There will be 3 games on Friday December the 7th and 3 games on Saturday December the 8th.

 

The KHSAA missed a huge opportunity to give football equal "time" with basketball. The KHSAA could have gone with the 2, 2, and 2 format which would give football the opportunity to reach event status like the Sweet 16 but failed to do so.

 

In summary, the KY Association of Superintendents did not want to afford a second school day to make the football finals an event. It is funny how basketball is entitled to 12 school days but football is only allowed to have 1. Talk about hyprocrisy...

 

Also, the football coaches were no help either. All they care about is their clinic on Thursday and how much money they are going to bring in and to heck with event status for the finals if it gets in the way of their own event.

 

One of the funny things about the school Supers and the coaches is the Supers said the coaches (thus teachers) being out of school on Thursday was an issue but they are out of school already because of the clinic. In the future, everyone needs to do a better job of getting their story straight when they are protecting their turf (basketball for the Supers and the clinic for the coaches).

 

None of this is the end of the world, just a missed opportunity because of several agendas. I still hold out hope that sometime in the future the powers that be can think of more than just their self interests when planning the football finals.

 

Normally, I just read what's on here and decide if I agree or disagree and espouse the virtues of freedom of press and the freedom of expression. But IMO, this is about the most self serving, selfish and uninformed post you have ever made.

 

First of all, just who do you consider to be "the powers that be" as referred in the post? Is it the school coaches who serve on the Advisory Committee who voted 13-2 in November to recommend this new schedule based on what I have been told? Are you saying those "powers that be" somehow don't have football as their number one priority? Ever added up the state championship games on that committee? As I see its composition, it is extremely representative of the schools that have played in the finals, and this type of decision is one that they are tremendously informed on.

 

Or are the "powers that be", the school superintendents who at this time are fighting with the legislature to overcome the $1000 a day disparity between per pupil spending in Kentucky and the national AVERAGE? Are they not supposed to be concerned when a NEW event (the necessary use of at least two days with a new school approved alignment, not an old event that is not changing from its current format and has been in the same basic format since 1932) threatens to eliminate a day of school? Are they not supposed to be concerned when the General Assembly just approved adding two days to the calendar and compensation for teachers and a new event threatens to take away a large group of their staff for one of those days?

 

Or are the powers that be somehow the staff at the KHSAA, who has to be in the elements more than any single fan or certainly media or quasi-media type? Staff feelings haven't been expressed on this one in any account I have read, but I can't imagine them feeling like 3 games over two days being a positive thing if they were trying to do what was in their own best interest. If something was being done to be self-serving by the "powers that be" and the KHSAA staff was somehow espousing this view, wouldn't that be contradictory.

 

Or are the "powers that be" the members of the Board of Control who have to sort out the wishes of groups of coaches, principals, administrators, superintendents, fans, media and try to do what's in the best interest of the organization? Especially when the opinions of all of those groups are certainly not united and often vary in the same building depending upon whom you talk to? Wasn't there even a poll question asked on this very web site that came back with a rather split decision? Nothing like another clear mandated opinion.

 

So who are the "powers that be" that somehow miss the boat on this one or made a selfish decision or a decision that somehow benefits that group over others? That one will be an interesting answer for you to define and defend.

 

And if you are going to make comparisions to other events, how about keeping fact and fiction straight. Your twelve day analogy, while being good on the melodrama side of things, includes six days of regular season tournament play (which is actually only three weekdays) in the All A classic, which is not a KHSAA event. While it sounds good to throw out that 12 day number, it is hardly factual. Before you make allegations of hypocrisy, you should have your story straight.

 

Lastly, just where does the supposed clinic have anything to do with this discussion? That (the current KFCA clinic) effects the coaches only and certainly shouldn't factor into any discussion about game times. If game times were 2-2-2, the clinic would be Thursday a.m. through game time and Friday a.m. through game time. If games times were 3-3, the clinic will likely have to be Thursday. So where is the school day difference? Don't both result in the coach(es) missing Thursday if they go, and certainly they all don't go. Net result is that its a non factor and just not a part of anything I have read or seen on here or anywhere else.

