Seven of the 43 presidents have died in office. Not exactly rare. An eighth would likely be replaced under current law due to incapacity (Wilson). The heartbeat away argument is quite valid, especially with the oldest man ever elected.

 

OK TA, let's take a look at the 8 that died in office:

 

Harrison Died 1841 of pneumonia

Taylor Died 1850 of gastroenteritis

Lincold Died in 1865 by assassination

Garfield Died in 1881 by assassination

McKinley Died in 1901 by assassination

Harding Died in 1923 of heart attack

FDR Died in 1945 of cerebral hemorrhage

JFK Died in 1963 by assassination.

 

Of the 8, 4 were assassinated and their deaths had zero to do with their physical condition. The 4 that did die in office due to health reasons died so long ago, before the medical arts progressed to any where near the advanced state of today, that one could logically argue that if they had been alive today, they would have not died because of much better health care available to them.

 

Since the "issue" here involves McCain's ability to survive his first term because of health related issues, your citation of the fact that 7 (its actually 8 I believe) of the 43 Presidents died in office either is intended to be misleading for partisan, political reasons or wasn't thought out very well. I don't know you so I won't venture a guess as to which one is accurate.

 

What I do know is that we haven't had a President die in office for health related reasons since FDR in 45; that the practice of medicine has progressed to an amazing degree since then; and that McCain is in good physical health. Folks, 72 is not old any more. I know many people that are as sharp a tack at that age. And you can be assured of one thing: the President gets the best medical care in the world.

 

The "heart beat away" argument is a red herring designed to scare people into voting for Obama. And if people really think about it, for despicable reasons Obama is more likely than McCain not to survive his first term. Unfortunately there are a bunch of bigots and racists still in America. In my opinion, Obama is the more likely of the two to not survive his term if elected. And I cringe when I think of the repercussions in this country if Obama gets elected and is assassinated. It will be ugly like we have never seen. For the record, such circumstances are not valid reasons to not vote for Obama as such would be in effect giving into the racists and bigots.

 

If you believe Obama is experienced enough or is smart enough to overcome that inexperience; if you believe in the policies he supported when he was in the Illinois legislature and in the U.S. Senate, then by all means you should vote for him. But lets not try to cloud things by citing illogical concerns about McCain like the "heart beat away" silliness. It greatly takes away from the legitimate reasons why you should support Obama in my opinion :thumb:.

You fall into the same trap that Aces does. I've stated on here that my voting record since I've been 18 has been Republican in the Presidential elections.

 

My task on here is to try to present the other side and expose flawed logic and to expose intentional turning of a blind eye to problems with the Republican side.

 

 

I also think that is interesting.

 

Why isn't your task to expose problems not just with the Republican side, but with the Democratic side? While I realize that we have some rather "aggressive" Republican posters on here, we also have a lot of aggressive Democratic posters that likewise use flawed logic.

 

OK TA, let's take a look at the 8 that died in office:

 

Harrison Died 1841 of pneumonia

Taylor Died 1850 of gastroenteritis

Lincold Died in 1865 by assassination

Garfield Died in 1881 by assassination

McKinley Died in 1901 by assassination

Harding Died in 1923 of heart attack

FDR Died in 1945 of cerebral hemorrhage

JFK Died in 1963 by assassination.

 

Of the 8, 4 were assassinated and their deaths had zero to do with their physical condition. The 4 that did die in office due to health reasons died so long ago, before the medical arts progressed to any where near the advanced state of today, that one could logically argue that if they had been alive today, they would have not died because of much better health care available to them.

 

Since the "issue" here involves McCain's ability to survive his first term because of health related issues, your citation of the fact that 7 (its actually 8 I believe) of the 43 Presidents died in office either is intended to be misleading for partisan, political reasons or wasn't thought out very well. I don't know you so I won't venture a guess as to which one is accurate.

 

What I do know is that we haven't had a President die in office for health related reasons since FDR in 45; that the practice of medicine has progressed to an amazing degree since then; and that McCain is in good physical health. Folks, 72 is not old any more. I know many people that are as sharp a tack at that age. And you can be assured of one thing: the President gets the best medical care in the world.

 

The "heart beat away" argument is a red herring designed to scare people into voting for Obama. And if people really think about it, for despicable reasons Obama is more likely than McCain not to survive his first term. Unfortunately there are a bunch of bigots and racists still in America. In my opinion, Obama is the more likely of the two to not survive his term if elected. And I cringe when I think of the repercussions in this country if Obama gets elected and is assassinated. It will be ugly like we have never seen. For the record, such circumstances are not valid reasons to not vote for Obama as such would be in effect giving into the racists and bigots.

 

If you believe Obama is experienced enough or is smart enough to overcome that inexperience; if you believe in the policies he supported when he was in the Illinois legislature and in the U.S. Senate, then by all means you should vote for him. But lets not try to cloud things by citing illogical concerns about McCain like the "heart beat away" silliness. It greatly takes away from the legitimate reasons why you should support Obama in my opinion :thumb:.

