So then, If I believe that JC will act as the hound of heaven and will forgive infinitely, AS HE TOLD PETER to do, then I am editing God's message?

 

Am I editing his message when I choose NOT to point out someone else's sin b/c JC tells me not to in him messages on judgment and casting the first stone.

 

I might be like Paul and try to hold my christian brothers accountable - if they have asked, but according to the message I read, it is not my job to point out the sin of others. A loving rebuke is different than a condemning threat.

 

Lets take the Celebrity Elton John for example. I don't know him from Adam so it would not be beneficial (spiritually) for me to tell him from a pulpit or anywhere that he is going to hell as a result of him homosexuality. I don't even see JC or Paul or Mark or John or anyone saying that in the Bible. If I had a relationship with him however, I could talk about the wonderfullness of JC and God and then let the HOLY SPIRIT convict - according the word I read, it is the HOLY SPIRIT that convicts not any person.

 

Is all this editing, or is it simply how I read the scripture through JC and what the Holy Spirit has revealed it to me?

From Christ's own words....

 

Matthew 10:33-35 (New International Version)

New International Version (NIV)

Copyright © 1973, 1978, 1984 by International Bible Society

 

33But whoever disowns me before men, I will disown him before my Father in heaven.

 

34"Do not suppose that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I did not come to bring peace, but a sword. 35For I have come to turn

" 'a man against his father,

a daughter against her mother,

a daughter-in-law against her motherinlaw

 

Jesus himself said he did not come to bring peace. There are either two choices. For him or against him. Should we be willing to accept any and all that want to live their life for Christ, yes. But should we water down his expectations, so that we can accept all? I think not.

 

Jesus does not leave it any other place. There is no room in Jesus family for middle of the road or riding the fence or fitting him in when your schedule allows.

 

And for me, I fail in this so many times it makes me embarrassed.

Well.......which one was not?

 

Remember the Sabbath and keep it holy.

Remember the Sabbath and keep it holy.

thank you. Although didn't he mention that one when the Pharisees questioned about his disciples picking things out of a field to eat?

From Christ's own words....

 

Matthew 10:33-35 (New International Version)

New International Version (NIV)

Copyright © 1973, 1978, 1984 by International Bible Society

 

33But whoever disowns me before men, I will disown him before my Father in heaven.

 

34"Do not suppose that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I did not come to bring peace, but a sword. 35For I have come to turn

" 'a man against his father,

a daughter against her mother,

a daughter-in-law against her motherinlaw

 

Jesus himself said he did not come to bring peace. There are either two choices. For him or against him. Should we be willing to accept any and all that want to live their life for Christ, yes. But should we water down his expectations, so that we can accept all? I think not.

 

Jesus does not leave it any other place. There is no room in Jesus family for middle of the road or riding the fence or fitting him in when your schedule allows.

 

And for me, I fail in this so many times it makes me embarrassed.

 

In your own words, JESUS DID IT. The holy spirit convicts not "man." It is not my job to convict anyone but to SPREAD THE GOOD NEWS Jesus accepted everybody btw. He did not say go get sinless and then come to me, he said come to me. You still have not told me what I edited in my message, what did I leave out? Do YOU convict people of their sin, or does JC/Holy Spirit. By convict I do not mean immediately send them to hell but to make them aware of what they are doing so that they can have a choice to repent.

 

Where does JC tell us to go to the mountain tops and PREACH that Homosexuality is wrong? NOWHERE. JC exhorts us to take the GOOD NEWS OF GOD'S GRACE TO THE ENDS OF THE WORLD. He expressly forbids us to judge others.

In your own words, JESUS DID IT. The holy spirit convicts not "man." It is not my job to convict anyone but to SPREAD THE GOOD NEWS Jesus accepted everybody btw. He did not say go get sinless and then come to me, he said come to me. You still have not told me what I edited in my message, what did I leave out? Do YOU convict people of their sin, or does JC/Holy Spirit. By convict I do not mean immediately send them to hell but to make them aware of what they are doing so that they can have a choice to repent.

 

Where does JC tell us to go to the mountain tops and PREACH that Homosexuality is wrong? NOWHERE. JC exhorts us to take the GOOD NEWS OF GOD'S GRACE TO THE ENDS OF THE WORLD. He expressly forbids us to judge others.

