December 2, 200817 yr Ricky Henderson and Vince Coleman are the reason you see pitchers using slide steps these days, which has cut down on lofty stolen base totals in current times.
December 2, 200817 yr Here are some other bits of information, on Henderson. 4th - All time in Games Played 10th - All time in At-Bats 20th - All time in Hits 2nd - All time in Walks (behind Bonds) 81 - HR's to Leadoff (MLB record) 130 - SB's in one Season (MLB record) What are the thoughts on McGwire making it? I think McGwire should be in on the first ballot. As for Henderson, he has some amazing numbers. I don't see how you could make any kind of argument to keep him out of the hall based on what he did on the field. He was one of the all-time greats, and undoubtedly the best leadoff hitter ever. What do you want from a leadoff hitter? -Get on base? Check. (2nd all-time in walk, .401 OBP) -Hit for power? Check. 297 HR -Stolen bases? Check. -Score runs? 2295 runs scored. He was the perfect leadoff hitter. Great, great player in his prime.
December 2, 200817 yr Author I think McGwire should be in on the first ballot. As for Henderson, he has some amazing numbers. I don't see how you could make any kind of argument to keep him out of the hall based on what he did on the field. He was one of the all-time greats, and undoubtedly the best leadoff hitter ever. What do you want from a leadoff hitter? -Get on base? Check. (2nd all-time in walk, .401 OBP) -Hit for power? Check. 297 HR -Stolen bases? Check. -Score runs? 2295 runs scored. He was the perfect leadoff hitter. Great, great player in his prime. Here are some McGwire stats.... 583 - HR's 1,414 - RBI's 1,626 - Hits 1,167 - Runs 252 - 2B's 1,317 - BB's 1,596 - K's .394 - OBP% .588 - SLG% 12 time - All Star 3 - Silver Slugger '87 - Rookie of Year Did we embrace this guy, as being a HOF player, because of his strength and power, in hitting HR's. Do the about stats, qualify him or does the HR's alone, get him in?
December 2, 200817 yr Well I'll list some of the best (IMO) with their total bases listed as well. Willie Mays- 6,066 (275 TB/year) Ted Williams- 4,884 (while missing 4 seasons in the prime may I remind you) (257 TB/year) Stan Musial- 6,134 (278 TB/year) Hank Aaron- 6,856 (298 TB/year) Carl Yastremski- 5,539 (240 TB/year) Those are just a few that I would say are the best of all-time. Heres a few others: Ken Griffey Jr.- 5,092 (254 TB/year) Andre Dawson- 4,787 (227 TB/year) Gary Sheffield- 4,616 (219 TB/year) Craig Biggio- 4,711 (235 TB/year) And then theres Rickey: Rickey Henderon- 4,588 (183 TB/year) Just pointing out that his Total Bases are not as shocking as one may seem? Henderson also played well past his prime which would severely hurt his per season average. Switch that to TB/162 games played... Henderson checks in at 241. Also, walks don't count, but if you add that in...you're looking at 356 per 162 games. Also, SB don't factor in, but they are basically the same thing...advancing a base. Add his number of 74 (73.9 to be exact) and you get... Combined, TB, BB's and SB's...Henderson accounted for 430 per 162 games. Obviously, the other guys #'s go up as well, but I imagine the rankings would look much different.
December 2, 200817 yr Did we embrace this guy, as being a HOF player, because of his strength and power, in hitting HR's. Do the about stats, qualify him or does the HR's alone, get him in? Approaching 600 HRs would get you in. However, I bet he doesn't get 33% of the votes.
December 2, 200817 yr Here are some McGwire stats.... 583 - HR's 1,414 - RBI's 1,626 - Hits 1,167 - Runs 252 - 2B's 1,317 - BB's 1,596 - K's .394 - OBP% .588 - SLG% 12 time - All Star 3 - Silver Slugger '87 - Rookie of Year Did we embrace this guy, as being a HOF player, because of his strength and power, in hitting HR's. Do the about stats, qualify him or does the HR's alone, get him in? That and the fact of his star power and name recognition. While he's not on par with some of the names bugatti mentioned, like Mays, Ruth, etc..."Mark McGwire" is still a name people recognize. I understand the argument against him. But, I'd vote him in if it were up to me.
December 2, 200817 yr Author Approaching 600 HRs would get you in. However, I bet he doesn't get 33% of the votes. Do you think, we ever hear from him publicly, if after a few years, he doesn't have the HOF votes to get in. I can see the voters, making an example of McGwire and possibly, letting others who will follow know, they have to be accountable and forthright. It will be interesting to see.
December 2, 200817 yr Do you think, we ever hear from him publicly, if after a few years, he doesn't have the HOF votes to get in. I can see the voters, making an example of McGwire and possibly, letting others who will follow know, they have to be accountable and forthright. It will be interesting to see. Big Mac has gone Greta Garbo on us for a while. I don't see that changing.
December 2, 200817 yr Author Big Mac has gone Greta Garbo on us for a while. I don't see that changing.I agree and made me wonder, if he'll go public at some point, if lacking votes to get in.
December 3, 200817 yr Ricky is a "shoe-in" for HOF. I think he also introduces himself prior to his acceptance speech as well
December 3, 200817 yr In case anyone missed, here's the complete List of Players on the Ballot.... Harold Baines, Jay Bell, Bert Blyleven, David Cone, Andre Dawson, Ron Gant, Mark Grace, Rickey Henderson, Tommy John, Don Mattingly, Mark McGwire, Jack Morris, Dale Murphy, Jesse Orosco, Dave Parker, Dan Plesac, Tim Raines, Jim Rice, Lee Smith, Alan Trammell, Greg Vaughn, Mo Vaughn, Matt Williams. What say you, on these names? Alright, the only people on that list I would call Hall of Famers (and why): - Rickey Henderson - definately the "steal" of this class :thumb: - Mark McGwire - not breaking the rules if there weren't rules to be breaking - Lee Smith - one of the greatest closers of all times - Jim Rice - grew up watching him and just some great memories - Dale Murphy - Mr. Brave - Alan Trammell - great career numbers and great guy - Don Mattingly - great numbers and another great guy for baseball - Andre Dawson - may not have the numbers, but another favorite of mine growing up
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