May 13, 200917 yr Even though I am a Dukie, Mike Dunleavy is awful and he compounds the situation by being a gm. Stan Van Gundy is really bad as well. Granted Dwight Howard made the first free throw and missed the second on purpose, but even Phil Jackson took Shaq out of the game in those situations. You are down 3, is Howard going to shoot the 3 for you too? Wait, you don't even run your offense through him so when you need 3 points, you have him on the court so he can get fouled when he happens to be one of the worse free throw shooters in the NBA? Yep, Stan Van Gundy is awful.
May 13, 200917 yr I think Doc Rivers may possibly be the worst NBA Coach in the game today. In ten seasons as a head coach, Rivers has finished no higher than 8 games above .500 (outside of the past two). He is 273-312 as a head coach (taking away the last two seasons). Without having Kevin Garnett, Ray Allen, Paul Pierce, and Rajon Rondo, he has done absolutely nothing. He has missed the playoffs four times as a head coach, and even with the championship last season, he is a combined 24-24 in the playoffs. Even with last seasons all-star team, he lost ten playoff games. He had only won 8 playoff games in the last nine seasons before winning 16 last year. Quite honestly, you give someone else this talent (Vinny from Chicago, or a multitude of college coaches) and these have no problem winning. Who else is considered as bad or worse than Rivers? Phil Jackson wouldn't be much without Jordan, Pippen, Kobe or Shaq. Red Auerbach wouldn't be much without Bill Russell and Havlicek. Chuck Daly wouldn't be much without Bill Lambier, Isaiah Thomas and the microwave. Pat Riley wouldn't be much without Magic Johnson, Wilt, Kareem or Worthy. I'm not saying Doc Rivers deserves to be in the same breath as those other coaching greats, but the Celtics are banged up, if Kevin Garnett were healthy they would probably be a favorite to win the NBA title. Is Mike Brown a good coach? Or does he just benefit from having the best basketball player on the planet on his team? I'll go with the second option You have to have good players to win in the NBA. It isn't like the college game when you can just coach a team up and win simply on coaching ability. I'm sorry, but the better team with the better players usually beats a team with a great strategist and average players.
May 13, 200917 yr Dwight Howard agrees that Stan VanGundy cannot coach as well! Dwight Howard needs to quit letting Perkins push him away from the basket shooting running lefty hooks that miss every time.
May 13, 200917 yr Stan Van Gundy, perrenial under-achiever, When your best player calls you out for your substitution patterns, it's an issue.
May 13, 200917 yr I think Doc gets some credit for molding the personalities together. The problem w/the argument that Doc Rivers cannot coach w/out that gathered talent is that the very same could be said for Phil Jackson. He won w/Michael & Scottie, he won w/Shaq & Kobe!!! I would say that would be pretty easy to do as well, coach the absolute best players in the game! Come on, let's not underestimate how important the molding and handling of these men w/huge and out-spoken personalities is, by these coaches.
May 13, 200917 yr I think Doc gets some credit for molding the personalities together. The problem w/the argument that Doc Rivers cannot coach w/out that gathered talent is that the very same could be said for Phil Jackson. He won w/Michael & Scottie, he won w/Shaq & Kobe!!! I would say that would be pretty easy to do as well, coach the absolute best players in the game! Come on, let's not underestimate how important the molding and handling of these men w/huge and out-spoken personalities is, by these coaches. It is huge! All the great coaches are able to massage the egos of these guys. Let us not forget, before Jackson got to LA, the same group was unable to win with Dale Harris. Doug Collins was not able win it all with Jordan. Jackson has also been able to get a lot more out of marginal players like Odom, Shannon Brown, Luc Lonley, etc. Heck, even Kwami Brown had a little success under Jackson. Phil Jackson, imo, is the greatest manager of talent in the history of sports.