 

Maybe you and others didn't get their way on this one. Maybe I didn't get what I would have wanted either were I in a decision making mode with KHSAA. But that's no excuse in your position of influence with this site, to put out false and misleading statements simply to support your desires.

If they want to get the format right from here, they will go with 1,3,5 A schools on Friday and 2,4,6 A games on Saturday. That way your big school games are both in the evening. This is not to say that the smaller schools are any less important, because they aren't. It is just a simple business decision.

 

I am told that is the exact schedule recommended by the Advisory COmmittee, except that the 6A game wasn't going to be set until U of L's basketball schedule was set. You think Central Avenue, Crittenden Drive and Floyd Street at fun right now with just high school games, add 18 to 20 thousand trying to get into Freedom Hall with a Louisville oriented crowd for the 6A game. So they shoudl avoid that conflict.

Moving the finals to another location is for another thread. The one point I will add is it looks possible the games could end up at WKU (at least every other year) in the future. I think this is another very bad decision but I will save that for another thread.

Yes, that is for another thread. And the evaluation of that decision probably should wait until there is more information available on why another site would even need to be considered.

Normally, I just read what's on here and decide if I agree or disagree and espouse the virtues of freedom of press and the freedom of expression. But IMO, this is about the most self serving, selfish and uninformed post you have ever made.

 

First of all, just who do you consider to be "the powers that be" as referred in the post? Is it the school coaches who serve on the Advisory Committee who voted 13-2 in November to recommend this new schedule based on what I have been told? Are you saying those "powers that be" somehow don't have football as their number one priority? Ever added up the state championship games on that committee? As I see its composition, it is extremely representative of the schools that have played in the finals, and this type of decision is one that they are tremendously informed on.

 

Or are the "powers that be", the school superintendents who at this time are fighting with the legislature to overcome the $1000 a day disparity between per pupil spending in Kentucky and the national AVERAGE? Are they not supposed to be concerned when a NEW event (the necessary use of at least two days with a new school approved alignment, not an old event that is not changing from its current format and has been in the same basic format since 1932) threatens to eliminate a day of school? Are they not supposed to be concerned when the General Assembly just approved adding two days to the calendar and compensation for teachers and a new event threatens to take away a large group of their staff for one of those days?

 

Or are the powers that be somehow the staff at the KHSAA, who has to be in the elements more than any single fan or certainly media or quasi-media type? Staff feelings haven't been expressed on this one in any account I have read, but I can't imagine them feeling like 3 games over two days being a positive thing if they were trying to do what was in their own best interest. If something was being done to be self-serving by the "powers that be" and the KHSAA staff was somehow espousing this view, wouldn't that be contradictory.

 

Or are the "powers that be" the members of the Board of Control who have to sort out the wishes of groups of coaches, principals, administrators, superintendents, fans, media and try to do what's in the best interest of the organization? Especially when the opinions of all of those groups are certainly not united and often vary in the same building depending upon whom you talk to? Wasn't there even a poll question asked on this very web site that came back with a rather split decision? Nothing like another clear mandated opinion.

 

So who are the "powers that be" that somehow miss the boat on this one or made a selfish decision or a decision that somehow benefits that group over others? That one will be an interesting answer for you to define and defend.

 

And if you are going to make comparisions to other events, how about keeping fact and fiction straight. Your twelve day analogy, while being good on the melodrama side of things, includes six days of regular season tournament play (which is actually only three weekdays) in the All A classic, which is not a KHSAA event. While it sounds good to throw out that 12 day number, it is hardly factual. Before you make allegations of hypocrisy, you should have your story straight.

