Not everyone in America celebrated Easter. Muslims, Jews, etc, did not.

 

Do Muslims observe Passover like the Jews?

No, that's not totally true either. Patrick Henry was also a deist if I recall correctly. Thomas Paine was an atheist.

 

Today, many Evangelicals cite the Founding Father's as thinking as they did in terms of their faith convictions. But the reality is many were of a faith practice that did not believe in the ever popular "regeneration events" that Evangelicals espouse today.

 

Christian thought was indeed behind many actions but not any more so than the enlightenment influence that led them to remove religion as a test for office in the government.

 

"no religious test shall ever be required as a qualification to any office or public trust under the United States." (Article 6, section 3)

 

Paine nor Henry participated in any part of the Constitutional Convention of 1787 and neither were involved in the Declaration of Independence, so I'm not really sure they were really the founding fathers to discuss in this conversation.

Do Muslims observe Passover like the Jews?

 

 

No. Their holiest season is Ramadan (sp?). That, I beleive is in the late fall time.

That's the biggest lie every told, one was (Jefferson) and one was an atheist (Franklin).

 

However, most of them carried the same views held today.

Arguably the two best.

No. Their holiest season is Ramadan (sp?). That, I beleive is in the late fall time.

The Islamic calendar is very different from ours. It actually changes through the years. It starts in late summer this year.

Not everyone in America celebrated Easter. Muslims, Jews, etc, did not.

And many more celebrate a very secular Easter totally disregarding the Christian holiday.

Arguably the two best.

 

Arguably, I don't deny that in the least but there are plenty of others to choose from. Also neither of them were very good family men, so I don't hold them in the best light. We all know about Jefferson's escapades with Ms. Sally, but most don't know that Franklin's son was arrested for being a loyalist and Franklin did not visit him once in jail until the day he died, I would hate to think there is anything I could do that would make my father not love me anymore.

Paine nor Henry participated in any part of the Constitutional Convention of 1787 and neither were involved in the Declaration of Independence, so I'm not really sure they were really the founding fathers to discuss in this conversation.

 

Paine's voice was the one of herald and whose pamphlet saved the morale of the revolution when it was needed most.

 

Patrick Henry was Governor I believe in Virginia during the time you mentioned and likewise placed his head in the noose early for American liberty.

 

After the Revolution, Henry again served as governor of Virginia from 1784 to 1786, but declined to attend the Constitutional Convention of 1787 saying that he "smelt a rat in Philadelphia, tending toward the monarchy." An ardent supporter of state rights, Henry was an outspoken critic of the United States Constitution and led the Virginia opposition to its ratification arguing that it gave the federal government too much power and that the untested office of the presidency could devolve into a monarch. As a leading Antifederalist, he was instrumental in forcing the adoption of the Bill of Rights to amend the new Constitution and became a leading opponent of James Madison. President George Washington offered him the post of Secretary of State in 1795, which he declined out of opposition to Washington's Federalist policies.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patrick_Henry

 

It's kind of like saying, "Well Stephen F. Austin had nothing to do with the formation of the Texas Republic because he was afterall, locked up in a Mexican prison during the Revolution." Anyone knows his influence was on their Struggle and Constitution without him. :thumb:

 

 

Truth is that Jefferson, Adams and Franklin were present for the Declaration's drafting, but not Madison or Washington. By the time of the Constiutional Conventions Jefferson was not present and neither was John Adams. The "Founding Fathers" were an amalgamation of differing thoughts, ideas and personalities that ranged prior to the Revolution and post Constitutional periods. To limit them to the framers of a Declaration and the Constitution is to not see the powerful influences surrounding both events.

Arguably, I don't deny that in the least but there are plenty of others to choose from. Also neither of them were very good family men, so I don't hold them in the best light. We all know about Jefferson's escapades with Ms. Sally, but most don't know that Franklin's son was arrested for being a loyalist and Franklin did not visit him once in jail until the day he died, I would hate to think there is anything I could do that would make my father not love me anymore.

 

 

Not that I'm a supporter of philanderer's, but I think it's shortsighted to judge the value of people's influence on the shaping of our country on their personal lives. It's a conundrum, because we all want to believe that people who make good personal decisions would be the best to make decisions in government. But, in some way, it seems that many amoral men (and women) actually make the best leaders and have the best historical influences. Maybe it's their ability to detach themselves and look objectively at a challenge.

The whole deal with this thing to me is this. Why is our president so quick to say we are NOT a Christian nation and just as quick to say what other religions we ARE. In my opinion (I hope you make it yours) our president has no business making these types of statements. We need not make unwarranted excuses/apologies for our country and quite frankly I'm sick of BHO speaking for me.

 

BHO has completely cut the 50 or 60 million citizens that voted against him loose. To me, that speaks volumes.

The whole deal with this thing to me is this. Why is our president so quick to say we are NOT a Christian nation and just as quick to say what other religions we ARE. In my opinion (I hope you make it yours) our president has no business making these types of statements. We need not make unwarranted excuses/apologies for our country and quite frankly I'm sick of BHO speaking for me.

 

BHO has completely cut the 50 or 60 million citizens that voted against him loose. To me, that speaks volumes.

 

 

I don't think making statements equates to aplogies or excuses. Acknowledging issues, facts, etc, is not aplogizing. How has he cut the citizens who voted against him loose?:confused:

That's the biggest lie every told, one was (Jefferson) and one was an atheist (Franklin).

 

However, most of them carried the same views held today.

 

If we took your info as fact, that is still two of the most noteable founding fathers we have. Biggest lie ever told? You dont want to go there.

I don't think making statements equates to aplogies or excuses. Acknowledging issues, facts, etc, is not aplogizing. How has he cut the citizens who voted against him loose?:confused:

 

 

Many of the citizens that voted against BHO are made up of conservatives democrats and republicans that lean to the right (so to speak) and still believe in capitalism and fiscal responsibility. His words and actions show us no support. Maybe I shouldn't say "no" support...I'm sure someone on this board will come up with a crumb somewhere.

I don't think making statements equates to aplogies or excuses. Acknowledging issues, facts, etc, is not aplogizing. How has he cut the citizens who voted against him loose?:confused:

 

Why acknowledge a fact (if not asked) unless you feel you must for some reason.:confused:

 

In other words. If it's so cut and dry that the US is not a Christian nation...Why say it? Sounds defensive to me. Sorry I feel this way and you can be assured I'm not alone.

The whole deal with this thing to me is this. Why is our president so quick to say we are NOT a Christian nation and just as quick to say what other religions we ARE. In my opinion (I hope you make it yours) our president has no business making these types of statements. We need not make unwarranted excuses/apologies for our country and quite frankly I'm sick of BHO speaking for me.

 

BHO has completely cut the 50 or 60 million citizens that voted against him loose. To me, that speaks volumes.

 

:thumb:

 

Im sure that many agree with this analogy.