May 13, 200917 yr I think Doc gets some credit for molding the personalities together. The problem w/the argument that Doc Rivers cannot coach w/out that gathered talent is that the very same could be said for Phil Jackson. He won w/Michael & Scottie, he won w/Shaq & Kobe!!! I would say that would be pretty easy to do as well, coach the absolute best players in the game! Come on, let's not underestimate how important the molding and handling of these men w/huge and out-spoken personalities is, by these coaches. Doc should get more credit than Phil, IMO. Phil has coached some great teams, he just sits back and lets them play. He is more of a baby sitter than a coach. I don't know if you can call some one who has coached teams to 9 titles pathetic, but I will. He does nothing. Doc at least coaches some. He may not be the best in the league, but he's not the worst either.
May 13, 200917 yr It is huge! All the great coaches are able to massage the egos of these guys. Let us not forget, before Jackson got to LA, the same group was unable to win with Dale Harris. Doug Collins was not able win it all with Jordan. Jackson has also been able to get a lot more out of marginal players like Odom, Shannon Brown, Luc Lonley, etc. Heck, even Kwami Brown had a little success under Jackson. Phil Jackson, imo, is the greatest manager of talent in the history of sports. I have to disagree. His teams always end up in messy break ups. The '98 Bulls were all out of there as soon as the championship was over. They were done. I know Jordan was retiring, but what about everyone else? Shaq and Kobe. 3 titles and followed by a season full of temper tantrums. Phil doesn't do anything. He's just a hippie on the bench tagging along for wins and titles.
May 13, 200917 yr I do not dis-credit Phil any at all, he is a great handler/coach! There is just so much more then just X's and O's in coaching the game of basketball, especially at the professional level!
May 14, 200917 yr I'd have to disagree about the Phil Jackson comments. His 9 titles are tied with Auerbach for the most ever by an NBA coach. I don't know of any other criteria to measure how good a coach is. His players are important, but winning with these players is equally important and no one has done that better than Phil. You have to remember, Michael Jordan was in Chicago before Phil and went through 3 or 4 coaches before they struck gold with Phil Jackson. Shaquille O'Neal has only won titles with Phil Jackson and Pat Riley at the helm. I know Phil has had "superior" talent, but he won with that talent also. Question.... If Phil wins with Kobe this year and gets ring number 10, will you still not give him credit for his success and will he still be a "baby-sitter" of superior talent?
May 14, 200917 yr I'd have to disagree about the Phil Jackson comments. His 9 titles are tied with Auerbach for the most ever by an NBA coach. I don't know of any other criteria to measure how good a coach is. His players are important, but winning with these players is equally important and no one has done that better than Phil. You have to remember, Michael Jordan was in Chicago before Phil and went through 3 or 4 coaches before they struck gold with Phil Jackson. Shaquille O'Neal has only won titles with Phil Jackson and Pat Riley at the helm. I know Phil has had "superior" talent, but he won with that talent also. Question.... If Phil wins with Kobe this year and gets ring number 10, will you still not give him credit for his success and will he still be a "baby-sitter" of superior talent? Yes. I will. No one had won a title with Chicago because of the Boston teams of the 80's and Piston teams of the late 80's. Chicago didn't have all the pieces around Jordan yet and no one would have "sat" and watched them go to the title. His Laker teams had Shaq in his prime, and Kobe had became a star at that point. With the exception of possibly '91, his teams were suppose to win the title, and all his teams were the most talented teams playing. You, me, my mother, anyone could have won 7 of his 9 titles. ANYONE.
May 14, 200917 yr Yes. I will. No one had won a title with Chicago because of the Boston teams of the 80's and Piston teams of the late 80's. Chicago didn't have all the pieces around Jordan yet and no one would have "sat" and watched them go to the title. His Laker teams had Shaq in his prime, and Kobe had became a star at that point. With the exception of possibly '91, his teams were suppose to win the title, and all his teams were the most talented teams playing. You, me, my mother, anyone could have won 7 of his 9 titles. ANYONE. I can agree with that, because if I was coaching the Lakers, Kobe and Shaq would have never split up. We'd have 8 titles by now. Word up......:thumb:
May 14, 200917 yr I can agree with that, because if I was coaching the Lakers, Kobe and Shaq would have never split up. We'd have 8 titles by now. Word up......:thumb: No doubt.
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