 

Lastly, just where does the supposed clinic have anything to do with this discussion? That (the current KFCA clinic) effects the coaches only and certainly shouldn't factor into any discussion about game times. If game times were 2-2-2, the clinic would be Thursday a.m. through game time and Friday a.m. through game time. If games times were 3-3, the clinic will likely have to be Thursday. So where is the school day difference? Don't both result in the coach(es) missing Thursday if they go, and certainly they all don't go. Net result is that its a non factor and just not a part of anything I have read or seen on here or anywhere else.

 

Maybe you and others didn't get their way on this one. Maybe I didn't get what I would have wanted either were I in a decision making mode with KHSAA. But that's no excuse in your position of influence with this site, to put out false and misleading statements simply to support your desires.

 

Wow, Thanks , I think that explains everything.:thumb:

In summary, the KY Association of Superintendents did not want to afford a second school day to make the football finals an event. It is funny how basketball is entitled to 12 school days but football is only allowed to have 1. Talk about hyprocrisy...

Not to add gasoline to your fire (Who am I kidding? Of course I'll add gasoline!) but I'll throw in even more inequities. Football remains tied with tied with volleyball and swimming and behind golf, wrestling and tennis for the number of school days allowed. Wrestling and tennis get two days each, and golf gets four days each for boys and girls (one for region, three for state). Of course you can't play golf at night, but that's still a pretty glaring imbalance.

Moving the finals to another location is for another thread. The one point I will add is it looks possible the games could end up at WKU (at least every other year) in the future. I think this is another very bad decision but I will save that for another thread.

 

Not trying to stir the pot here, but what exactly is so great about playing at PJS? Every game, save the 4A game on some years, is played in front of what basically feels like an empty stadium. WKU, by 2009, will provide a facility every bit as nice in terms of amenities, as well as a much more scaled down seating capacity, thus giving the more "full" crowd feeling to the games. Look at Div. I-AA and its decision to do the same thing by playing at Chattanooga rather than opting for a more grandiose stadium such as the Georgia Dome or so forth. Just my two cents.

Normally, I just read what's on here and decide if I agree or disagree and espouse the virtues of freedom of press and the freedom of expression. But IMO, this is about the most self serving, selfish and uninformed post you have ever made.

 

First of all, just who do you consider to be "the powers that be" as referred in the post? Is it the school coaches who serve on the Advisory Committee who voted 13-2 in November to recommend this new schedule based on what I have been told? Are you saying those "powers that be" somehow don't have football as their number one priority? Ever added up the state championship games on that committee? As I see its composition, it is extremely representative of the schools that have played in the finals, and this type of decision is one that they are tremendously informed on.

 

Or are the "powers that be", the school superintendents who at this time are fighting with the legislature to overcome the $1000 a day disparity between per pupil spending in Kentucky and the national AVERAGE? Are they not supposed to be concerned when a NEW event (the necessary use of at least two days with a new school approved alignment, not an old event that is not changing from its current format and has been in the same basic format since 1932) threatens to eliminate a day of school? Are they not supposed to be concerned when the General Assembly just approved adding two days to the calendar and compensation for teachers and a new event threatens to take away a large group of their staff for one of those days?

 

Or are the powers that be somehow the staff at the KHSAA, who has to be in the elements more than any single fan or certainly media or quasi-media type? Staff feelings haven't been expressed on this one in any account I have read, but I can't imagine them feeling like 3 games over two days being a positive thing if they were trying to do what was in their own best interest. If something was being done to be self-serving by the "powers that be" and the KHSAA staff was somehow espousing this view, wouldn't that be contradictory.

 

Or are the "powers that be" the members of the Board of Control who have to sort out the wishes of groups of coaches, principals, administrators, superintendents, fans, media and try to do what's in the best interest of the organization? Especially when the opinions of all of those groups are certainly not united and often vary in the same building depending upon whom you talk to? Wasn't there even a poll question asked on this very web site that came back with a rather split decision? Nothing like another clear mandated opinion.

