It depends on the coaches a lot of the time. The successful programs I've been around are the coaches that kids want to play for. Those coaches take the time to build relationships to get kids out of the hallways. If the coach has an ego and isn't going to go out and get them then the program usually isn't very good unless it's a traditional power like Highlands, Trinity etc where the tradition gets the kids out.

But who does that tradition originate with? The parents.

I think a lot of the problem is that kids have no fear in schools anymore because teachers/administrators have their hands tied a lot. Kids at a young age lose respect for authority. A lot of that went out the window when there were no more paddelings in school. Teachers now have to spend 80% of their time dealing with 20% of the same kids over and over that are discipline problems. Schools can't paddle, get rid of the kids etc. If they are gone from school then the school loses money etc.

While you may have a point, I would say that it's really not the responsibility of the teachers/administrators to instill discipline, it's the parents' responsibility to do this. If there is a lack of respect for authority in this country, then it's due to issues in the home and not in the school.

 

Secondly, we have completely dumbed our society down, beginning with education. This is probably a continuation of the first complaint. No one should be smarter or succeed in the classroom because it may make little Johnny feel bad about himself. They don't want to keep score in games because no one loses, everyones a winner!? Let's get real! There is always a winner and a loser in the real world. The quicker we all learn that the better. It might actually motivate some to get off their rear and be competitive and productive instead of being in therapy because they didn't get a promotion or the job.

 

I don't think this country suffers from a lack of competitiveness. I think it's more a matter of priorities and what we choose to be competitive about. Let's face it, there are A TON of people in this country (kids and adults) who are super-competitive about things like being popular or being successful athletically; however, there is a comparative lack of people who exhibit such a level of competitiveness over academic pursuits, unlike some other countries/cultures.

 

If this country wasn't "selectively super-competitive," we would not be doing nearly as well in the Olympics (a perceived high priority by Americans) as we do, while at the same time finishing near the bottom in mathematics/science education (a perceived low priority by Americans) among developed countries.

The entire idea that no one should fail is a concept that deserves mentioning in this thread.

No Child Left Behind

The ___ Billion Dollar Bail Out

The Welfare System - in its current state of operation.

 

There are too many ways for people to be unproductive and still function comfortably within our society.

I think public assistance, though meant to help out temporarialy, has become a way of life for generations of some people. Too many welfare moms having baby after baby and getting a better check with each one. Too many lazy young men with "bad backs", working hard for that disability check.

 

We, as a nation do not do enough to help out those struggling to work yet not making ends meet. Too busy supporting those who do not try at all.

I think public assistance, though meant to help out temporarialy, has become a way of life for generations of some people. Too many welfare moms having baby after baby and getting a better check with each one. Too many lazy young men with "bad backs", working hard for that disability check.

 

We, as a nation do not do enough to help out those struggling to work yet not making ends meet. Too busy supporting those who do not try at all.

 

Amen and Amen.

I think public assistance, though meant to help out temporarialy, has become a way of life for generations of some people. Too many welfare moms having baby after baby and getting a better check with each one. Too many lazy young men with "bad backs", working hard for that disability check.

 

We, as a nation do not do enough to help out those struggling to work yet not making ends meet. Too busy supporting those who do not try at all.

 

 

 

Tell me how much money a mom gets with each baby she has on welfare, do you even know, or do you assume that it is enough to live on? Nice talking points, and do you even know what very, very small, almost infitesimally small amount of the federal government is spent of welfare, WIC, Foodstamps, etc. It is crazy small. Do you have any idea of what the average stay is of someone getting foodstamps or recieving WIC... or do you just repeat talking points because it is easy.

 

http://www.urban.org/publications/900288.html

 

http://violettespage.com/welfare.shtml#2

 

http://www.library.arizona.edu/exhibits/udall/welfare.pdf

Edited August 28, 200917 yr by acemona

Tell me how much money a mom gets with each baby she has on welfare, do you even know, or do you assume that it is enough to live on? Nice talking points, and do you even know what very, very small, almost infitesimally small amount of the federal government is spent of welfare, WIC, Foodstamps, etc. It is crazy small. Do you have any idea of what the average stay is of someone getting foodstamps or recieving WIC... or do you just repeat talking points because it is easy.

 

I don't care how small of a percentage it is, that doesn't make it okay.....I mean, if I walked into a gas station and put a pack of gum in my pocket and walked out, do you realize how small of a percentage of their total inventory that is? Does that make it right?

Don't get me wrong guys I'm with you 100% that it all starts at home. The problem is that a lot of kids don't have it at home. School is the strongest outlet to reach out to the kids that don't get it at home but the schools now have their hands tied.

