guys actions or forgiving his moral digressions one bit (as I think it does some provide some insight into a person's character and how they perform their official duties). Having said that, having an affair or even driving while intoxicated, is a much different matter than engaging in corruption, lying under oath as part of official duties, providing political favors in return for campaign contributions, engaging in voter fraud, etc. Don't you?

 

You show me a political party that is devoid of people that have never done the things this guy did and it will be the Jesus Christ Party with a membership of one.

 

But it is disappointing the Republican Party has wrapped itself into the "traditional" values / family values advocates - whatever that is suppose to mean. The party preached the high road and called the Democrats as something less religious, less moral, etc.

 

Instead of being the party of pro economic growth, opportunity for everyone, the party of self determination; it has become the party to hold judgement of others that many are more guilty of themselves. That is called hypocrite.

 

What exists now is not my Republican Party and where I go to church does not belong in my voting booth!:thumb:

But it is disappointing the Republican Party has wrapped itself into the "traditional" values / family values advocates - whatever that is suppose to mean. The party preached the high road and called the Democrats as something less religious, less moral, etc.

 

Instead of being the party of pro economic growth, opportunity for everyone, the party of self determination; it has become the party to hold judgement of others that many are more guilty of themselves. That is called hypocrite.

 

What exists now is not my Republican Party and where I go to church does not belong in my voting booth!:thumb:

 

So what you are saying is that because the Democratic party has not wrapped itself in "traditional values" you find such behavior acceptable from them and not acceptable for Republicans? That's interesting logic. The behavior is either okay with you or it is not. And get get ready for the Democrats to start trying to wrap itself in traditional values as its already coming. They are courting the religious types heavily, which I hope the religious types find extremely offensive as they should be intelligent enough to know that the only reason they are being courted is because of their voting power, not due the Democrats concurrence with the religious types values such as anti abortion, anti same sex marraige and pro family legislation. Honestly if are a strong anti abortion believer, I don't for the life of me understand how you could vote for Obama, even if you felt he was correct and McCain was wrong on every other issue.

I like Obama but feel that he is in the game eight years too soon. McCain will be getting my vote.

So what you are saying is that because the Democratic party has not wrapped itself in "traditional values" you find such behavior acceptable from them and not acceptable for Republicans? That's interesting logic. The behavior is either okay with you or it is not. And get get ready for the Democrats to start trying to wrap itself in traditional values as its already coming. They are courting the religious types heavily, which I hope the religious types find extremely offensive as they should be intelligent enough to know that the only reason they are being courted is because of their voting power, not due the Democrats concurrence with the religious types values such as anti abortion, anti same sex marraige and pro family legislation. Honestly if are a strong anti abortion believer, I don't for the life of me understand how you could vote for Obama, even if you felt he was correct and McCain was wrong on every other issue.

 

I just do not accept the premise that any political party has exclusive claim to moral authority. You miss the point. It is the Republican Party that claimed that moral authority and held those who did not believe like them as amoral. Your point was that all people have imperfections. My point is don't hold oneself up to a higher standard unless one is willing to accept the consequence of failing to live up to that standard. It could be claimed such actions would be considered accountability?!

 

The rest of your points I agree with, but a game was played by the Republican political leadership for the past decade that is now a major obstacle for them to overcome.

 

As for traditional values and who has themselves wrapped into it - I believe the vast majority of voters are fed up with that being the message vehicle. I think most voters today are interested in war, energy and economy and I think they will vote on those points this coming election cycle.

I can't trust Obama. There is something about him that is caniving and deceitful in my mind. Nor do I like his Muslim background. He says he is Protestant, but I have a hard time beleiving that as well. I am pulling for Hillary over Obama.

 

Personally, my vote goes for McCain. As someone mentioned earlier, he is the most bi-partisan experience than anyone. He is a moderate conservative, and gains the votes of the wavering Dem, while persauding the moderates to take his side as well. He has the votes of the conservatives wrapped up.

I can't trust Obama. There is something about him that is caniving and deceitful in my mind. Nor do I like his Muslim background. He says he is Protestant, but I have a hard time beleiving that as well. I am pulling for Hillary over Obama.

 

Personally, my vote goes for McCain. As someone mentioned earlier, he is the most bi-partisan experience than anyone. He is a moderate conservative, and gains the votes of the wavering Dem, while persauding the moderates to take his side as well. He has the votes of the conservatives wrapped up.

 

What evidence do you have of a Muslim background?

What evidence do you have of a Muslim background?

 

Hamas has come out and endosed him for what's that worth

What evidence do you have of a Muslim background?

 

Part of his heritage is Islam. His grandfather was Muslim.

Hamas has come out and endosed him for what's that worth

 

And the Ayatollah endorsed Ronald Reagan over the Great Satan Jimmy Carter.

Part of his heritage is Islam. His grandfather was Muslim.

 

And I'm sure some of us have some "slave holders" in our famliy tree and some idiotic forebearers who were heathens. What does that tie us too?

 

BTW, if you are speaking of his grandfather on his father's side, you do realize that Obama's father was "out of the picture" by the time he was 2 years old and only saw his father once before the man died in '82?

 

It's amazing to me how many people keep hitting on the "muslim" myths and fears. There's enough that Obama actually says to perhaps scare us more than these non-truths.

Part of his heritage is Islam. His grandfather was Muslim.

The first people to come to America were leaving because of religious persecution. Are you seriously not voting for Obama because he is Muslim? Is every Muslim a terrorist? Is it right to discriminate on the grounds of religion?

 

I can find a hundred reasons NOT to vote for Obama, but I won't stoop so low that one of my reasons is the fact that he is Muslim.

And the Ayatollah endorsed Ronald Reagan over the Great Satan Jimmy Carter.

 

I didn't know Jimmy Carter was the Great Satan:devil: :scared: That explains alot

I didn't know Jimmy Carter was the Great Satan:devil: :scared: That explains alot

Carter's offense to Islam was allowing the former Shah of Iran into the US for medical treatment after Carter facilitated the fall of his regime, which gave birth to the Islamic Republic of Iran.

 

When Islamic terrorists say that you are either with them or against them, they almost always mean that you are either 100% in lockstep with their beliefs or you are an infidel deserving to die a slow, humilating death.

 

Apparently, they have made an exception in Carter's case and now understand what a Godsend he has been for them.

 

Obama would be another gift from Allah.