 

So who are the "powers that be" that somehow miss the boat on this one or made a selfish decision or a decision that somehow benefits that group over others? That one will be an interesting answer for you to define and defend.

 

And if you are going to make comparisions to other events, how about keeping fact and fiction straight. Your twelve day analogy, while being good on the melodrama side of things, includes six days of regular season tournament play (which is actually only three weekdays) in the All A classic, which is not a KHSAA event. While it sounds good to throw out that 12 day number, it is hardly factual. Before you make allegations of hypocrisy, you should have your story straight.

 

Lastly, just where does the supposed clinic have anything to do with this discussion? That (the current KFCA clinic) effects the coaches only and certainly shouldn't factor into any discussion about game times. If game times were 2-2-2, the clinic would be Thursday a.m. through game time and Friday a.m. through game time. If games times were 3-3, the clinic will likely have to be Thursday. So where is the school day difference? Don't both result in the coach(es) missing Thursday if they go, and certainly they all don't go. Net result is that its a non factor and just not a part of anything I have read or seen on here or anywhere else.

 

Maybe you and others didn't get their way on this one. Maybe I didn't get what I would have wanted either were I in a decision making mode with KHSAA. But that's no excuse in your position of influence with this site, to put out false and misleading statements simply to support your desires.

 

Certainly you and I are going to agree to disagree on some things here.

 

As far as self serving and selfish. Yes, I would like 2, 2, and 2 but as I said in my original post, none of this is the end of the world, just a missed opportunity. I will support the football finals no matter what format you have and I can do that and share a dissenting view at the same time. And, like many people tell me privately, the pros of 2, 2, and 2 outweigh the pros of 3 and 3.

 

In this case the powers that be are the State Supers, to a lesser extent the Board of Control and yet a lesser extent the Advisory Committee. What I am saying is there isn't much separation (and therefore balance) of powers in the process. I think a much better way to do business would be for all the members of the Board of Control to be AT LARGE appointees made by the KDE.

 

One thing I do want to make clear is I am not taking issue with the KHSAA staff with this thread. My understanding, as appears to be your understanding, is if they had it "their way" 3 and 3 would not be their first choice. I do understand at least one member of the staff, Julian Tackett, presented both options at various times and I look at him as an island of reality in all of this. However, I understand the powers that be (see above) wanted 3 and 3.

 

I do agree opinions are not united and vary in the same building depending on who you talk to. I will go one step further and say that some of those same people talk out of both sides of their mouth. Privately it is 2, 2, and 2 but publicly it is "daddy" wants 3 and 3 so I am going along with 3 and 3.

 

On your missing the boat paragraph, certainly basketball is the sport that benefits 12 fold.

 

The 12 number is factual and just because something isn't a KHSAA event doesn't mean we don't count it as days a sport gets in this state that take place during the school day that the State Supers allow. I clarified this before, 6 days are from the KHSAA and 6 days are for the All A Classic. You can't complain about missing another school day on one hand and then ignore the fact that the All A Classic consumes an additional 6 school days. I was not including "six days of regular season tournament play." I do need you to clarify this point. To my point, the All A Classic runs from Wednesday January 31st to Sunday February 4th for both boys and girls which is 6 school days.

 

On the KFCA clinic, one of the issues the Supers had was replacing all the teachers that may be missing that extra day if the format was 2, 2, and 2 only they already miss it anyway which I agree makes it a non-factor which is why they need to get their story straight because there was no reason to throw this excuse up. It looks as if their mind was made up and they are throwing up "reasons" without taking the time to think them through which is scary.

 

I didn't put out any false or misleading statements. Like I said, I know we are going to agree to disagree on some things.

 

Lastly, I knew what I was getting into when I started the thread. Anytime you "threaten" the basketball establishment I realize it is open season on the one doing the talking and no attack is off limits.

This is not a football basketball issue. I believe the three day format would probably be best. Why not rotate the schedule of games from year to year. 6A should not get the show case game every year. The KHSAA is the same bunch that ignored its members in the public private issue. What makes you think they will do the right thing now?