 

You are right. It is eight. I forgot Harding. The fact remains, eight presidents have died in office. and Wilson was incapaciated That makes the choice of a vice-president important. Faced with a big decision, once again, McCain got it wrong. It calls his judgement into question. Concern about his selection of a running mate is not only logical, it is a window into his decision making ability. McCain's is lacking. Let's be clear, I wouldn't have voted for McCain if he had selected a combination of Washington, Jefferson and Lincoln as his running mate, but his selection of Palin shows a serious lack of judgement.

 

You are right. It is eight. I forgot Harding. The fact remains, eight presidents have died in office. and Wilson was incapaciated That makes the choice of a vice-president important. Faced with a big decision, once again, McCain got it wrong. It calls his judgement into question. Concern about his selection of a running mate is not only logical, it is a window into his decision making ability. McCain's is lacking. Let's be clear, I wouldn't have voted for McCain if he had selected a combination of Washington, Jefferson and Lincoln as his running mate, but his selection of Palin shows a serious lack of judgement.

 

That's it? No rebuttal about how long ago it was those 4 died due to health reasons? No rebuttal to my point about the huge difference in the quality of health care now with the quality of health care in 1841, 1850, 1923 and 1945? Just the restatement of in my opinion a meaningless number in a discussion involving the likelihood of the "heart beat away" scenario arising due to McCain's age? The "heart beat away" criticism is simply silly. Yes, its possible that McCain could die in office. Yes its possible that Palin could become our next President. If that happens, I have confidence that a VP with experience in issues missing on Palin's resume will be sworn in. And if that highly unlikely scenario happens, this country will be no worse off than what we'll get if Obama/Biden gets elected. To the extent you are looking at this as a bet, smart betters based their bets on odds driven by likelihoods. And going on past history, it is highly unlikely that McCain will die in office due to health reasons.

 

And if you want to talk about judgment, I'll match up McCain judgment in choosing Palin against Obama's judgment of associating himself with Ayers, Resko and Rev. Wright any time you want to discuss the issue more fully.

 

That's it? No rebuttal about how long ago it was those 4 died due to health reasons? No rebuttal to my point about the huge difference in the quality of health care now with the quality of health care in 1841, 1850, 1923 and 1945? Just the restatement of in my opinion a meaningless number in a discussion involving the likelihood of the "heart beat away" scenario arising due to McCain's age? The "heart beat away" criticism is simply silly. Yes, its possible that McCain could die in office. Yes its possible that Palin could become our next President. If that happens, I have confidence that a VP with experience in issues missing on Palin's resume will be sworn in. And if that highly unlikely scenario happens, this country will be no worse off than what we'll get if Obama/Biden gets elected. To the extent you are looking at this as a bet, smart betters based their bets on odds driven by likelihoods. And going on past history, it is highly unlikely that McCain will die in office due to health reasons.

 

And if you want to talk about judgment, I'll match up McCain judgment in choosing Palin against Obama's judgment of associating himself with Ayers, Resko and Rev. Wright any time you want to discuss the issue more fully.

Biden's judgment has not been much better than Obama's. He fought against Reagan on every front during the Cold War. He advocated partitioning Iraq over the objections of the democratically elected government of Iraq and he opposed the surge that McCain advocated. Experience is not much good if it can be demonstrated that one's experience is making one blunder after another.

 

That's it? No rebuttal about how long ago it was those 4 died due to health reasons? No rebuttal to my point about the huge difference in the quality of health care now with the quality of health care in 1841, 1850, 1923 and 1945? Just the restatement of in my opinion a meaningless number in a discussion involving the likelihood of the "heart beat away" scenario arising due to McCain's age? The "heart beat away" criticism is simply silly. Yes, its possible that McCain could die in office. Yes its possible that Palin could become our next President. If that happens, I have confidence that a VP with experience in issues missing on Palin's resume will be sworn in. And if that highly unlikely scenario happens, this country will be no worse off than what we'll get if Obama/Biden gets elected. To the extent you are looking at this as a bet, smart betters based their bets on odds driven by likelihoods. And going on past history, it is highly unlikely that McCain will die in office due to health reasons.

 

And if you want to talk about judgment, I'll match up McCain judgment in choosing Palin against Obama's judgment of associating himself with Ayers, Resko and Rev. Wright any time you want to discuss the issue more fully.

 

First, of course health care is better and yet, even with improved health care, everyone dies. Second, four presidents have died by assasination. And in my lifetime, two presidents have escaped attempts. There is a very significant chance that ANY president will die in office. That makes the choice of a vice president important. As far as the list of associates, I wasn't aware the Senator Obama had selected any of those people for vice president. Sarah Palin was a gamble, pure and simple. Some gambles pay off. She may, but if the Senator wants to gamble he should go to Vegas and not gamble with the future of the country.