Where does he expressly forbid this? I know he says do not judge lest you be judge the same way. Not expressly forbidding but a dire warning about it.

 

I say that you have to teach the full message. Absolutely what you are saying but also the negatives. But the message, like Joel Olsteen preaches, where he says he will not talk/teach about sin and the consequences of sin is only preaching half the message.

 

As a parent, would you tell your children to behave because you love them. And they do something wrong and you tell them you love them more. Would you ever get to the point that you would teach them that their actions is unacceptable and if they continue with them, they will have a punishment?

 

If you would, what is the difference in telling a person sinning and that continually sins, I love you but I don't condone your lifestyle. I will always love you and Jesus will always love you but you aren't promise tomorrow and unless you repent and strive to live as a follower of Jesus, than you endanger where you will be for eternity. I don't make the call but this is what the Bible says about the call.

 

I think some people have a hard time with the harshness of the Bible and since they can't argue with the author about it, they attack the Christians about it. This is NOT MY RELIGION. This is what it says in the Bible. You continue a life of sin and you RUN THE RISK of Jesus saying at the end of time, that he does not know you. And we will reply, "But Jesus, I did this for you and that for you." And he replies, I never truly knew you.

 

Notice I didn't just lamblast homosexuals, but sin. There is sin in my life that I FIGHT ON A DAILY BASIS. And if I don't get a handle on that sin, repent and run from it, I know I run the risk of having the same thing done to me.

 

I don't sit in some ivory throne and throw down judgment but sit here and say I sin and struggle with it, too. Let's both beat this sin together.

In your own words, JESUS DID IT. The holy spirit convicts not "man." It is not my job to convict anyone but to SPREAD THE GOOD NEWS Jesus accepted everybody btw. He did not say go get sinless and then come to me, he said come to me. You still have not told me what I edited in my message, what did I leave out? Do YOU convict people of their sin, or does JC/Holy Spirit. By convict I do not mean immediately send them to hell but to make them aware of what they are doing so that they can have a choice to repent.

 

Where does JC tell us to go to the mountain tops and PREACH that Homosexuality is wrong? NOWHERE. JC exhorts us to take the GOOD NEWS OF GOD'S GRACE TO THE ENDS OF THE WORLD. He expressly forbids us to judge others.

I am able to send a message to my children that I love them while at the same time discipline them. Yet, it seems that adults cannot handle a message that says I love you but don't condone your actions. Why can't they be done at the same time?

 

I think it comes from two points: 1)One in our country's mindset, we should be allowed to do whatever we want to do whenever we want to do it however we want to do it; 2)if you don't like my lifestyle, then I might be wrong and I can't handle being wrong.

 

And I know it goes both ways. I could be wrong and the Bible is a fictional book that means diddly and squat. But I do not believe that and have faith that it is not. And if I believe it is not, I have to act on what it says even if that means standing in the face of the rights/liberties/freedoms of this country.

Great debate ace, I LOVE it when people challenge me to examine my faith and either redesign it or stand firmer in it. Gotta go to bball practice so I will catch you tomorrow.

Acemona, I am not sure why it jumps out at me but I notice that in your posts you continue to refer to Christ as "JC" instead of Jesus Christ. Can I ask why that is? I am quite comfortable in my relationship with Christ but I feel we should be more reverent. I personally cant refer to Him so casually. He and I have a close relationship, striving to be closer I might add, but I dont feel right about being so chummy.

about judging..."Do not judge lest ye be judged" .

The fruits of the Spirit: "By their fruits you will recognize them"

 

I once heard a pastor say "you may not judge, but you can be a fruit inspector".

I am able to send a message to my children that I love them while at the same time discipline them. Yet, it seems that adults cannot handle a message that says I love you but don't condone your actions. Why can't they be done at the same time?

 

I think it comes from two points: 1)One in our country's mindset, we should be allowed to do whatever we want to do whenever we want to do it however we want to do it; 2)if you don't like my lifestyle, then I might be wrong and I can't handle being wrong.

 

And I know it goes both ways. I could be wrong and the Bible is a fictional book that means diddly and squat. But I do not believe that and have faith that it is not. And if I believe it is not, I have to act on what it says even if that means standing in the face of the rights/liberties/freedoms of this country.