Not trying to stir the pot here, but what exactly is so great about playing at PJS? Every game, save the 4A game on some years, is played in front of what basically feels like an empty stadium. WKU, by 2009, will provide a facility every bit as nice in terms of amenities, as well as a much more scaled down seating capacity, thus giving the more "full" crowd feeling to the games. Look at Div. I-AA and its decision to do the same thing by playing at Chattanooga rather than opting for a more grandiose stadium such as the Georgia Dome or so forth. Just my two cents.

 

Start another thread on this topic and we can bat it around.

This is not a football basketball issue. I believe the three day format would probably be best. Why not rotate the schedule of games from year to year. 6A should not get the show case game every year. The KHSAA is the same bunch that ignored its members in the public private issue. What makes you think they will do the right thing now?

 

For the record, I think the KHSAA did the right thing on the public/private issue and I commend them for standing up for what they believe in.

 

If you want to discuss this one further please make another thread in the Public/Private Forum.

 

I don't want anyone to get the wrong idea from me about the KHSAA. I am not anti-KHSAA. As a matter of fact, I think they have done a bang up job advancing football in this state recently but I just don't agree this time. Again, it is not the end the world and I will support the finals no matter the format.

When was this voted on?

Normally, I just read what's on here and decide if I agree or disagree and espouse the virtues of freedom of press and the freedom of expression. But IMO, this is about the most self serving, selfish and uninformed post you have ever made.

 

First of all, just who do you consider to be "the powers that be" as referred in the post? Is it the school coaches who serve on the Advisory Committee who voted 13-2 in November to recommend this new schedule based on what I have been told? Are you saying those "powers that be" somehow don't have football as their number one priority? Ever added up the state championship games on that committee? As I see its composition, it is extremely representative of the schools that have played in the finals, and this type of decision is one that they are tremendously informed on.

 

Or are the "powers that be", the school superintendents who at this time are fighting with the legislature to overcome the $1000 a day disparity between per pupil spending in Kentucky and the national AVERAGE? Are they not supposed to be concerned when a NEW event (the necessary use of at least two days with a new school approved alignment, not an old event that is not changing from its current format and has been in the same basic format since 1932) threatens to eliminate a day of school? Are they not supposed to be concerned when the General Assembly just approved adding two days to the calendar and compensation for teachers and a new event threatens to take away a large group of their staff for one of those days?

 

Or are the powers that be somehow the staff at the KHSAA, who has to be in the elements more than any single fan or certainly media or quasi-media type? Staff feelings haven't been expressed on this one in any account I have read, but I can't imagine them feeling like 3 games over two days being a positive thing if they were trying to do what was in their own best interest. If something was being done to be self-serving by the "powers that be" and the KHSAA staff was somehow espousing this view, wouldn't that be contradictory.

 

Or are the "powers that be" the members of the Board of Control who have to sort out the wishes of groups of coaches, principals, administrators, superintendents, fans, media and try to do what's in the best interest of the organization? Especially when the opinions of all of those groups are certainly not united and often vary in the same building depending upon whom you talk to? Wasn't there even a poll question asked on this very web site that came back with a rather split decision? Nothing like another clear mandated opinion.

 

So who are the "powers that be" that somehow miss the boat on this one or made a selfish decision or a decision that somehow benefits that group over others? That one will be an interesting answer for you to define and defend.

 

And if you are going to make comparisions to other events, how about keeping fact and fiction straight. Your twelve day analogy, while being good on the melodrama side of things, includes six days of regular season tournament play (which is actually only three weekdays) in the All A classic, which is not a KHSAA event. While it sounds good to throw out that 12 day number, it is hardly factual. Before you make allegations of hypocrisy, you should have your story straight.