Leatherneck:

 

Why do feel Obama is more likely to be assassinated than McCain?

Leatherneck:

 

Why do feel Obama is more likely to be assassinated than McCain?

 

I'll take the liberty of answering for him. Much progress has been made in race relations, but it only takes one white supremist nut job. Unfortunatly there are still some out there.

How on God's green earth can you theorize "the campaign is desperate" when in some polls McCain is winning? Just stop and think about that for a second.

 

Consider this: Why would McCain take such an extreme risk on an unknown pick if he were leading in the polls? I mean, I thought it would have been Pawlenty because the polls were so close and McCain would go the safe route. Instead, he threw the Hail Mary. It isn't a selection a confident campaign would make.

Consider this: Why would McCain take such an extreme risk on an unknown pick if he were leading in the polls? I mean, I thought it would have been Pawlenty because the polls were so close and McCain would go the safe route. Instead, he threw the Hail Mary. It isn't a selection a confident campaign would make.

When you are confident you have the game won is sometimes when you lose.:cry:

With the other thread going so many different directions, I decided to open a new thread.

 

So I hear that McCain had only met Palin once before naming her his VP pick. Doesn't that scream gimmick?

 

Who cares. I would vote for Castro before Obama.

 

That's it? No rebuttal about how long ago it was those 4 died due to health reasons? No rebuttal to my point about the huge difference in the quality of health care now with the quality of health care in 1841, 1850, 1923 and 1945? Just the restatement of in my opinion a meaningless number in a discussion involving the likelihood of the "heart beat away" scenario arising due to McCain's age? The "heart beat away" criticism is simply silly. Yes, its possible that McCain could die in office. Yes its possible that Palin could become our next President. If that happens, I have confidence that a VP with experience in issues missing on Palin's resume will be sworn in. And if that highly unlikely scenario happens, this country will be no worse off than what we'll get if Obama/Biden gets elected. To the extent you are looking at this as a bet, smart betters based their bets on odds driven by likelihoods. And going on past history, it is highly unlikely that McCain will die in office due to health reasons.

 

And if you want to talk about judgment, I'll match up McCain judgment in choosing Palin against Obama's judgment of associating himself with Ayers, Resko and Rev. Wright any time you want to discuss the issue more fully.

 

Why is this silly? Because history says its a longshot? No one can predict the health of McCain or Obama when one of them take the oath of office. Sickness can just hit anyone at anytime. One of the major reasons to pick a VP is in case that happens.

 

Why is this silly? Because history says its a longshot? No one can predict the health of McCain or Obama when one of them take the oath of office. Sickness can just hit anyone at anytime. One of the major reasons to pick a VP is in case that happens.

 

I'd say its silly to base a Presidential vote on the "heart beat" reason because of the remoteness of probability that it will happen. Do you wear a helmet sitting in your living room because of the possibility that car may slam into your house? I don't because its highly improbable that it will happen. But I will acknowledge that if could happen.

 

And again, given the process of what happens in the event McCain dies, I'd say there is a very high probability that the VP eventually sworn in would have experience and credentials in areas that Palin is lacking. Congress has to approve the VP selected by Palin to fill her spot, and while I sometimes don't have much confidence in Congress, I'd think they'd take make the VP decision very, very seriously. If that was to happen, then would that situation be any different than the slate the Democrats are offering (a President with no significant foreign policy, military and intel experience and a VP with significant experience in those areas)? I don't think so.

 

Thus I default to going with the slate that offers a President with unquestionable experience in the areas that I believe are needed the most in a President at this juncture in our country's history and not worry about the very small probability that he'll die in office. Its happened 8 times. Four were by assassination. Four were for health reasons and the last of those four to occur were over 60 years ago. Given the advanced health care available today (particularly for a President), death due to health reasons is a pretty remote probability in the way I logically look at things.

Consider this: Why would McCain take such an extreme risk on an unknown pick if he were leading in the polls? I mean, I thought it would have been Pawlenty because the polls were so close and McCain would go the safe route. Instead, he threw the Hail Mary. It isn't a selection a confident campaign would make.

 

 

Fair question. Although I don't consider it to be the extreme risk that you must and the talking heads do. I don't consider it a Hail Mary at all. I think it was a very smart and calculated selection. If we want to consider the football analogy and we want to analogize it to throwing a pass, if the strength of your offense is throwing the ball and you are in a close game, do you all of a sudden abandon the pass just because some people think you should run the ball? I don't. She shares a lot of the conservative principles that McCain and R's share, plus she is a DC outsider that probably looks at things a lot more similar to the way the average American looks at them. While you and others may think it a weakness, I like the fact that just a few years ago, she was living in a small Alaskan town dealing with Main Street, not Pennslyvania Avenue, issues affecting small business and average Joes like me (and maybe you).

I'll take the liberty of answering for him. Much progress has been made in race relations, but it only takes one white supremist nut job. Unfortunatly there are still some out there.

 

Thank you and unfortunately correct.