 

At what point will you turn your back on your children and send them to hell? That is what you are assigning to Jesus/God/Holy Spirit. That at some point Jesus will reject his teaching to Peter and quit forgiving. Was Jesus' instructions to Peter meant just for Peter and they did not apply to Jesus himself?

 

You are allowed to do whatever you wish - the Bible even says it, "Everything is permissable, but not everything is beneficial." I think you show a better WAY by how you live, not by condemning the way someone else lives.

Where does he expressly forbid this? I know he says do not judge lest you be judge the same way. Not expressly forbidding but a dire warning about it.

 

I say that you have to teach the full message. Absolutely what you are saying but also the negatives. But the message, like Joel Olsteen preaches, where he says he will not talk/teach about sin and the consequences of sin is only preaching half the message.

 

As a parent, would you tell your children to behave because you love them. And they do something wrong and you tell them you love them more. Would you ever get to the point that you would teach them that their actions is unacceptable and if they continue with them, they will have a punishment?

 

If you would, what is the difference in telling a person sinning and that continually sins, I love you but I don't condone your lifestyle. I will always love you and Jesus will always love you but you aren't promise tomorrow and unless you repent and strive to live as a follower of Jesus, than you endanger where you will be for eternity. I don't make the call but this is what the Bible says about the call.

 

I think some people have a hard time with the harshness of the Bible and since they can't argue with the author about it, they attack the Christians about it. This is NOT MY RELIGION. This is what it says in the Bible. You continue a life of sin and you RUN THE RISK of Jesus saying at the end of time, that he does not know you. And we will reply, "But Jesus, I did this for you and that for you." And he replies, I never truly knew you.

 

Notice I didn't just lamblast homosexuals, but sin. There is sin in my life that I FIGHT ON A DAILY BASIS. And if I don't get a handle on that sin, repent and run from it, I know I run the risk of having the same thing done to me.

 

I don't sit in some ivory throne and throw down judgment but sit here and say I sin and struggle with it, too. Let's both beat this sin together.

 

The Question is ultimately - "how can you judget the heart of any sinner, homosexual or otherwise." How do you know that Elton John does not have a relationship with the Risen Savior? You can't know that, and yet you would say that he has not repented and is going to hell b/c he continues practicing homosexuality and outwardly. I envy every day, am I going to hell. My son a 9 year old is selfish every day - is he going to hell? Elton John is Gay - every day, of course he is going to hell (irony).

 

GODS LOVE IS UNCONDITIONAL "IN THAT WHILE YOU WERE YET A SINNER I LOVED YOU"

 

Our love should be unconditional as well.

Acemona, I am not sure why it jumps out at me but I notice that in your posts you continue to refer to Christ as "JC" instead of Jesus Christ. Can I ask why that is? I am quite comfortable in my relationship with Christ but I feel we should be more reverent. I personally cant refer to Him so casually. He and I have a close relationship, striving to be closer I might add, but I dont feel right about being so chummy.

 

 

I can't answer for Acemona but it's probably just "shorthand."

 

I usually type X for Christ because that was Seminary shorthand.

Ace...Every I mean Every knee will bow, and every tongue will confess Jesus is Lord. Jesus is our judge and will a Gay person be judged just like me I'm sure he will. I'll never say if a person will not go to heaven or not, thats not our call, but I'll gladly show you scripture that deals with a Gay person. Hates the Sin...Loves the Sinner.

The Scripture says it is the LOVE of money and not just money/wealth that is the source of all evil.

 

I would encourage our government to encourage, reward, etc, people who want to share their wealth.

 

 

I've liked your responses LBC. :thumb:

 

The one above is true but Jesus also said: "It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of heaven." Given that image the LOVE of money is big but this verse seems to go even beyond that.

I've liked your responses LBC. :thumb:

 

The one above is true but Jesus also said: "It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of heaven." Given that image the LOVE of money is big but this verse seems to go even beyond that.

Not sure what is going on with BGP or the Internet but you responded at 9:53 to the post that is listed as being posted as 10:26 even though it is only 10:10. You are responding to posts that haven't been posted. You are scaring me Hatz.