 

Lastly, just where does the supposed clinic have anything to do with this discussion? That (the current KFCA clinic) effects the coaches only and certainly shouldn't factor into any discussion about game times. If game times were 2-2-2, the clinic would be Thursday a.m. through game time and Friday a.m. through game time. If games times were 3-3, the clinic will likely have to be Thursday. So where is the school day difference? Don't both result in the coach(es) missing Thursday if they go, and certainly they all don't go. Net result is that its a non factor and just not a part of anything I have read or seen on here or anywhere else.

 

Maybe you and others didn't get their way on this one. Maybe I didn't get what I would have wanted either were I in a decision making mode with KHSAA. But that's no excuse in your position of influence with this site, to put out false and misleading statements simply to support your desires.

 

Kissinger, I likewise support the 3 day concept and like the Ru, its not for selfish reasons (unless wanting to better the football championships and continue to promote the rising popularity of football in this state is selfish). I really don't understand why you thought Ru's post was self serving and selfish (pm me with your logic if you like) or even uninformed. I don't agree with some of Ru's opinions in his post, but I'm not sure I'd say its uninformed.

 

Lets address the major reasons given by those opposed to the 3 day tournament:

 

First reason: Supers didn't want the coaches to be out of school an additional day (the concern being that if there were football games played on Thursday, the football clinic would be on Wed, thus instead of the coaches being out of school just Thurs and Fri, they'd be out on Wed also). This causes the school to have to hire subs an additional day. Not only costly, but affects the quality of education. This reason is pretty easily addressed as you have acknowledged. If you play the games over three days with game times of 1 and 4, the clinic could be conducted either the mornings of Thurs and Friday or the evenings of Thurs and Fri. Thus no additional day of school missed for the coaches. And this format could actually increase the turnout for the clinic, since the coaches would not be leaving school on Thurs just for the clinic. This reason does not hold water.

 

Next reason given: Supers didn't want to have the students out of school an additional day. As has been pointed out, the KBE recently added two days to the school year and the supers were concerned that this would take one of those two days away. They did not feel it was good for education and were concerned of the message it would send to the KBE. Lets address this reason a bit. Assuming the two games on Thurs, in a 3 day format, would primarily only attract only the students of the playing schools (and I realize there may be some other school students attending, but I really don't think that would be a significant enough number of the students from schools not playing attending to base the decision on them), we are only increasing the number of days lost on 4 schools. I think its logical that the a lot of the students from the teams that win on Thurs will be at school on Friday, particularly if the administration is smart enough to schedule some type of celebratory event Friday morning. And with the games starting at 1 and 4, the last game will certainly end early enough for the students to be able to drive home Thursday night and make it to school on Friday. Rather than just summarily dismiss the 3 day tournament concept because of the lost day concern, perhaps some discussions should have been had with the KBE to see how they feel about it? To the best of my knowledge, that was not done. One thing the KBE would have been very, very concerned about (and I would have thought the supers would have too) is student and fan safety.

 

With 3 games a day, the first game starts early (which means some schools fans and students having to get a real early jump to make it to Louisville by the start of the game) and the last game ends late (which means people leaving Louisville at 10 or so and driving long distances to get home). Sure, they can get a hotel, but with the teams going home that night, you know the students will be driving home after the games. Young drivers, driving home late at night long distances in mid December weather is simply a tragic accident waiting to happen. Play the games over 3 days with start times of 1 and 4 and the travel situation is a much, much safer one for the students and the fans. I hope I'm wrong, but I don't think it will be long before we are reading about the late endings of the third games on Friday and Saturday being blamed for accidents involving students going home in bad December weather. At the end of the day, the additional lost day for the students of 4 schools is not a significant enough reason to not go with 3 days, if for no other reason than the safety factor. And has the Ru pointed out, it is somewhat hard to understand the Supers reasoning here when the Sweet 16, the All A basketball tournaments, the golf championships and perhaps other championship events all have the players and student fans missing significant number of school days. If the Supers want to place a lot of emphasis on not missing school days, these events should be addressed and revised. Cramming 10 gallons of ice cream into a 5 gallon bucket is not the way to go.