I can't say enough how important sports/after school programs are for kids. My sister is the head of the 21st century grant program at school close by. I wish I had the stats I saw that support this program. If I can get it I'll post them. It is unreal the numbers of kids that are involved in after school activites vs those that aren't.

Tell me how much money a mom gets with each baby she has on welfare, do you even know, or do you assume that it is enough to live on? Nice talking points, and do you even know what very, very small, almost infitesimally small amount of the federal government is spent of welfare, WIC, Foodstamps, etc. It is crazy small. Do you have any idea of what the average stay is of someone getting foodstamps or recieving WIC... or do you just repeat talking points because it is easy.

 

http://www.urban.org/publications/900288.html

 

http://violettespage.com/welfare.shtml#2

 

http://www.library.arizona.edu/exhibits/udall/welfare.pdf

 

I know that enough under-informed moms in my area of the world have additional kids to get the additional money.

 

I know that at the local school there are kids who are enrolled for 1 day so that the parents can get a higher amount on their check.

 

I know that the system is broken. The system enables people who are lazy to continue to be lazy and have little accountability. (There are other words that can be inserted in place of the word lazy in that sentence)

 

Now I also know that politicians waste more money than anyone around - especially when they get to vote for their own raises and retirement packages, but that's a different thread.

What exactly are we measuring? Contributions to society? How much they "cost" us taxpayers?

 

:thumb: Now you're getting it.

I think public assistance, though meant to help out temporarialy, has become a way of life for generations of some people. Too many welfare moms having baby after baby and getting a better check with each one. Too many lazy young men with "bad backs", working hard for that disability check.

 

We, as a nation do not do enough to help out those struggling to work yet not making ends meet. Too busy supporting those who do not try at all.

 

Exactly. :thumb:

It depends on the coaches a lot of the time. The successful programs I've been around are the coaches that kids want to play for. Those coaches take the time to build relationships to get kids out of the hallways. If the coach has an ego and isn't going to go out and get them then the program usually isn't very good unless it's a traditional power like Highlands, Trinity etc where the tradition gets the kids out.

 

True, the coaches are a large part of a program being successful. However, I would also argue that students at schools like Highlands, Trinity, etc… also have a lot of parental involvement.

 

Tell me how much money a mom gets with each baby she has on welfare, do you even know, or do you assume that it is enough to live on? Nice talking points, and do you even know what very, very small, almost infitesimally small amount of the federal government is spent of welfare, WIC, Foodstamps, etc. It is crazy small. Do you have any idea of what the average stay is of someone getting foodstamps or recieving WIC... or do you just repeat talking points because it is easy.

 

I’m not attacking single moms or anything close. What I am saying is that the cycle starts with personal responsibility and the family environment. Often the lack of responsibility by the parents just continues the cycle and breeds abuse. It takes two to tango, but it is usually the young father, I use that word loosely, who abandons the relationship. Again, it takes two though.

Don't get me wrong guys I'm with you 100% that it all starts at home. The problem is that a lot of kids don't have it at home. School is the strongest outlet to reach out to the kids that don't get it at home but the schools now have their hands tied.

I can't say enough how important sports/after school programs are for kids. My sister is the head of the 21st century grant program at school close by. I wish I had the stats I saw that support this program. If I can get it I'll post them. It is unreal the numbers of kids that are involved in after school activites vs those that aren't.

 

And that is my primary point. It all starts at home or the lack there of. We can continue to fight the symptoms, but until we fight the disease we are just going in circles.

I think a lot of the problem is that kids have no fear in schools anymore because teachers/administrators have their hands tied a lot. Kids at a young age lose respect for authority. A lot of that went out the window when there were no more paddelings in school. Teachers now have to spend 80% of their time dealing with 20% of the same kids over and over that are discipline problems. Schools can't paddle, get rid of the kids etc. If they are gone from school then the school loses money etc.

 

 

This is true. I’m not sure that I’m 100% behind paddling in schools, but I do believe that teachers have their hands tied when it comes to discipline and if parents were doing their jobs, I’ll bet many of the discipline problems in the schools would go away. Even when teachers do discipline children the parents often complain to the principle that little Johnny is being picked on because Johnny comes home and gives his side of the story that of course usually starts with “it’s not my fault”. Of course there are some abusive teachers that should not be in the classroom and the more we see news stories about a few “bad” teachers the more all teachers suffer. The bottom line is that if children were taught discipline at home we wouldn’t have nearly the issues we have at school.