Numbers is the 20's for football is not enough to compete. I agree though anytime you get 20 kids involved in a sport it is a good thing.

 

There have been many programs that play a similar schedule to Brossart have winning seasons with player numbers in the twenties.

There have been many programs that play a similar schedule to Brossart have winning seasons with player numbers in the twenties.

 

I would guess that while this statement is true, those schools did not have 3-4 quality HS programs within a 10 mile area like Brossart does to compete with either.

I would guess that while this statement is true, those schools did not have 3-4 quality HS programs within a 10 mile area like Brossart does to compete with either.

 

But I'm guessing that if they are 2A, then their boy's count warrants that class. That means that they should have the potential to pull more boys as time goes on. They need to develop the talent they have, starting with the young ages. Then they can start to "draw" kids that way. It won't be tomorrow!

 

Also, just like many schools, Brossart is a school where generations of families follow each other. Meaning you have a lot of kids whose parents and grandparents went to Brossart. That means any generation, other than the current one, went to Brossart without a football program. That means that they aren't football families or understand the good things (that us others do) that go along with a football program. Many of the goods things have been spoken on this thread and many other threads considering eliminating football. If you're not a football family, then you don't see things the way others do. I know that sounds silly, but a lot of the kids are brought up without football. Anyway, that's going to take time. I don't think giving up now would be a fair effort to the current players and the players that laid the foundation...whether they won or not.

I would guess that while this statement is true, those schools did not have 3-4 quality HS programs within a 10 mile area like Brossart does to compete with either.

 

Are you talking about competing for athletes??? Thats the first time I have ever heard that from a private school.

Are you talking about competing for athletes??? Thats the first time I have ever heard that from a private school.

 

Brossart competes with Campbell County, NewCath and sometimes Highlands for students whether they are athletes or not. On a rare occasion, some from Brossart feeder schools even go to CovCath/Notre Dame.

I don't think Brossart is anywhere near giving up on football. It's still in its infant stages there, imo. I would certainly hope the administration looks at other factors like a new coaching staff before they decide to scratch the whole program! It's going to take awhile and moving to 2A didn't help matters. Keep your heads up, boys! Good things will come in time!

I think it has been 6 or 7 years, how much time do you need.

Painful, painful loss for the Mustangs tonight.

 

As far as shutting things down, that is not likely to happen, BUT a 24 point loss to Dayton does not lend a lot of encouragment with a full-fledged 2-A schedule looming.

 

The Mustangs failed to punch it in from the two with time expiring in the first half, could have made it an 18-13 game at halftime with Brossart getting the ball to start the second half. Also had one called back in the first half, as did Dayton, but Dayton went on to score anyway. We didn't.

 

Pelgen was intercepted on first play from scrimmage in second half, and after scoring on that series and the next, the rout was on.

 

I feel bad for our kids and coaches who are passionate about football, and are committed to the program. The problem is - there are simply not enough of them. Catch 22. We don't win so the kids don't come back. The kids don't come back so we don't win. At present we have a thriving junior high (Colts) program. IF these kids will stick with it and provide the nucleus of a competitive varstiy football program, then we might be off and running after a slow start. IF the junior high kids don't persevere and we end up with 20 upperclassmen in uniforms like this year, then we probably need to take a serious look at the future of Brossart Football.

The one major caveat in starting football was that it had to be beneficial to us and not be an embarrassment or it would work against us. The kids we were losing to Campbell County football and NewCath football, for the most part are still going to Campbell and NCC for football. What we have learned is that football is hard, and it takes a lot of somewhat talented players to be successful. The KHSAA did us no favors by sending us to 2-A at this time in our development. Add it all up and it equates to a struggling football program.

 

Hopefully, better times are ahead!

 

I realize that you know this, but for those that might not be as informed and to eliminate misunderstandings: The KHSAA put Brossart in 2A because that was the class that Brossart's reported numbers called for it to be in. I realize that the admin at Brossart felt that enrollment was going to quickly be shrinking, but if we made our decisions on what we were told by school administrators was going to happen, we'd have all kinds of changes all the time. I realize Brossart was just starting it's football program, but the KHSAA rules do not allow such to factor in what class schools are placed. In other words: the KHSAA was not permitted to do Brossart any "favors". Looking back, perhaps Brossart should have chosen to not participate in district play for several years until it got its football program on a stronger foundation.

 

The good news is that since this year ends the first two year period of the 4 year class term, if Brossart's male enrollment has shrunk appreciably (I want to remember that we used a 16% number as the basis for making a class change in mid term) you can ask the KHSAA to move you down to single A for the remaining two years.

 

Do you feel that moving down to A will help Brossart's program?

Brossart competes with Campbell County, NewCath and sometimes Highlands for students whether they are athletes or not. On a rare occasion, some from Brossart feeder schools even go to CovCath/Notre Dame.

 

Isn't that part of being a private institution? Brossart has the advantage of being able to get anyone from anywhere that wants to pay the tuition and attend the school.

To move back down to class A, wouldn't Brossart's enrollment need to fall below one of the existing A schools? I think, with the 6 class system, the top 32 enrollment schools make up 6A and the bottom 32 enrollment schools make up 1A. So if this is the case, Brossart would need to be switching with a current 1A school. Has the next classification alignment been announced?