 

Next reason given: football coaches were concerned about the effect the 3 days would have on the clinic, particularly if they had the clinic now on Wed. As we've addressed, the clinic could easily be held on the mornings or evenings of Thurs and Friday. I don't think there would be any adverse effect on the clinic. Thus this given reason also does not hold water.

 

Next reason given: cost of renting the stadium a third day. Surprisingly, to the best of my knowledge, the BOC wasn't provided with any info as to the additional cost of using PJ another day. Admittedly there will surely be some additional costs. But I think we need to look at that situation and see if we'll be able to raise more revenues than expenses by going with the 3 day tournament. The football championships are attended primarily by the fans of the schools involved and the football coaches throughout the state. There is not a large segment of neutral fans that attend. Whereas, the Sweet 16 attracts a large, very large segment of fans who are there to just watch the basketball and attend the event. Football does not have any one willing to be large corporate sponsor for the championship. Whereas bball has Nat City willing to pay 6 figures to sponsor the Sweet 16 and then on its own spends more money to do its own Sweet 16 promotional event. Why the differences and what can be done to make the football championships better?

 

Obviously bball has a storied tradition and years of popularity. The Sweet 16 is a tremendous event, is very well promoted, is very fan friendly and is something fans plan on attending regardless of whether their team is in it or not. Its a mini vacation that many plan for each year. Its on their calendar to attend year in and year out. As fiduciaries of high school sports, the BOC should be thinking of what can be done to make the football championships more like the Sweet 16, not only for the kids playing but for the financial aspect. Football championship revenue pales greatly in comparison to the Sweet 16. And yes money should factor into the BOC decisions, particularly if they want to continue to be able to fund catastrophic insurance; to be able to fund in depth investigations of recruiting violations and continue to fund the many other important duties of the KHSAA.

 

The BOC should be examining what can be done to make the football championships more attractive to a big corporate sponsor. Obviously getting more fans to attend would be a big help there. Does anyone really think that having 3 games a day played in an outside venue is real attractive to the neutral fan? With the first game starting at 11 or so and the last one ending at 10, with no place really to get out of the weather unless you can afford the BW tickets, its a very long day for fans and I think will hurt not help attendance. I'm sorry folks, but with 3 games a day out in the December elements, just a little common sense should lead people to conclude that you are going to only attract the fans of the teams involved. How many all game tickets are sold to the public for the football championships compared to the Sweet 16? The answer is very, very few. And the fans of the first game are probably going to leave the place after their game is over to either meet the team when it gets home or to begin the drive home before they hit bad weather or to get out of the bad weather. And the fans of the later games are not going to get into the stadium and out into bad weather any earlier than is absolutely necessary. Bottom line the football championships is not attractive to corporate sponsors because it is not well attended, has no pizass to it and has very little marketing opportunity other than ads on the big screen tv. Nat City pays sponsorship fees in the six figures for the Sweet 16 and pays for additional promotional activities at its own cost because the Sweet 16 is a very popular event and is well attended. The fact that we don't get a corporate sponsor willing to pay anything close to what Nat City does should be all the proof a reasonable person needs to conclude that the football championships need to be critically examined to see what can be done to make it more attractive to neutral fans. Heck, the only fan friendly thing associated with the football championships that I've ever heard discussed is the seats at PJ have backs! That also should tell us something right there.

 

Having heated areas that fans could get out of the weather between games would help. Putting some special events and activities before and between games would help. And having only two games a day would help make it more fan friendly. You and I both know the KHSAA staff doesn't like being out in the weather for three games in a day and we both know that the covering media has expressed its displeasure with three games a day. And those folks are getting paid to be at the games. So it should be much of a stretch to conclude that three games a day in December weather is not fan friendly. As to the point raised by some that having the games played over three days would discourage fans from attending because they would need to miss another day of work and would need to pay for another night of lodging and day of meals, I simply point to the Sweet 16 as my proof that people are willing to spend the money to attend high school sporting events if we make it conducive for them to do so and we give them an event worth spending their money on. At the end of the day, I believe that if we spread it out over three days, we put up heated tents that fans can use for free during the day, we allow a corporate sponsor to use those tents to market itself, we create events before and between the games that are fun, we create events during the evenings that are open to the fans for free or at a minimal cost to fans, then we will attract lot more fans and will then attract more big corporate sponsors. Three games in one day does not allow for enough time in the day to do a lot of those things. Two games a day definitely does. I fully believe that if we were to do those extra promotional things, the extra revenues would more than cover the additional cost of a third day's use of PJ. Thus, I believe this reason is not a valid one.

 

The next and last reason given by the coaches advisory committee is a valid one however. Its the loss of a day of preparation for the 4 teams that would play on Thursday. For what will likely be the biggest day in the high school football careers of a lot of players and coaches, this loss of a prep day cannot be easily dismissed. While I understand that it would affect all the teams playing equally (assuming of course the KHSAA would ban the semi final games from being paid on Saturday-sorry CovCath fans), I still think this is a valid reason for the coaches for being in favor of the games being just on Friday and Saturday. Is it valid enough of a reason to not have a three day championship and incur all the good for high school football that I believe would result therefrom? Perhaps not, but the loss of a day of preparation is at least a valid reason for the coaches to be opposed to it.

 

Thus at the end of the day, most of the reasons given in opposition to a three day championship do not in my opinion withstand the light of day. Only the loss of a prep day is a valid concern. And I'm not sure it is enough of a reason to not go to a three day tournament. Actually I don't think it is.

Leatherneck, great well thought out post. You or the Guru should foward this to the KHSAA, and request a response. I would add my thoughts to it, but I think you covered everything. GOOD JOB.

Leatherneck, great well thought out post. You or the Guru should foward this to the KHSAA, and request a response. I would add my thoughts to it, but I think you covered everything. GOOD JOB.

 

 

Thanks Ram. While the KHSAA is the body that ultimately chose the 2 day format, I really think it is the superintendants and coaches that need to be convinced that the 3 day format is best for high school football in the long run and that the 3 day format won't hurt academics or the finances of either the schools or the KHSAA. The BOC tends to want to follow the desires of the schools (and some would argue that they should) and will generally do so except on critical issues where the BOC thinks the desires of the schools are not in the overall best interests of high school athletics (which was the correct reasoning for the BOC not following the vote of the delegates on the public private split). On less critical issues like the championship format, the BOC will follow the desires of the schools. With the supers and the head coaches wanting the 2 day format, it was a foregone conclusion that the BOC was going to go with the 2 day format. Thus if people agree with my reasoning in my prior post, they are going to have to call their supers and head coaches and ask them to reconsider their opposition to the 3 day format. Its obviously too late to do anything about the 07 championships, but perhaps they'll reconsider for future years. Given the status of the KDE (an interim Secretary), hopefully when a new Secretary is hired the KHSAA and the Supers Association can get some feed back as to how the KDE would feel about a 3 day championship. If the KDE would be okay with it, perhaps the Supers would go along with it.

 

Ultimately, if my reasoning for a 3 day championship is correct, it would help the finances of the schools and the KHSAA. If the KHSAA can increase the profitability of the football championships, it reduces the chances of the KHSAA needing to increase the membership fees charged to the schools or reduce its programs or the amount of catastrophic insurance provided to the athletes (which should be of extreme importance to the supers and the head coaches). I just see the 3 day format as being a win win win for the schools, the KHSAA and high school football. As Ru mentioned in his original post, this issue is not something that is going to really hurt high school football (like the public private split would have), but it would have helped it if they had gone to the 3 day format. I also think it would have made travel to and from the championships much more safer for the fans and the students and that issue was not considered enough by the supers.