 

RCC9 brings up a great point regarding "football tradition". Although Brossart has a good athletic reputation in other sports, they have no history whatsoever in football and have been trying to survive by teaching good athletes to play football. I imagine that is how most programs start, but that will take quite some time to develop a winning program. Most of the kids playing at the local 1A schools, Dayton, Bellevue, Beechwood and Ludlow have all been playing football for 8 years or more and that makes a huge difference. The have a solid nucleus of kids that "know" the game and provide a solid foundation for success. As with all 1A schools, that talent pool will ebb and flow throughout the years, but they all have a solid foundation.

 

The AA schools like NCC, Lloyd and Newport have a rich history of winning and Holy Cross has made big strides rather quickly using their method of attracting athletes from outside their traditional footbprint to build their program. Brossart has the Jr. High program in place to start that process but to say it is "Thriving" would be an exaggeration. It may take Brossart a full generation or more to bring their football program to par with other schools their size.

 

With that said, what benefit is there to shutting down the program? If they have 20 kids in the school that want to play, why not have the program? I'm not sure how the program is an embarrassment if it provides opportunities for student athletes. If you have inexperienced freshman and sophomores starting varsity games against more bigger, stronger, more exprerienced teams, that may be a problem also. I don't know that to be the case but with so few players, I'm sure that is a challange as well. The possibility of getting injured could be an argument for athletes from other sports to stay away from the program. I know that the Mustangs had pretty good support from parents and classmates in the first couple years. Is that still the case? Are they drawing good crowds and have the support of the student body on Friday nights?

There are no thoughts of shutting down the football program. All conjecture voiced on this thread, including my own, are strictly observations and mere speculation.

 

Fledgling football programs are supposed to grow and improve. My point (and others) is that we seem to be unable to keep players in the program. We've been doing this now since 2006 and aren't progressing on a year-to-year basis. This is no knock on our players or coaches, but an effort to identify what it is going to take to make us competitive on a year-in/year out basis. The numbers are good in the Junior High program, and IF we can keep those kids coming back, while progressively growing stronger and adding to their ranks, we might be getting to where we need to go to stabilize the program. Those programs who are competing in the upper classes and doing just fine with only 20 players are probably the only football option in town, and probably don't share athletes with highly successful soccer and basketball programs, let alone other schools.

 

OK, being placed in 2-A by the KHSAA is an unfortunate circumstance. Yes, being in 1-A would have been highly beneficial, because we were showing signs of being able to compete with the 1-A schools outside of Beechwood, where we could have carved out a nice niche, sporting a winning record, and perhaps going deep in the playoffs on an annual basis. This would have provided the "not-quite-ready-for-prime time" players going to Campbell and NCC an option to actually play on a winning football team and we wouldn't be in direct competition with NCC. We could have been apples and oranges.

 

Our other option is to simply get better. We have 61 freshmen boys this year at Brossart which might not bode well for a drop back to 1-A. In that case it becomes imparative that we keep and develop each and every player who comes into our program. This takes us back to the Catch 22. How are we going to keep players in the program if we don't win, and if we don't win how can we be expected to keep kids in the program? That is the crux of this entire discussion.

To move back down to class A, wouldn't Brossart's enrollment need to fall below one of the existing A schools? I think, with the 6 class system, the top 32 enrollment schools make up 6A and the bottom 32 enrollment schools make up 1A. So if this is the case, Brossart would need to be switching with a current 1A school. Has the next classification alignment been announced?

 

RCC9 brings up a great point regarding "football tradition". Although Brossart has a good athletic reputation in other sports, they have no history whatsoever in football and have been trying to survive by teaching good athletes to play football. I imagine that is how most programs start, but that will take quite some time to develop a winning program. Most of the kids playing at the local 1A schools, Dayton, Bellevue, Beechwood and Ludlow have all been playing football for 8 years or more and that makes a huge difference. The have a solid nucleus of kids that "know" the game and provide a solid foundation for success. As with all 1A schools, that talent pool will ebb and flow throughout the years, but they all have a solid foundation.

 

The AA schools like NCC, Lloyd and Newport have a rich history of winning and Holy Cross has made big strides rather quickly using their method of attracting athletes from outside their traditional footbprint to build their program. Brossart has the Jr. High program in place to start that process but to say it is "Thriving" would be an exaggeration. It may take Brossart a full generation or more to bring their football program to par with other schools their size.

 

With that said, what benefit is there to shutting down the program? If they have 20 kids in the school that want to play, why not have the program? I'm not sure how the program is an embarrassment if it provides opportunities for student athletes. If you have inexperienced freshman and sophomores starting varsity games against more bigger, stronger, more exprerienced teams, that may be a problem also. I don't know that to be the case but with so few players, I'm sure that is a challange as well. The possibility of getting injured could be an argument for athletes from other sports to stay away from the program. I know that the Mustangs had pretty good support from parents and classmates in the first couple years. Is that still the case? Are they drawing good crowds and have the support of the student body on Friday nights?

I know of several sophomores who are good athletes and played a lot last year as freshmen but quite this year for exactly the reason you mention. They were giving up too much experience and size, are better at other sports, and said they were concerned with getting injured in football and messing up their primary sports. You can't have freshman playing againest upper classmen and expect them to keep on taking a beating. They need to find some way to increase their numbers of upperclassmen to allow younger players ro get assimlated into the program before being thrown to the wolves.